View Poll Results: What to do about the 'Is Shaolin-Do for real?' thread

Voters
57. You may not vote on this poll
  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Merge all S-D threads together so it clears 1000 posts!

    22 38.60%
  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Let all the S-D threads stand independently.

    13 22.81%
  • Keep IS-Dfr locked down. All IS-Dfr posters deserved to be punished.

    5 8.77%
  • Delete them all. Let Yama sort them out.

    17 29.82%
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Thread: Is Shaolin-Do for real?

  1. #15361
    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    UUMMMM no!
    If I wanted to say "all the thousands of practitioners and teachers of this system lack these things" I would have said.... oh I dunno.... something like "all the thousands of practitioners and teachers of this system lack these things".

    What I did say was "Your GM has no honor or integrity."

    You need to start sorting out who said what to you. You are attributing all the criticisms to all of those making criticisms. That's some mental midget sh1t. Sort it out!

    At this point you are choosing to side with somebody who lied to you to get your money. If you have another reason why SKT would lie like that and then only admit it when forced to, I will listen.

    I see red flags all over SD, You have dozens of independent people with varying knowledge of TCMA, yet you still won't concede anything. NADA! That's another red flag. We don't know eachother, none of us are friends, yet we all say the same thing. Another HUGE red flag. Wake up....!!!

    Like I said before, I'm sure there are guys that can fight from SD, and I know there are cats taking authentic TCMA styles that couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag. But why buy an overpriced pellet gun if you can get a AR-15 for half the price? Then atleast you increase the potential for the effort put in. Learning from SD is simply a less efficient way to learn. Your GM lied to you for money, it's probably more expensive than most TCMA schools, some of the teachers are accused sexual predators, the techniques are just taken from wherever and mishmashed together. I can go on, but surely that is enough, is it not?
    Most of your points are good but some of your assumptions are a little off. While I don't think any of these points undercut your bottom line, they might as well be corrected.

    My understanding is that SD is almost always in the competitive range with regard to cost in the given areas where it is taught and that, often, it is on the lower end of the cost range. That is certainly true in the DC area where I train. The only martial arts schools that charge a lower tuition than the SD school here are Judo clubs, which have a history of being very reasonably prices compared to other arts.

    The rest of my observations are contstrained to what's available in the DC area because I just haven't had the opportunity to observe the range of other schools in other regions.

    As for efficiency of training, I have to take some issue with that too becuase I'm not sure that you're getting the AR15 with the TCMA. It really depends on the trianing goals of the individual. If fighting is the answer, I would say that the only gyms in my area that are more efficient than mine are the pure MMA gyms. I don't think any of the traditional Chinese, Korean, or Japaneses schools in my area are focused enough on high intensity training to produce effective fighters. The traditionalists in my area may have good stances and may even throw a good punch or kick but, based on the classes I've watched throughout the area, most would be so winded 1 minute into a match that they'd be done if they hadn't won by then. The grappling gyms are good but, without any stand-up training, I'd say they're more sport-centric than they are combat effective (mostly because of the whole its-bad-to-go-to-the-ground-in-a-bar thing).

    If its forms and being good at forms, you've got a legitmate point. Not only are the SD forms from a suspect source but there are so many of them taught so quickly that its difficult for the average student to do any of them without looking bad and demonstrating relatively poor technique. So, if being good at forms is what you're looking for, I have to agree that SD is not the most efficient way to go about that even if you eventually can do the SD material with appropriate mechanics etc.

    General fitness: the SD school in my area compares more to the MMA gyms cardio output versus the more traditional schools. Workouts in my qwoon are some of the hardest I've experienced since I wrestled in school and, frankly, are only less hard because our classes are either an hour or and hour and a half long (wrestling practice was three hours a pop, five days a week).

    Anyway, as I said, none of this undercuts your bottom line.

    As I type this, I do still attend an SD school. I do this becuase we are geographically isolated from most of the system (there's not another SD school within five hours of us) and, consequently, we can avoid much of the cultish stuff associated with some of the other schools (my belief is that the Soards' group has generated much of the fodder for the cult accusers). My sifu is an abo****ely solid guys and has never knowingly lied to me. He's a tremendous athlete and a tremendous martial artist. I've only met Sin The twice and have not given him any money. I've been pretty insular within the system and, consequently, am happy with the training I've received.

  2. #15362
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Cup View Post
    ON, did you get my PM?
    Yes. Thanks. I responded. I didn't want to publicize your analysis without your permission here but am also interested in JP's view on the subject.

  3. #15363
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Noob View Post
    Yes. Thanks. I responded. I didn't want to publicize your analysis without your permission here but am also interested in JP's view on the subject.
    Gotcha. I appreciate that. I checked my PM's but didn't see any response from you Can you resend?

  4. #15364
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    old noob...

    are you Maiky Tran?
    http://www.dcshaolin.com/news.cfm

    (my belief is that the Soards' group has generated much of the fodder for the cult accusers).
    after watching Soard speaking, i whole heartedly agree with you. that was my first red flag.
    Last edited by hskwarrior; 10-15-2012 at 07:50 AM.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  5. #15365
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    Oh man....

    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    lol... I never did it. But I'm at 986 too. I'm sure it's a mod fukcing with us or some other cat took my idea. Either somebody erased posts or the thread was split up.
    It wasn't us. My guess is someone totally poached your idea, Syn7. When it gets close again, someone email me a complaint and I can lock it down again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    I prolly have at least 5 pages of posts. All the same thing. "what? you're crazy? why defend a liar?"
    "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results."

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    and Gene buys us drinks with those tiny little umbrellas!
    I think you guys need to buy me the drinks. Never mind the umbrellas. You can get me some G Spirits and I like that fresh.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  6. #15366
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    This is such an odd issue

    When my old BSL Sifu, Wing Lam, released BSL and Hung Gar systems on video, that was with the expectation that people would use it. So now, there are countless schools/teachers/practitioners that use that curriculum, some 'officially' acknowledged, but many not. We weren't possessive with the teachings. We let it go. That's basic Buddhism (and Sifu Lam isn't Buddhist). But back to the point, the point of publishing it (in video form) was to share it. And just like you claim with the book, HSK, there are 'tells' in those Wing Lam vids that can distinguish vid students from the real ones. Those weren't actually intentional, as that would be a little psycho if you really think about it. It was more idiosyncrasies with the video platform, or just plain mistakes (we were a grindhouse and turned out several hundred vids in a very short period).

    Nowadays, I hear so often that so much has been lost. With the modern day ease of publishing, I know so many attempting to document forms and systems. That's great. But you can't dis your readers (take it from me, I do it all the time and see where it gets me ).

    If SD poached the form, so what? At least they poached from a decent source. BSL poached forms. Songshan Shaolin poaches forms. I have little issue with that. In this rare case, poaching reduces the endangered.

    I'm so tempted to merge this back into the IS-Dfr just to get it back over the 1K hump again. On the other hand, maybe I'll wait until that's crossed again to do it...
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  7. #15367
    Quote Originally Posted by hskwarrior View Post
    old noob...

    are you Maiky Tran?
    http://www.dcshaolin.com/news.cfm



    after watching Soard speaking, i whole heartedly agree with you. that was my first red flag.
    No. I'm not him but its fairly obvious at this point that I attend his school.
    Last edited by Old Noob; 10-15-2012 at 10:22 AM.

  8. #15368
    Quote Originally Posted by OTD View Post
    ???
    Gene
    Where did hskwarrior's 192 posts go to?
    Checking the thread post count he has only 1?
    Methinks you found it.

  9. #15369
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Cup View Post
    Gotcha. I appreciate that. I checked my PM's but didn't see any response from you Can you resend?
    I think I fixed it. Let me know if you didn't get it.

  10. #15370

    Hsk

    Quote Originally Posted by hskwarrior View Post
    ROTFFLMFAO.......who deleted my pages?
    I know you're having fun but some of the stuff you had up here was helpful to folks. I really meant what I said on the main page about this thread being a good resource for people who are thinking of taking SD. Your research on Jake's version of the form was very good and your remarks had convinced several of us that Sin The likely took the form from DFW's book. That's good information for people to have. So, if its worth more to knock the thread back below a thousand pages (who the hell really cares about that) than it is to have your incisive commentary on there, which might actually help someone, then fun away.

  11. #15371
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    'twasn't us

    Quote Originally Posted by hskwarrior View Post
    ROTFFLMFAO.......who deleted my pages?
    There are two mods who have control of this forum, me and David. The forum keeps a record of mod actions and it's only been me since 12:32, 9th Oct 2012. And I didn't touch HSK's posts here.

    I was initially tempted to merge the PLBU-M thread to get us back to 1K+, but the same deletion could be performed, so perhaps I'll wait on that.

    I must confess - the crossing of 1K+ for IS-Dfr has been much more entertaining than I would have imagined. We should do this for any thread when it crosses 1K, sort of like a hazing.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  12. #15372
    Quote Originally Posted by GeneChing View Post
    There are two mods who have control of this forum, me and David. The forum keeps a record of mod actions and it's only been me since 12:32, 9th Oct 2012. And I didn't touch HSK's posts here.

    I was initially tempted to merge the PLBU-M thread to get us back to 1K+, but the same deletion could be performed, so perhaps I'll wait on that.

    I must confess - the crossing of 1K+ for IS-Dfr has been much more entertaining than I would have imagined. We should do this for any thread when it crosses 1K, sort of like a hazing.
    He deleted his own posts. He's having fun.

  13. #15373

    No need to preach to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by hskwarrior View Post
    i looked at what i wrote and after the total resistance, the finagling, and the thought of dishonest martial artists actually sickens me.

    once everyone in shaolin do admits to the thievery of my lineages 5 animal form and stops giving it a false linkage to the hairy monk/nonmonk.

    i want to say this one last time. not one of you can show me a authentically identical form (or even close to how jakes does it) by another proven school or even shaolin. fuk, show me one single shaolin monk that does this form! don't talk, SHOW ME. if you can't admit it and never again place false stuff over my lineages form. admit to how it was acquired.

    ask yourselves, why sin the is THE only source of information of the hairy monk? why doesn't the shaolin temple admit to this person being an authentic monk, especially since he was such a memorable individual? ask yourselves what shaolin temple is he talking about? research history to see if there was a shaolin temple in southern china even close to the turning of the 10th century or even the decades just before it.

    to conclude, as long as your schools lay claim to my lineages form, i won't be dealing with you till you tell the truth.
    I'm already persuaded that Jake either got the form from DFW's book or from Sin The, who got it from DFW's book. Consequently, I am not actively looking to satisfy your challenge. My point was simply that some non-SDer who is contemplating joining an SD school could have been educated in that decision by SOME of your posts. So the person you hurt by deleting your good posts isn't an SDer but someone who you could have been saving from SD's demonic practices. You dig?

  14. #15374

    odd issue

    I certainly understand letting go. Many people have poached sets from our style. It's part of the game for some.I follow my late Sifu's idea. Bad kung-fu is still good promotion for good kung-fu.
    I still feel that people who poach should give some recognition to whom they poach. I HOPE.

  15. #15375
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    I certainly understand letting go. Many people have poached sets from our style. It's part of the game for some.I follow my late Sifu's idea. Bad kung-fu is still good promotion for good kung-fu.
    I still feel that people who poach should give some recognition to whom they poach. I HOPE.
    my whole point all along
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

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