Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[Shaolindynasty]

With that years’ experience, would you characterize him as "beginner" or "intermediate"? I never trained or fought under SanDa rules. Why no kicks or takedowns? Do you find the rules encourage western boxing techniques over some of the more traditional hand techniques?

The sparring clf vs ving tsun video I provided was not "sanda" rules sparring but rather they were using traditional kungfu techniques specifically clf and vt. I am assuming since I was not present at the filming of this session that they agreed on no takedowns because the mats arent present. As for kicking, i dont know if that was an agreed upon before hand but given the specialty of clf and vt being southern kung fu systems kicking isnt our specialty anyway so you wont see it as often in our sparring.

I tend to not characterize students as beginner advanced etc.

[Judge Pen]

The sparring clf vs ving tsun video I provided was not "sanda" rules sparring but rather they were using traditional kungfu techniques specifically clf and vt. I am assuming since I was not present at the filming of this session that they agreed on no takedowns because the mats arent present. As for kicking, i dont know if that was an agreed upon before hand but given the specialty of clf and vt being southern kung fu systems kicking isnt our specialty anyway so you wont see it as often in our sparring.

I tend to not characterize students as beginner advanced etc.

I understand. I wasn't trying to be critical; I was just trying to get a feel for where they would be in their training and skill and under what rule limitations they were under. You see that "exploratory jab" a lot in sparring even though it's not something you see in forms or drills as often so I was curious about that and the lack of kicks. They are not bad clips, but I didn't expect them to be advanced students from what I saw.

[Old Noob]

Actually there was no free sparring in the video i posted. What you are refering to as free sparring is actually a another drill we do coined "chop choi sparring". This drill is designed as a way to bridge between static and live drilling into free sparring. In that drill we limit the techniques used to chop (see the 10 elements video), rear hand straight(cross) and lam choi which is a swinging punch to the body. Also that video was filmed on one training day and those drill were chosen for that particular session. Many drills we do have an emphasis on contination but that continuation of technique can only be executed if the positioning and timing is correct. Whenever you drill or spar with a person attempting to stop you from gaining position much of the round will be 1 or 2 shots at a time as both parties are attempting to create an opening to find the right position to let combinations loose. We could force the issue and stand toe to toe and trade punches but that would defeat the purpose of this particular exercise. here is footage of the same drill while training at my sifus school with a little higher level of contact and more combos http://youtu.be/syxf4EEAIGE

Which brings me to this



alot of things not correct in this theory you presented. The first and most obvious to me when first reading this is the assumtion that we dont engage in heavy contact free sparring. Anyone who knows me or my sifus school would laugh at this assumption. we have participated regularly since 1999 in full contact sanda competition, we would have started sooner but we didnt have a school before then. In order to be competitiove in sanda you have to spar. Yet I dont expect you to take my word for it so let me provide you with more video footage of some of the free sparring that takes place at my school and my sifus school.

One example here of free sparring we do. The guy with the shirt practices CLF so you can see him demonstrait the concepts in my initial post. No shirt is a Ving Tsun practitioner
http://youtu.be/i6BxUFlx1ZE

round 2
http://youtu.be/SnAdOaCLBQk

In regards to your "awesome body shot" comment

video of me using various training methods to develop my striking, take note that the majority of the punches thrown are body shots during the heavy bag work. Also notice where I carry my hands. When fighting we favor leading with the chop choi by holding the lead hand where I do I can throw the chop without any kind of prep or telegraphing. The rear hand is held high to protect my head. This is the same hand position I used in the other video I posted

http://youtu.be/aytjXyZUb8Q

also here is another video taken at my sifus school of guys training. notice the body shots BTW, this video also has some footage of free sparring

http://youtu.be/7gjGCHY0Svc

btw, notice the use of the clf 10 elements used with boxing gloves on

As a final note I should say that while we occasionally spar full contact for the most part we check our power as frequent full contact sparring can have long lasting detrimental effects. If you want to develop your power hit the bag. Sparring is meant to teach timing, distance, set up etc.

Or you can choose to fight full contact which we do

There are hours of footage proving what we do and the effects of it. Just search Ng family martial arts and our videos pop up whether from my sifus school or affiliates based around chicago and illinois

As you can see with the actual evidence provided that your hypothosis is incorrect

Thank you. Good post. Good points.

[brucereiter]

This contention that there isn’t a single skilled martial artist in SD doesn’t hold water. No video will ever be accepted as proof. Whatever is posted would be instantly criticized as willing opponents, staged, unskilled opponents, etc.

blanket statements are often inaccurate. most of the people who criticize will be anonymous randoms. they frustrate me.

Do those of you who insist no one in SD could possibly fight have some evidence to back that up? Bruce has been all over the world and will “roll” with anyone. There may not be many people here that have worked with Bruce - but there are a lot on RSF. Does someone have a story of easily defeating him?

having the opportunity to compare the methods i was learning in sd with what people from all over the world from various styles first hand was very helpful to my development as a martial artist.

Mike Reid has been teaching down in Atlanta for almost 20 years. Do any of you have a story of being vastly physically superior to him? Keep in mind that both Bruce and Sean are ex-SD guys who have nothing but disdain for Sin The and the lies he told. However, I’ll guess that neither one of them (probably even both at the same time) would think they would last long with Mike Reid.

i have learned quit a lot from mike reid. he was very generous with spending time helping me understand ima. i have nothing but respect for mike reid as a martial artist and as a person. if a person thinks mike reid is not a skilled martial artist and has nothing to offer it is their loss. i dont think he cares and i dont really care.

[tattooedmonk]

That's not how rank works.

When I was in university, I took "Calculus 2". I am not natural math guy. I'm pretty sure I worked harder than the math wiz. I earned a B, the math wiz earned an A. Do you think the professor should have given me an A for my hard work?

Though I didn't receive A, I would say it benefited me much more. The discipline and ethic I developed in that class were much more useful to me in the workplace.

Ranks and grades are meant to be an objective indicator of skill.

Using this same logic ...everyone should fail unless they get A s in school?...most people that take martial arts are at best a "C or " D student....a very small percent get B s and A s in school....most people quit.

Not everyone is going to be a performer fighter or more than a hobbiest at martial arts. Most people do it for social and health reasons and like the idea of learning fighting techniques.

I can guarantee that more than 90% of all the keyboard warriors around here couldn't do much better than the 7 year old yellow belt or the autistic kid thats 15 years old and has black belt.who's mom posted a form on YouTube ...etc

I could go on but I am bored of this thread and non sense

[tattooedmonk]

Personally, I think Garry Mullins is the best martial artist in SD.

Years ago I “rolled” a little bit with Gary Grooms and he was the most explosive person I have ever seen. Even though Grooms could deal with Bruce and most everyone else, he was very clear that he was no match for Garry Mullins.

I will add a plus one here. Don't mess with the Mullins

[tattooedmonk]

That none of these trolls have walked into any CSC / SD school and said or done anything thst they say they would do.....There are locations everywhere, in almost every major state...come on chumps , show SD and the cult followers what's up, f ing douche bags.

[tattooedmonk]

For all of you that sent me requests ....I will start sending those out this weekend. Thanks for all the responses. I can't wait to start talking about the material ....finally.

[pazman]

Using this same logic ...everyone should fail unless they get A s in school?...most people that take martial arts are at best a "C or " D student....a very small percent get B s and A s in school....most people quit.

Not everyone is going to be a performer fighter or more than a hobbiest at martial arts. Most people do it for social and health reasons and like the idea of learning fighting techniques.

I can guarantee that more than 90% of all the keyboard warriors around here couldn't do much better than the 7 year old yellow belt or the autistic kid thats 15 years old and has black belt.who's mom posted a form on YouTube ...etc

I could go on but I am bored of this thread and non sense

I think you misunderstood...ranks are not indicators of hard work, a rank in martial arts denotes some minimal standard which the organization has chosen. I could care less what the organization chooses. "Shodan" denotes that the person is no longer a beginner.

My concern was with the "who deserves it more" thing.

[tattooedmonk]

I think you misunderstood...ranks are not indicators of hard work, a rank in martial arts denotes some minimal standard which the organization has chosen. I could care less what the organization chooses. "Shodan" denotes that the person is no longer a beginner.

My concern was with the "who deserves it more" thing.

Ok, got it. Thanks for clarification. There are standards, very low ones. It keeps the doors open. I think that you can/ do have various grades of lower ranks and black belts....for instance, yellow belt a grade , yellow belt b grade , yellow belt c grade...Most people pay , are taught material, work hard in class, but barely remember from session to session. they keep showing up week after week and month year after year....they pay your rent! you really don't just reward them with rank for time and effort in the martial arts , you are rewarding them for the time and effort outside of class too. That the difference between chain /strip mall schools and small / or fighting schools. Everyone's trying to judge them on qualities these schools and student aren't really getting or really want or need. I don't think these people understand that martial arts now a days is a business first and foremost....as long as you teach the basics of martial arts , show how to apply principles in any given situation, and do your best to provide them with the tools necessary, the rest is up to them.....you can't ask for more than that from the masses.



Sorry everyone...... I am feeling punchy, getting railroaded in a divorce.

[Snipsky]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NC68d1xQEdQ

[Snipsky]

That none of these trolls have walked into any CSC / SD school and said or done anything thst they say they would do.....There are locations everywhere, in almost every major state...come on chumps , show SD and the cult followers what's up, f ing douche bags.

you're doing a lot of talking. i can see you're mad. as you can see, the only ones not upset are the ones who don't practice SD. so far, comparing others to SD, SD is not standing up to the standard of your typical kung fu. i am not impressed at all and would never want to join because of what i see. nothing else.

[tattooedmonk]

you're doing a lot of talking. i can see you're mad. as you can see, the only ones not upset are the ones who don't practice SD. so far, comparing others to SD, SD is not standing up to the standard of your typical kung fu. i am not impressed at all and would never want to join because of what i see. nothing else.

Don't pretend to know me pal. I am pi$$ed, but not about this cr@p. you are right....I plan on going to each of the schools these guys represent and do just that....and not for anything other than to see what you guys are really all about. You can look at my website and tell me what you think. Show up at my door and I call an ambulance and roll your @$$.Btw ...no one has set out to impress you or anyone here.

[Snipsky]

oh ok. hope no one hurts you.

[tattooedmonk]

oh ok. hope no one hurts you.

Wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last ....I am a martial artist, getting hurt does tend to go along with the deal. It's not about winning or proving anything more than being able to walk the walk ....ya know?! I am on friendly terms with many martial artist, some more some less skilled than I am , and I am always up for learning something new or a refresher course and I do get schooled daily....it goes along with the life style.