View Poll Results: What to do about the 'Is Shaolin-Do for real?' thread

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  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Merge all S-D threads together so it clears 1000 posts!

    22 38.60%
  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Let all the S-D threads stand independently.

    13 22.81%
  • Keep IS-Dfr locked down. All IS-Dfr posters deserved to be punished.

    5 8.77%
  • Delete them all. Let Yama sort them out.

    17 29.82%
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Thread: Is Shaolin-Do for real?

  1. #166
    The Willow Sword Guest

    replies to BKH and SILUMKID

    BKH: :rolleyes:

    Silum Kid: i know about the tan tui steps and you are right they are the BASICS of the stances kicks, stretches,hand combinations etc. And i know about all that showey stuff that "looks"like it is not useful. weve all heard the "story" the shaolin masters would hide the "REAL techniques within the form in order to protect the "REAL"techniques from being stolen from spies and hidden onlookers. you know i think that is a bunch of BS. why do movements that have no purpose in fighting whatso ever? you just proved my point about watching dance and performance wushu. and since i know how to spot the hidden techniques in forms that i have seen. there is a lot of brain transitioning to defilter what you have been taught and then get the "real" technique that the master did not show you. which is crap to me for it is useless to do routines that go nowhere and movements that have no purpose to them but to only entertain and look good to the eye....you know hsingi doesnt look good to watch at all,,in fact its boring,, but you get to see the direct fighting maneuvers and techniques. In a COMBAT FORM,,you are learning the combat applications for you are doing the form as a COMBAT technique,,not a prancy dance. you know how many people out there do dancey forms and think that it helps them in a fight and you see them get floored,,i have all too many times.....the true way that the fighting arts of shaolin present themselves is that of a SURVIVAL and COMBAT ORIENTED FORM. which YES it looks more like a karate form than a dancey prancey performance form....maybe that is why what you guys ,especially BKH,,sees is what you believe to be karate when in fact what tyou are seeing are COMBAT FORMS with the principles of FIGHTING in them,,,they dont look as pretty as your form but we are not interested in looks, robes ,,shaved heads,,grandious halls of incense and mantras,,whereas some of us retain zen buddhist and taoist philosophies,,we are still there to learn how to PROTECT OURSELVES and preserve an ANCIENT SYSTEM that has been tainted by communist
    tyranny and made to be an amusement for grandious fantasy based individuals.....and you know,,even if our system was a karate system which it is not,,,i would rather have that than be subjected to flowery,,prancy dancey routines that look good on the movie screen and make the communists more money and that do you no good in real self defense and fighting.
    when i saw illusionfist do his hung gar you know what i saw???? a FIGHTING FORM AND a FIGHTING SYSTEM<<< i wonder what REEMUL is going to show when he shows up. hopefully not a rare form of communist wushu that they threw out due to its ineffectiveness to impress the eye. rare northern shaolin kitty kat. hmm i wonder,,,is this form from the northern part of the eastern most corner of the west half of south china?????? :eek:

    Many respects,,Willow sword.

    Whatever you think i am or want me to be,,, i am.
    oh and,,,Jesus loves you, everyone else thinks you are an a$.

  2. #167
    reemul Guest

    To TWS:

    Actually our System left China during the PRC takeover. You would have caught that if you were paying attention. At that time the PRC was trying to destroy the Shaolin systems not preserve them or create a tourist trap capitalizing off the name.(<-read slowly maybe you will comprehend what was said). Any demo I do will be after the fight.

    On the subject of Contemporary Wushu, It is no secrete that contemporary Wushu is filled with unpractical maneuvers and acrobatics, but to say they are incapable of fighting is ignorant. Specifically Wuhsu athletes in China are in extreme physical condition and on average could put an ass whoopin on most SD students.

    Classical Shaolin kungfu does not look anything like karate. In order to be a good fighter you must posses balance, coordination, flexibility, an understanding of body mechanics, combative application and the ability to improve technique. Shaolin forms consist of all these attributes, and some are simply symbolic.

    As for what to expect from me, you claim you know what it is that I do. However if you had spent anytime at our school I would know it, our school is not that big, So it is clear to me that you don't know about our school.

    My teacher also asked me to establish that there will be no judges at our meeting, "We are judged only by our peers, those that workout with us..".
    also the match is to consist of 2 min rounds or one continuous round of full contact until someone is unable to continue or refuses to continue, as was done in the old day.

  3. #168
    BeiKongHui Guest
    Note how the SD cultist can find a way to justify anything.

    I have learned silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet, strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers.
    --Khalil Gibran

  4. #169
    Radhnoti Guest
    Note how people that don't like what an SD practicioner has to say refers to them as a "cultist".

    "That government is best which governs least." -- HENRY DAVID THOREAU

  5. #170
    Fish of Fury Guest

    TWS and Rad

    thanks for the replies.
    as i've said before, all i know about SD is what i read on these boards, so i'm not going to judge it.
    i'm content that the style i practise now is excellent, and i hope everyone else is equally satisfied with what they do.
    i personally spent several years in a dodgy taichi school, but i don't think that makes me a bad person, and i still got some benefit out of my time there...so even IF (i'm not assuming) SD leaves something to be desired, it doesn't mean you can't progress.

    from your replies you both seem to be dedicated martial artists, so if you enjoy SD, good luck to you.

    __________________________________________________ _________________________ "I'm just trying to lull you into a genuine sense of security!"

  6. #171
    Radhnoti Guest
    Thanks Fish.

    "That government is best which governs least." -- HENRY DAVID THOREAU

  7. #172
    Shaolindynasty Guest
    note: For all you who don't like shaolin do and keep posting on it, you have succeeded in making it an extremely popular system. Just shut all this up your "fight" isn't for like two months right? So can we have at least one week where this crap isn't at the top? All this arguing isn't going to change anything and the fight isn't going to change anything give it up guys.
    (**** I just bumped this to the top, Doh)

    New classes New online Catalog
    www.shaolindynasty.cjb.net

  8. #173
    BeiKongHui Guest
    I have no problem with all the attention SD gets because of this thread. Expose the Golden ****roaches to the light long enough and they'll eventually scurry away. If this thread has stopped one person from wasting their time then it was worth it wasn't it?

    Rad- I refer to you guys as cultists because like anyone who has based their existance on faith alone you all refuse to answer direct questions or accept evidence that might shatter what you believe is truth. SD people like to talk a good game but when you get right down to it none of you cares about the truth if you did you could find it quite easily. All anyone with an iota of common sense, knowledge of MA's and/or Chinese history has to do is read the hilarous book Sin The' put out. The lies and misinformation is so easy to spot I wonder how anyone that reads it could ever take it seriously. Also, being unfortunate enough to live in the place the whole SD mess came from, I have seen and heard time and time again the sad stories of former SD students. It's a pattern, one which TWS seems to be falling into: 1)Denial of problem 2)Anger (usually accompanied by a challenge or some such BS) 3)Realization 4)Disillusionment 5)Either drops out of MA completely or realizes the need to start all over.

    I have learned silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet, strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers.
    --Khalil Gibran

  9. #174
    Radhnoti Guest
    BKH, I've done my best to answer every question anyone's put up about SD. I've not accepted anything on faith, I've just not accepted everything YOU say on faith and that's what seems to aggrevate you. I've lived in KY my whole life too and I know lots of old time GM Sin students, all of whom (that I've met) enjoyed SD and respect GM Sin.
    Golden ****roaches exposed to the light? That was pretty clever, point to you. :)
    I have noticed a pattern, one you seem to be falling into: 1) Hear about SD. 2) Learn about SD, think it's all lies. 3) Post all you can about how it's all lies. 4) Lose interest in fighting with SD students. 5) Decide you were wrong and become SD's greatest ally, singing the praises of GM Sin to all who'll listen.
    Um...ok, so maybe it's not exactly a PATTERN...but it's as relevant and possible as BKH's "pattern".
    :D

  10. #175
    BeiKongHui Guest
    Rad-

    Look around carefully.........
    Do you see a small midget in a white suit calling out "the plane! the plane!"?

    You must because you seem to be marooned on Fantasy Island.

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Um...ok, so maybe it's not exactly a PATTERN...but it's as relevant and possible as BKH's "pattern". [/quote]

    The only difference being that mine is based in reality where as yours is more of the "I know you are but what am I..." type arguments you seem to use.


    I have learned silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet, strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers.
    --Khalil Gibran

  11. #176
    Fu-Pow Guest
    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>. In a COMBAT FORM,,you are learning the combat applications for you are doing the form as a COMBAT technique,,not a prancy dance. you know how many people out there do dancey forms and think that it helps them in a fight and you see them get floored,,i have all too many times.....the true way that the fighting arts of shaolin present themselves is that of a SURVIVAL and COMBAT ORIENTED FORM. which YES it looks more like a karate form than a dancey prancey performance form....maybe that is why what you guys ,especially BKH,,sees is what you believe to be karate when in fact what tyou are seeing are COMBAT FORMS with the principles of FIGHTING in them, [/quote]


    In truth there are many CMA techniques who's application is not obvious and you must understand the subtleties of the movement before you can apply them. Karate and Hung Gar are two styles that intitially rely on muscular power. There application is more obvious than say something like Taiji which relies very little on muscular power. Simply because you can "see" the power generation. However, at the higher levels of development most "hard" arts become soft and evasive. And most "soft" arts show there external power. As Dr. Yang Jwing Ming stated in his article on Cyberkwoon : Hard arts are like a staff, Softhard arts are like rattan and soft arts are like a whip. The point is that there is no geniune art which is hard and inflexible.

    To me a lot of the Shaolin-do techniques look like they are on the "Staff" end of the spectrum. Even a bit stiffer. This is more indicative of Japanese styles than Chinese styles which usually lie on the "Soft Hard" to "Soft" end of the spectrum. This makes me think that Shaolin-Do has little to do with CMA and a lot to do with JMA.

    Peace

    Fu-Pow



    "Choy Lay Fut Kung Fu does not encourage its students to abuse or harm others with no reason. Nevertheless, in times when Kung Fu must be performed, Choy Lay Fut requires the student to change from a gentleman into a fierce and cold fighter."

    -Lee Koon Hung,
    CLF:The Dynamic Art of Fighting

  12. #177
    BeiKongHui Guest
    Combat forms, huh? You just keep telling yourself that. Of course it makes you look like a total dolt to any CMA practioners who read what you have to say but that's your right.

    I have learned silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet, strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers.
    --Khalil Gibran

  13. #178
    Silumkid Guest
    Hi Willow Sword (is that from Fearless Hyena by the way? Great movie!),

    Glad we are in agreement somewhat, but I disagree about the movements of forms being "BS"...most schools that do forms that I know of claim the same thing. There is a saying that goes "Every movement has 1,000 uses". In my opinion, this is the first key to true mastery. If you can take one movement and think of even 10 ways to apply it, then you are on the right path. I don't think it is brain transitioning, it is creativity training. And in "live" combat, your ability to adapt can be the difference between a win and a loss.

    There is another saying that goes "The basics are the top, the top are the basics". This is another example of correct forms training. If your basics aren't solid, then all the jump spin kicks and neat technique names won't do one any good. To say the practice of Tan Tui is "dancy, useless stuff" is odd to me....it's like saying "I won't do push-ups and pull-ups or weight training because those movements aren't combat related". Your weakest attribute is what often leads to defeat.

    Amitabha!

    We are trained in wushu; we must protect the Temple!

  14. #179
    illusionfist Guest
    I personally know tan tui, and i can honestly say that its not useless. Its a friggin kicking science, hehe :)

    Peace :D

  15. #180
    The Willow Sword Guest

    Silumkid

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHA yes it is in fact..... i didnt really conciously think about that movie when gave myself the name but i do have that movie in my collection,,,,,i now remember the scene where the willow sword challenges jacky" i am the willow sword" jacky;" what? the sh1t sword?"
    willow sword"arrrghhhhh" and the fight begins.

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
    well i m afar from the character in that movie but i can laugh at myself in this instance,,,,,,check out another one of jackys greatest:" Snake and Crane arts of Shaolin" i have the platinum remastered version which elaborates on the fight at the end. scenes were put back in. any way YOU GOT ME heheheheheh.
    Many respects to you Silumkid.
    The sh... Willow Sword. :p

    Whatever you think i am or want me to be,,, i am.
    oh and,,,Jesus loves you, everyone else thinks you are an a$.

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