Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[tattooedmonk]

I couldnt have said it better myself......

[kwaichang]

Well this is all interesting. I am a upper ranked SD practitioner and have wanted to open a school in Tennessee for about 4 years but Master Mullins has nixed this . So does this mean i cant open a school anywhere in the us now except Texas or maybe Kentucky ?? Or will i end up being kicked out of Sd if i do because I have hurt someones feelings. What ever happened to training to learn and enjoy the art of MA. This whole thing sickens me the politics of it all. KC

[tattooedmonk]

Well this is all interesting. I am a upper ranked SD practitioner and have wanted to open a school in Tennessee for about 4 years but Master Mullins has nixed this . So does this mean i cant open a school anywhere in the us now except Texas or maybe Kentucky ?? Or will i end up being kicked out of Sd if i do because I have hurt someones feelings. What ever happened to training to learn and enjoy the art of MA. This whole thing sickens me the politics of it all. KC

Hey KC , How you doin??Do you know why?? NO , it doesnt.

[BoulderDawg]

I would like to hear from someone who actually owned one of these Out of state Soard schools. But no drama, just tell us exactly what the terms of the agreement was.

Anyway, aside from the scandal that has recently came up, the Soards have never been known for their bedside manner. I understand over the years they have burned hundreds of bridges including the vast majority of those in Kentucky.

[tattooedmonk]

I would like to hear from someone who actually owned one of these Out of state Soard schools. But no drama, just tell us exactly what the terms of the agreement was.

Anyway, aside from the scandal that has recently came up, the Soards have never been known for their bedside manner. I understand over the years they have burned hundreds of bridges including the vast majority of those in Kentucky.

Call one or any of them . They might tell you they might not.....there are people around that have the real poop on this subject you just have to know who to ask.....

[BoulderDawg]

Call one or any of them . They might tell you they might not.....there are people around that have the real poop on this subject you just have to know who to ask.....

Not that interested. Cold calling is not my style anyway. And, I can't imagine that, given the publicity and all, anyone would tell you anything. They would probably refer you back to the Soards in Boulder.

I do know there was a guy, Jason Carr, in LA who had a falling out with the Soards. Haven't heard the complete story of that but it's my understanding that he wanted to develop a kid's program. Of course the Soards would never have a kids program.

[tattooedmonk]

Not that interested. Cold calling is not my style anyway. And, I can't imagine that, given the publicity and all, anyone would tell you anything. They would probably refer you back to the Soards in Boulder.

I do know there was a guy, Jason Carr, in LA who had a falling out with the Soards. Haven't heard the complete story of that but it's my understanding that he wanted to develop a kid's program. Of course the Soards would never have a kids program.

Cool, I understand. Actually I was told a great deal when I asked ......

JC had a falling out for multiple reasons, One was he abused is power. When he came in he wanted everyone to bow down to him. Anyone that didnt, especially black belts , were kicked out.

Its funny because most of us had been doing it for as long as he had.

He hardly ever showed up because he was working on his actng career He threw up in the first outdoor conditioning class , then proceeded to say that he would do it on his own time.

He never fullfilled his requirements yet was allowed to become a AM. Give me break. He kept using the excuse that needed to get back to the school to start brown belt class. All he wanted was to be the so called master of a successful school .

The list goes on and on.

He wouldnt let one of the old black belts test for third after he had already pretested and bought his plane ticket and everything...guess what the Soards did ?? Backed JC decision..WTF??

He was a tool.

He couldnt build up the school in SJ so he quit , he couldnt handle it.

He could nt handle that the CSC Northridge had a tight nit group that stood by each other so he broke it a part and pit different groups against each other. If you wanted to stay you had to kiss his @$$.

He told a female student when she was worked up that she needed to get laid....WTF?

As for the kids class. I originally assisted in the kids class when we were in Chatsworth and then became the co-instructor for the kids class when we moved to Northridge.

We had it for about 2 years until me and DY wanted to make it official. So, we went to GMT to find out how things were set up in the east with the kids class. we got all the info , GMT's approval and of course the Soards said no ...

GMT said he could only do so much because they were their( Soards ) schools.
Which I understand , but why wouldnt anyone want to have a kids class .

In most martial arts schools, kids make up better than 75% of the money that comes in......who doesnt want to make money when they open up a business?

[BoulderDawg]

I never knew Jason. I casually asked several of the senior black belts what happened and they were farily closed mouth about it. I was told that when he left about half the students left with him. Once again pis poor management by Soards/The' to allow the school to get to that point.

I never understood the kids program thing either. However it's pretty obvious that Sharon hates kids with a passion. While I was there they tolerated a few kids in the adult classes but that was about it.

To be honest, there are a hundred things I would have done differently. For one thing there was no quality control and testing got out of hand. It degenerated so much that lower belts weren't truly learning the material before being passed to the next level. I guess that's still going on.

[ittokaos]

C'mon guys let's see if this useless thread can actually make all the way to 1000.

[tattooedmonk]

I never knew Jason. I casually asked several of the senior black belts what happened and they were farily closed mouth about it. I was told that when he left about half the students left with him. Once again pis poor management by Soards/The' to allow the school to get to that point.

I never understood the kids program thing either. However it's pretty obvious that Sharon hates kids with a passion. While I was there they tolerated a few kids in the adult classes but that was about it.

To be honest, there are a hundred things I would have done differently. For one thing there was no quality control and testing got out of hand. It degenerated so much that lower belts weren't truly learning the material before being passed to the next level. I guess that's still going on.

You're better off

I think in a lot of ways GMT is so far removed and doesnt have much / say much when it come to the lower belt testing and the individual business aspects of the schools, etc.


Dude, I have hundreds of ideas myself. I am implementing some of them into my program too!!

Funny thing is that they got at least part of the business model from a friend/ student / investor in the CSCs. He was a guy who owned comedy club or something like that .

How is a comedy club like a martial arts school....?? Oh wait , there is no difference in the CSCs run by the Soards.

LMAO

This is the guy who had all the assistant instructors start paying to be there in addition to paying for their advanced material.

They charged for everything. All seminars all the specialty classes and for advanced material . Shouldnt that be part of your monthly dues??? Why should anyone pay monthly dues and then an additional fee for their advanced material.

I thought that was what the monthly dues were for...... Arent they???

I wonder if any of these sheep ever wondered why every few years there was a drastic loss in enrollment, student retention as well as a new instructor(s).

Shouldnt there have been some warning signs or flags that normally would come up in these types of situations???

Whats more is that every student that stuck by the Soards always thought that it was on those particular teachers or students.....now a few people have wised up......

They now know it is the Soards

Sorry, my Kar-ma ran over your Dog-ma....LMAO

[tattooedmonk]

C'mon guys let's see if this useless thread can actually make all the way to 1000.

We will make it before the end of the year.....

[Facepalm]

Im happy that I got out when I did.

I got to pat myself on the back for a nice accomplishment there getting my BB and all. but really now I look at my time there as a good beginning to my MA education.

I wish I could have gone to one of the east coast schools. Actually the most intriguing model ive heard was from TTM who said he makes students learn all the forms forward and backward, actually does bag work, and teaches students forms at a realistic pace while making sure they understand the usefulness and limitations of the material.

The reason the Soards have it wrong is because they think, and are right in some cases, that people just want to learn alot of forms and have fantasies about how now they are capable of doing the things they see in movies.

While I was there I really tried to keep a realistic attitude about the art. I knew the lineage was mostly drummed up, I knew that the methods of teaching didnt really produce good fighters. I cringed whenever EMD would mention the 1500 year old system and how we all were going to live forever for studying it. But I could see I was benefiting from it as far as my own martial abilities and being able to move and think in new ways.

Also I think BD mentioned it before. The price to go there is significantly less than practically any other place to train in Boulder. $35 a month minumum. I think I was spending about an average of $80-$100 total with monthly fees and festival attendance and equipment purchase. That is nothing compared to what alot of places are charging.

Well, I do hope we get to 1000 pages, this forum is a blast.

KK

Gotta go Muay Thai

[One student]

Here's what smells bad to me about the worst of the rumors being spread:

1. People criticize GMT for not having enough control over CSC/DS and SS schools, and now want to say his involvement is "criminal"?

2. The quote I think was, "victim intimidation." In almost every state there is a law against some form of retaliation or intimidation of a "witness" in a criminal prosecution, but (JP, correct me if I am wrong) almost all require two things: 1) the act of intimidation must be unlawful by itself; and 2) there must not be a legal privilege to do it. For example: I am landlord. Tenant testifies against my brother. Tenant is behind on rent, so I can't threaten to evict him/her? Yes I can, because it is lawful for me to give eviction notice, and I have a right to do it. Being a witness in a criminal case is not a license to get away with something bad as well.

3. So that means unllikely any "crime" could be credibly threatened. GMT apparently (it seems to me) had a lawyer write the letters, or help, and could just as easily told him any "threat" of jail was bogus. So bogus, I doubt it was ever made. What kind of person would you have to be, to tell your only GM, "do X or I'll have you arrested?"

4. So, that leaves, break up of 9 from S's, so no longer, immediately, affiliated with any GMT school. If he doesn't stop it, his copyrights and intellectual property are "diluted" or he can be considered to have waived the right to stop it. He has to do something, immediately, to stop that appearance.

5. But, his beef is not with them, directly. So the door is open to make up. After all, as we know from those who have reviewed the actual patent or copyright application, only certain aspects can be protected. If McDonalds pulls a license/franchise, they can still sell hamburgers -- just not the same one in the same way with the same packaging. It can be got around.

6. That kind of fight not good for anyone. The 9 have to rearrange a large part of what they have been doing, can't claim any lineage or connection to anyone "higher up," and also GMT loses 9 schools.

7. Solution? Can you guys find another Master level to associate with? Who is closest to what you've been doing (substantively, and geographically)? Lets talk to them, see what they say. They say, sure, no skin off our back, we're okay to help, and increase our sphere at the same time. I don't know GG, haven't had any thing to do with GM for 20+ years. I can't believe, with both still happily associated with GMT (as far as I know) they would publicly take on 9 schools just excommunicated by GMT, without GMT's okay. Maybe I'm wrong about that. I hope not, because when I came up, "rogue" and "renegade" were four letter words. I took some judo classes after getting 1st blk, told my teacher, AFTER the fact, was told next time to discuss it first, so it doesn't look bad. This, if without sanctioning by GMT, looks REALLY bad.

8. Flaw? Why BOTH GM and GG? Why not just one of them? Only thing I can think of, is sharing the weight, and the responsibility, and if financial help were needed, spread that out too.

I know NOTHING inside. Have NO direct contact with any of the players, at least not regarding any of this. I wish GMT would get a press secretary. I attended more than one "press conference" with him in the day in Lexington, to get it from his mouth. Until he does, this is my story, and I'm sticking with it, until something better comes along. Someone tell me what's wrong with this scenario -- with facts, not "believe me, I know what I'm talking about, you'll just have to trust me."

That's just my opinion, I could be (very) wrong. Only food for thought.

[kwaichang]

I am sick of all this stuff. The point is now a renegade EMMullins has more area and control and he shouldnt have. Actually no {one} should. The fact that I for one cant train with the schools in Tennessee says that the open arms of MA brothers arent that open. So why didnt KY schools absorb them??? Well because they were associated with the Soards . That is why. I for one think the EM soard losing the schools is a good thing i think the EM should teach over an area but not have the right to say who trains with who and if you can open a school or not. this is not the case though. They are trying to control everything we do and say. KC

[BoulderDawg]

Hmmmmm.........

I think most of the business problems happeing now can be laid directly at the feet of The'. The man has never shown himself to be a great business man.

In any case why should a school be aligned with anyone other than GM The'? Why do they need to be groups of schools under this or that elder/senior master?

They are six elder masters. As an owner of a school why couldn't I call up any of these guys and say, "How about doing a festival at my school."?

I think all of this in fighting can only be bad for everyone.