Chan Tai San stories

[SifuAbel]

I agree, this a rare and poignant view into the life of an old master. Life was tough, its was real, lets hear it.

[lkfmdc]

thanks for the support guys.....

more soon...

[Newb]

Sorry if I missed it, but how did the WHD die?

[lkfmdc]

To the best of my knowledge, WHD died of natural age, remember, Chan Tai San only spent a little time with him, not a whole lifetime.... Sifu Tai Yim would know for sure

[diego]

Originally posted by lkfmdc
I've met Raymond Fogg once or twice, knew he was a mantis person, didn't know he was a Chiu Leun person, don't know him that well... other than he was a very nice guy in person...

phantom, I am neither offended nor surprised by your post. Please don't be offended by my comment, your post is exactly the sort of naive sentiment that I see so often today...

My view was always, if you want to learn to fight, learn from fighters. With guys like Chan Tai san, when he said "this is how this works" you KNEW it worked that way, not because of theory, but because of EXPERIENCE...

In law enforcement they often joke about the "quality" of the witness, but honestly, if you are going after a Mafia boss, the witnesses are not going to be bishops and nuns, they are going to be other Mafia people

Real Chinese martial was NEVER about enlightenment, scholars, being healthy and such nonsense. In Chinese society, the sort of people who devoted their time to learning how to fight with hands and knives were the sorts of people who USED those skills, frequently soldiers, mercenaries, gang members, revolutionaries and secret society brothers...

I think most people don't realize how a lot of the kung fu people got to the US in the first place, brought over by associations to act as "red poles" or ENFORCERS....

A very respected teacher started off his school by taking his students to OTB every day to collect from the dead beats. HIs first group of students were told it was "practice", practice your kung fu on the guy who owes the dragon head $1500...

There is a staff technique where you smash the staff onto the ground. When you do it, you roll your hands so you are only holding the top of the staff, so you don't smash your fingers on the ground. My sifu showed this technique, one guy was a little slow, kept holding it and putting the staff on the floor with his fingers wrapped around the staff, ie his fingers under the staff

After a few times of the slow guy NOT listening to Sifu Chan, sifu chan just walked up and STEPPED ON THE STAFF..... OOOOOOWWWWWWWW! the guy screamed... in Siuf Chan's mind, he'd done him a favor, the guy finally figured out he shouldn't do it that way

the staff story reminds me of when my teacher showed me one of kaido's drills with a funky short kick and i couldn't get the flow down and kept asking how does the footwork set it up...his reply was punch at me and watch my feet....kicked me in the nuts when i wasn't expecting...i have found that feeling the technique is the best teacher, so i can respect Chans opinion that he did the guy a favor.

Great thread Dave....one of the mod's should make a sticky!

[lkfmdc]

as most are aware, I am not the most politically correct person when it comes to discussing this sort of stuff, Chan Tai San was less so, he told people to their faces that what he tought, even if it meant destroying their dreams

as the number of American students in the classes grew, the association kicked us out... so we moved the classes to a dance studio space in Chinatown. In these sorts of arrangements, you paid for your hours... there was another kung fu class before us, they were supposed to leave at 2 pm. We rented two hours, and there was a dance class after us at 4 pm. One day, the guy just wouldn't wrap it up, he was still teaching at 2:20... it was rude on a lot of levels, especially that he was teaching on our dime, and denying us the time we had paid for..

Sifu Chan finally just walked onto the floor, right past the guy, and pulled out his chair, told the students to start. The other "teacher", an American, SHOULD have been apologetic, but instead started to get all upset!!! Sifu Chan used one of the few phrases in English he ever learned, it sounded sort of like the Cantonese word for "subdue" and the second word was "you"



Sifu chan then made sure I translated the next into English... "you're kung fu sucks, you have no power and no focus, now please leave, you're making us all sick to our stomachs"

It was sort of fun to translate that... the guy made some noises but he was smart enough not to push the issue.

A major mistake I made when we first started advertising Sifu's classes was putting my home number on the flyers. So I got all sorts of weird calls. One of the best was an American who said he had studied Bak Mei. He said he wasn't interested in the classes, just in telling us how Sifu Chan didn't really know any Bak Mei...



I told him that really, we didn't care, then he said that he'd like to come down and tell my sifu that. I told him that Sifu doesn't speak English but I'd be happy to translate. I did however tell him that once I translated, I was not responsible for his personal safety. The guy said he didn't understand, so I explained it to him. I told him that if he wants to make a big show, come down, and tell sifu he's a fraud... chances are sifu was going to beat him to death. I told him I just wanted him to understand that I wasn't going to be held responsible for whatever horrible thing happened to him...

The guy reconsidered his position and decided not to come down...

It turns out, the guy's teacher had decided to bad mouth Chan Tai San in his classes. Sifu heard about this, had the guy's home number and called him. I was sitting there when he made the call, it was pretty darn amusing.

Chan Tai San: "well, you know me, you know who I studied with, so what's with all this talk"

didn't hear the other end obviously

Chan Tai San: "you didn't say those things"?

"you did?"

"do you have a problem with me?"

"no? good... I didn't think so"

Chinatown NYC is a very small place really, especially among martial arts people. We heard pretty quickly that the other sifu had gone into class a few days later and "explained" that there was a "misunderstanding" and that everyone should know that Chan Tai San was very well respected

Why teachers felt the need to bad mouth Chan Tai San I never figured out... they alway shut up when confronted and most also kissed rear end in his presence...

[diego]

Originally posted by lkfmdc


Chinatown NYC is a very small place really, especially among martial arts people. We heard pretty quickly that the other sifu had gone into class a few days later and "explained" that there was a "misunderstanding" and that everyone should know that Chan Tai San was very well respected

Why teachers felt the need to bad mouth Chan Tai San I never figured out... they alway shut up when confronted and most also kissed rear end in his presence...

prolly didn't like being told how much they suck so they talked behind Chan's back and kowtoed sp? to his face

[darkholme]

lkfmdc your post has brought back a lot of fond memories training with my sifu

After a few times of the slow guy NOT listening to Sifu Chan, sifu chan just walked up and STEPPED ON THE STAFF..... OOOOOOWWWWWWWW! the guy screamed... in Siuf Chan's mind, he'd done him a favor, the guy finally figured out he shouldn't do it that way

Painful effective and straight to the point.
Keep them coming

[Pork Chop]

Ross
Man, this whole thread has me missing DC (and my old kung fu school) with each and every one of your posts. lol

Even more than lion dance, I'm finding myself missing some of that "supplementary" training.

A lot of those US-based stories I can relate to; besides the obvious one that comes up anytime somone mentions "DC".

Can Ye always said nice things about your Sifu; plus with the other sentiments expressed on this thread, I've always had a real positive image of the guy. It's sad when such a bright voice goes silent. My very first sifu, that got me into kung fu 11 years ago, passed earlier this year. Definitely think sharing the stories of the moments that were special to you, keeps them kind of immortal in a way.

This thread makes me miss some days gone by, but I kinda like what I'm doing now. Speaking of which, your comment on "losing" was pretty inspirational and I think it finally sunk in. Taking some steps to try to see some action in 05.

Keep the stories coming. It's human nature to gossip, so we're all into the "dirt"; but I'm really interested in hearing about the training and hearing more about the love/hate relationship with such a father figure.

[richard sloan]

one thing's for sure, with traditional masters, you gotta be real careful of what you say 'yes' to, lol...man some of the predicaments one little word can cause.

my sifu heard of Chan Tai San's passing and had quite a few nice things to say about the man. I think he appreciated the visit Chan Tai San paid him when he decided to stay in the US and came to NYMFC.

[lkfmdc]

Thanks for all the good words guys. Yes, obviously training with Chan tai san has influenced my views on things, especially about "winning"...

aw, crap, was gonna post more, but my guests arrived early

[lkfmdc]

Reviewing the thread, I noticed a question about Chan Tai san and Xing Yi people....

He knew quite a lot, he got around obviously, but the best story in relation to Chan Tai San and Xing Yi is this one...

For the overseas community, Toisan county prints a sort of yearly almanac of things that happened "back home"... How or why Sifu Chan got a hold of an old copy from 1954 I have no idea, but into the school he walks one day with it...

He shows us the section on sports and physical culture... there is the 1954 Canton Province free sparring championship results...

We note that our si-bak (older uncle) Lei Fei San was #2 and Chan Tai San was #3... so we ask who number 1 was and what happened....

Sifu Chan got stopped by number 1, who then fought Lei Fei San in the finals and also beat him. The fact the guy beat BOTH Chan Tai San and Lei Fei San made us darn curious... what style did he do?

Xing Yi, Sifu Chan said....

Well, how did he fight? We of course wanted to know...

Sifu didn't get into much detail, he said the guy told them (both him and Lei Fei san) that he only did 12 techniques EVER, just drilled the same ones over and over....

Sifu Chan then said, basicly, whatever he did, I can tell you one thing, he hit HARD....

Sifu Chan never had a problem giving props when it was due... just few lived up to Chan Tai San's standards....

[yutyeesam]

Sifu Ross - what did CTS think of Wing Chun, and did he ever meet Wong Shun Leung?

123

[mickey]

Greetings,

Thank you for such a great share.

That bit about the OTB master and his students sounded hilarious. Is that stuff still going on? What style was/is he?

mickey

[lkfmdc]

Sifu Chan had a friend in Fut San who did Wing Chun. Sifu Chan said, based upon the Wing Chun his friend did, that in his opinion most of the wing chun did here SUCKED

The only Wing Chun I remember him remarking he liked was Sifu VA Thomas...