1421, The year China discovered the world

[Mutant]

I've heard this is a good book and i intend to read it as soon as I get a chance.

[Sim Koning]

That is correct, yet based on evolutionary chains, our ansestors would have been spread among the world on all of the pieces of pangea, which unless africa was the only place for these lifeforms to survive we would have evolved all over. Im not saying I believe this, its just a theory. Heck we could have come from aliens for all I know, I wont really know until i die, and still maybe then I wont find out the truth. But as for chinese making it to the americas, I dont doubt it. Anything is possible. Like Mr. Muhamad Ali sayed "Impossible is nothing" its all fun to speculate historical situations like this but the fact remains that we dont really know for a fact. Because if we did there would not be any conflicts of opinions.

You need to do a little more reading on geology and paleontology. I find it frustrating when people reach conclusions about something they know little or nothing about.


The supercontinent of pangea existed during the Triassic 225 million years ago and broke up during the Jurassic, which was over 150 million years ago. Dinosaurs were roaming the earth and the closest thing to a human being were small furry mammals. The continent didn't start taking the shape we see today until about 65 million years ago or later. When humans evolved about 2 million years ago the earth looked pretty much the same as it does today. The spreading of continents takes millions and millions of years.

You also must understand the difference between a theory and speculation. Evolution for example is NOT just speculation and guess work. Most scientists consider it to be fact in the practical sense. It is a theory in the same way that the existance of a electron is a theory, though we see electricity everyday, we know how it works, but nobody has actually seen an electron. we know electrons exist, because a huge amount of evidence supports their existence. This is what a theory is to science, it is something that is often treated as what most people would consider fact.

By no means (unless you are a fundamentalist) does any of these theories exclude the existance of God. I myself am a Christian, but I don't believe the creation of the universe was just a big magic act. So please don't think I'm trying to explain away any religious beliefs.

[Eddie]

Couple of years back, I posted something along this lines. Down here in South Africa, they now discovered evidence that the Chinese were actually the first, followed by Hindu Indians, and only much later, the Portuguese and the Dutch. Only thing is, the time line seems a little confusing. Sources vary, but it seems pretty long ago.

I recently listened to a talk ( by an Chinese native) who said that the Chinese actually taught the Africans how to make those Round, grass type huts which were used by most tribes. It seems a bit far fetched, but at this point I’m open to most ideas.

“Has there been any DNA evidence that African sailors travelled to the Americas?”

Not to sure about this. Africa was pretty untamed until very recently, and not many suggestions to this idea of yours. To have travelled to the Americas, they needed a big ship. Unless they had Arabian help (in North Western Africa), I doubt that the people of those years were able to build these ships. Not enough evidence in Africa to suggest this. A possibility would be that they may have had some help from the Portuguese, but that should have been documented.

“One of what was thought to be a pure DNA line in Africa was of the bush people. Their language has clicks and whistles which was thought to be a more primitive language. When the DNA was examined it was found to contain Arab strains.”

Wonder when and on whom they tested these DNA tests. The Bushman tribe originally came from the North of Africa, migrated and settled down in the South at the Kalahari dessert Their language is as you said, but through the last few hundred years, pretty much most of them has been “mixed” with various other races. Many African languages has these click sounds, and Athropology scholars would tell you that these tribes are all related in some way (Not only Bushman, also other African tribes). One of the last so called “original “tribes of bushmen that are still around these days, don’t even speak that old language anymore. They speak my native language, and adopted allot of Dutch culture, as many of them mixed with the Dutch settlers and their descendants. But Arabs have been in Africa for ages, and many African historians belief that Arabs even come from Africa, but that’s another story. I don’t really belief that DNA evidence proof anything on this topic.

“Now this next one at first was a surprise, then it made sense. The Jewish DNA was most closely related to the people of Syria and Palestine. After all, Abraham was their father and they had lived within close proximity of each other.”

Not surprising at all. Judaism is religion, the people pretty much were all from around the middle east. If Im not mistaken, wasn’t Jesus’ mother a Palestinian?

DNA evidence means very little in this topic. There are enough other evidence around which suggest that the world once fared the seas looking for new places. Often, all we need to do is open our eyes and our minds and just look.

Are there people on here who subscribe to the “Arian invasion” theory? In a nutshell the belief is that the Arians travelled from Eastern Europe through India etc, into China. Some sources even suggest these people were the founders of Chinese martial arts.

Cool topic. Going to try to get the book at the end of the month. January is usually a bit tight financially for us (after Christmas and the holidays).

Eddie

[MasterKiller]

For a very gppd article on EXACTLY how human migration occured, check out the November 2004 issue of Discover magazine. They trace the Y chromosome throughout the world and show exactly how humans spread from Africa to the rest of the world using, yes, DNA evidence.

I'll try to scan it tonight to show you the map.

[The Willow Sword]

I actually saw a show on PBS about that very thing. as i remember the DNA testing was inconclusive and turned up a dead end,,but it DID suggest certain migration patterns. however do not quote me 100% as it has been awhile since i have seen the documentary.

I would like to think that cultures such as the Asiatic ones were able to sail as far as the americas and have an influence on the peoples there. there are similarities in philosphies and such between asian and Native american,,,,now if in the really ancient times asiatic peoples migrated across the bering straights down in to what is N america,,i can grok the "connection" that the red peoples share with the Yellow. and from all accounts these migrations really did take place,,but there are still unanswered questions and so far no real concrete evidence suggests anything,,it is all speculation,,but the theories are believeable i think because they stem from common sense.

what i find skeptical about this 1421 story are the timelines. there may have been early(and i mean early) journeys to the Americas by the chinese. but it seems as though there really wasnt that great of an influence,,or perhaps the native N and S americans drove them away(just speculating here). i dont know to tell you the truth.
more later,,PEACE,,TWS

[ShaolinTiger00]

Originally posted by mickey

ShaolinTiger00: You believe that the Chinese astronaut thing was a hoax?

mickey [/B]

There is no doubt. and if there was even a remote chance, "Mythbusters" crushed that.

[tug]

Chinese astronauts? Can someone post a link? My server sux.

[mickey]

ShaolinTiger00,

I had the same feeling about it. Since it seemed that everyone was "going" for it, it seemed a rare occurence that there was someone else who could separate the bull from its schlitz.

mickey