the need for the existence of evil..

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Death penalty? should we kill as a punishment for killing? ultimately, "an eye for an eye", leaves everyone blind...

I do not have the right to terminate another being's physical existence except as a deterent to real and present danger to myself or others.. once the danger is neutralized (or terminated).. the criminal should be isolated in such a manner as to prevent any future threat to society. Now, i advocate geographic isolation and sterilization of both sexes with rudimentary tools for survival.. they will exist or cease to exist by their own hand(s).. but, i do not want the State to act on my behalf by terminating a life when that life's threat to society has been neutralized.. as long as the death penalty is used a a tool for social justice it is validated as simply a tool by any that choose to contrive it use for gain.. any use of gov't sponsored death as a punishment and deterent has been futile as a deterent.. and as punishment only puts the government is the same light as the criminal it seeks to punish, both are killers.. and, has been stated, a life of isolation and hardship is much more daunting than early release from this physical existence..

Be well..

[Merryprankster]

I don't believe in amorality. I believe even those who commit crimes understand that they are not moral in the eyes of the society they live in.

Really? A sociopath by definition has no sense of empathy. A religious person might say they have no soul.

While they logically know that they will be punished for doing what society defines as "wrong," they have no personal sense of right and wrong. Killing a person to get something is the same as choosing to cross the street.

Can we genuinely call a sociopath immoral as they have no sense of right and wrong? We can certainly brand them criminally insane...but how do you hold a person with no conscience morally accountable for their actions?

Amorality in a person is very dangerous for everybody else because all social decisions look the same to them. Very very spooky, IMO.

[red5angel]

Empathy is one thing and it too can be subjective. For example a Terrorist might be empathetic to his own people (I say might) but won't be to what he determines is god's enemy. Some soldiers may also appear to not care but later suffer horrible nightmares and such.

A line from the Last Samurai comes to mind - when Cruise and the main Samurai dude are chit chatting about fighting and war and in response to somehting cruise says about having nightmares he says somehitng like "A warrior only has nightmares about things he regrets" or something like that.

Anyway, the point is that even one who is not empathetic, may still understand what is right or wrong.

[Merryprankster]

Red, the examples you provided are not sociopaths.

Sociopathy is a psychological conditioned characterized by a lack of empathy. They don't need to justify anything they do because there is no moral distinction between say, killing and making a right hand turn.

A lack of empathy for a particular group is quite different. And even then, the actor has to justify their lack of empathy through some rationalization. It's okay to blow up the WTC BECAUSE we are protecting Islam from the Great Satan, etc.

Sociopaths require no such rationalization. It's very difficult to think about. I have a very hard time with it because it's so alien. Not surprisingly, sociopaths usually have poor impulse control....

[red5angel]

no I understand what you're saying, that's why I also said that I don't believe sociopaths while unable to empathize, don't know the difference bewteen right and wrong. They've heard it, and may even understand the concept or logic behind it.

This is why I'm going back to school to get my doctorate in psychology. This sort of stuff intrigues me.

[Merryprankster]

no I understand what you're saying, that's why I also said that I don't believe sociopaths while unable to empathize, don't know the difference bewteen right and wrong. They've heard it, and may even understand the concept or logic behind it.

Ah, okay. So what you're really saying is that Sociopathy doesn't exist. I think the world of psychology/psychiatry would disagree with you, but you're entitled to your opinion.

This is why I'm going back to school to get my doctorate in psychology. This sort of stuff intrigues me.

Might help you understand this forum better.

[red5angel]

Ah, okay. So what you're really saying is that Sociopathy doesn't exist. I think the world of psychology/psychiatry would disagree with you, but you're entitled to your opinion.

I'd have to understand Sociopathy better before I could say it doesn't exist. What I am saying is that it's probably misunderstood.

Might help you understand this forum better.

I could probably make a cozy career studying this forum

[FuXnDajenariht]

seems like everyone has a slight difference in their definition of morality.

[red5angel]

of course why do you think so many people are killing each other all the time? that's the point, morality is purely subjective.

[FuXnDajenariht]

for instance. what is a law besides a more easily define-able moral? a culturally agreed upon moral. why is headhunting culturally accepted in some parts of the world for instance....

sociopaths are not held 'morally' accountable or punished under the full weight of the law because their not mentally stable i think. i dont think its fair to compare to them to people will a functioning brainstem. lol comprehending right and wrong or being able to experience things like empathy are pretty difficult without full use of your mind. its like trying to hold an animal accountable for killing dinner. we still are animals at the basic level. its our minds that separate us.

why you do believe what people consider evil to not be caused by ignorance? im interested to know.

we already established that its neccessary if free will is possible.... but then what else could it be?

do you believe immorality can be taught? why can't amorality be a choice?

[FuXnDajenariht]

Originally posted by red5angel
of course why do you think so many people are killing each other all the time? that's the point, morality is purely subjective.

i meant on the thread. im kinda lost in the sauce here.