Ho Chun

**shirkers1** · 03-30-2005, 12:27 PM

Any one ever heard of these guys? I was wondering if there was any footage out there besides the old black and white footage of gm chang. Any thing of gene chicoine fighting? Or any of their current students? I know that they think they are the greatest fighting school and art ever to grace this earth. I was just wondering if there was any one who has seen for themselves their destructive powers?

http://www.shuaichiao.com/

I know where I stand on their alledged dominance but I was wondering what other thought.

**SevenStar** · 03-30-2005, 12:40 PM

monkeyslaptoo will have some input.

**shirkers1** · 03-30-2005, 12:58 PM

Is monkeyslap one of these guys? I looked into his profile and it didn't say where he trained.

**ewallace** · 03-30-2005, 01:02 PM

not sure about who they are, but that website is awful.

**shirkers1** · 03-30-2005, 01:12 PM

I guess I should elaborate my questioning. How could one judge their style as the greatest combat art ever just because some cat back in the day won a tourney? Or that a style in general is the ultimate fighting art period? Come on now. The fighter makes the fight not the style. I'm not even going into the whole nonsense of personal/political slamming of all other shuai schools that flood this site.... Frankly the only footage I've seen is some staged performances from the 60's and 70's of GM chang and I wasn't convinced this is the greatest fighting art that is known to man.

some quotes from the site.
"To any of those mentioned, if G.M. Chicoine is wrong, then there is really only one way to settle this disagreement. We are sure that you people know what way that is".

Isn't this guy a little old to be accepting challanges? I don't see any thing showing their modern students, everything is about chicoine and all the photos are from decades ago..

just wondering, there are some bold statements made on that site.

"Shuai Chiao would remain the most feared combat style and always be impossible to defeat in real fighting. Here again in victory, Shuai Chiao will be the ones who walk away".

**fa_jing** · 03-30-2005, 04:11 PM

I think they are a splinter group. Not the only Shuai-Chiao. But, I think GM Chang's Shuai-Chiao is one of the most devestating arts around. Plus, you can fit it into a primarily striking style to help you with your throws.

**SevenStar** · 03-30-2005, 04:34 PM

definitely

**dezhen2001** · 03-30-2005, 04:58 PM

wow, politics galore i guess

awful use of popups though.

**shirkers1** · 03-30-2005, 05:32 PM

http://emptyflower.stanford.edu/johnwang1.html

I've seen these vids of gm chang. I agree that shuai is effective in throwing, most styles that have throwing have the same principles mine included. Being that there is only so many ways to throw someone correctly, that is pretty much a given. But to make the claims that are being made I find it laughable.

Just wondering if there was any footage of "combat shuai" that these guys are doing now. If it's so effective why train in other styles?

**fa_jing** · 03-31-2005, 11:05 AM

dood, is this the first time you've heard of a martial art claiming to be "the best"?

**shirkers1** · 03-31-2005, 11:14 AM

Dude I'm not your dood... Just kidding.

No it's not the first time and it won't be the last. But I know first hand that these guys think they are the greatest thing out there, you can read that for yourself. I know for a fact that they aren't, and I could really care less about what they think. I know locally they have some mystique surrounding them and their past, as well as local harrassment by them against other schools. But I still have yet to see anything showing why they are the ultimate combat fighting school.

I was wondering what others thought of their site and if there was any footage of what they had to offer. Recent footage of their current students. Seems to me that if you have a quality system to promote the best thing to do is promote in a positive way. SHOW what is so good, not negatively put everything else around down including your own style and other schools.

**SevenStar** · 03-31-2005, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by shirkers1

http://emptyflower.stanford.edu/johnwang1.html

I've seen these vids of gm chang. I agree that shuai is effective in throwing, most styles that have throwing have the same principles mine included. Being that there is only so many ways to throw someone correctly, that is pretty much a given. But to make the claims that are being made I find it laughable.

Just wondering if there was any footage of "combat shuai" that these guys are doing now. If it's so effective why train in other styles?

the need to cross train exitsts in all styles, realistically. shuai chiao for example, lacks groundwork. I'm willing to bet mantis lacks any serious ground work as well, pointing out an area for you guys to cross train in. BJJ guys don't strike - the pure bjj guys who compete in events where striking is allowed cross train in striking arts.

As for you first comment, it's not about whether or not a style mere HAS throwing -that's not enough. shuai chiao guys spend 95% of their time training those throws. Anyone who does less will undoubtedly have weaker throwing skills than these guys.

**SevenStar** · 03-31-2005, 11:41 AM

not sure where you can find footage, but I know they have tourneys in akron. the texas guys compete at the taiji legacy if I'm not mistaken, and there are CSC instructors - guys who trained directly under CTS in georgia, texas, chicago...maybe next time you're in one of the areas, you can check them out.

as for political stuff - it's everywhere and is likely best just ignored.

**shirkers1** · 03-31-2005, 12:28 PM

Thanks for pointing out where I need to work more on..

We've had this discussion before and you know where I stand on it. We do train ground work, and as far as I'm concerned I need work on all of my game because you can never be good enough.. There is always someone better.

I was being sarcastic with the cross training. I know that and I agree with you mostly, some styles already have that built into their system so cross training isn't needed as much as others. Not to say you shouldn't be playing around with specialists from those backgrounds to test yourself though.

But read the quotes I posted from thier site. They are saying their "combat shuai is undefeated and impossible to defeat" Then why do they teach other styles MA at their school? I was just pointing out another statement by them that made no sense at all.

According to their site no other Shuai school teaches combat shuai and is un official so I was wondering how say the Texas school or chicago schools felt about that? What does the akron school have that the other schools don't? We can all speculate, but I was hoping some of these guys or other shuai practitioners would chime in and give some answers if they check in on this forum.

As for footage I've seen fight footage of these guys and it's far from even good. So I was looking for some evidence of actually "winning" a fight maybe?

**SevenStar** · 03-31-2005, 01:28 PM

my bad, I gotcha now. I hate trying to interpret sarcasm over the net!

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