What makes a style complete?

[Mikkyou]

what about tradition, way of life and calmness within self?

If you want to go into an confrontation he throws a punch and you quote"my art is over 4ooyrs old"great.I think of tradition as something not necessary for a complete style of self defense and fighting.Tradition learning is something you do as a hobby or interest.If you want something to calm yourself down try mediation
or some other form of biofeed back this again has to do with your interest and self development where having a style be able to protect you regardless of the sitution.Based on my experience in fighting(which is not to much)I never had the chance to close my eyes and relax myself Usually everything I did was without thinking meaning he threw a punch I blocked he threw another one I moved kicked his knee striked his jaw applied a jointlock till helped arrived.

[Vasquez]

I might have lost you in a level of proficiency that most ppl don't get to. TCMA teaches you to evade and yield so that your opponent falls into empty space. You then wait for the precise moment to strike.

A little philosophy of ying and yang will help. Soft counters hard. If they are all tense up you relax and meditate.

[Mr Punch]

In terms of combat effectiveness there are no complete arts.

In terms of giving you what you need to complement your life, goals and lifestyle, anything you do earnestly can help you with that completeness. I don't see that as esoteric bull****, in fact a very practical way of acting (being or doing if you prefer).

In terms of Dark Knight's suggestion of including the gun, you chump, you're completely ignoring Zim's post before... if you include guns, you gotta include harpoons and poisonous sea-urchins.

[Merryprankster]

I might have lost you in a level of proficiency that most ppl don't get to.

*******WARNING********

Snotty, TCMA, megacondescending obnoxiousness alert!

[Gangsterfist]

Before you think this is dogmatic in any way, please read the whole post.

"Complete systems" (should say complete practitioners) cover these things:

1. Space and energy
2. Motion
3. All ranges of combat
4. weapons (weapons infact improve your open hand, you gain attributes from them)
5. Effeciency, direct to the point combat


So basically, I am saying that you need to occupy the space you are best at, whatever your style says. If you are a long range fighter you need to learn to keep your space. If you are a grappler you must learn to close the gap and not get knocked out in the process. You must also study how to control motions and apply energy of whatever it is you study. Learn all the different ranges of combat, and how they work. I don't train in any ground fighting style, but I took a weekend long seminar last week on total ground fighting. I learned a lot, and it definately took my ground game to the next level. Now we have incorporated ground fighting drills in our normal training. Weapons training gives you attributes in several ways. It gives you distance closing and timing attributes, and it also improves your open hand techniques, and in some cases foot work. In fighting fitness is the number one factor. In the MA world you have things like technique, but if you cannot last that long in a fight then your window of opportunity to win is very short. I have done continous sparring where one person in class gets up, then every other person in class (including the instructor) fights you one at a time for one minute each. You don't get any breaks or anything. Right when they say next, the next person is jumping in on you while the person you were fighting leaves. I can tell you right now this is very tiring. Train how to execute what you know effeciently with bigger pay off with less effort. This can be done with lots of different styles. Kind of follows the time/space/energy theory. I have seen guys that when doing this sparring drill go all muscle out, and can barely last past the 3rd person.

Also, I think there should be progression of all this stuff from begining to advanced. Training should be progressive and the practitioner should gain in skill as they train more and more. You will obviously platoue at one point, but the progression should still be there.

These are things that IMO, can be found in numerous systems.

[Vasquez]

Modern arts which focus on kicking, punching and grappling will platue to a point but traditional arts will give you a life time of learning.

[Merryprankster]

Modern arts which focus on kicking, punching and grappling will platue to a point but traditional arts will give you a life time of learning.

*******WARNING********

Snotty, TCMA, megacondescending obnoxiousness alert!

[Vasquez]

LOL at that.

[Christopher M]

The plebeians can never understand. They dirty their hands with brute wrestling and sully their minds with physical labor. They sweat and struggle with one another like pigs. It is best not to even deign them with our wisdom. Truly: pearls before swine.

I'm sorry but it's true.

[red5angel]

In terms of combat effectiveness there are no complete arts.

In terms of giving you what you need to complement your life, goals and lifestyle, anything you do earnestly can help you with that completeness. I don't see that as esoteric bull****, in fact a very practical way of acting (being or doing if you prefer).

In terms of Dark Knight's suggestion of including the gun, you chump, you're completely ignoring Zim's post before... if you include guns, you gotta include harpoons and poisonous sea-urchins.

right........

[red5angel]

Modern arts which focus on kicking, punching and grappling will platue to a point but traditional arts will give you a life time of learning.

Ah someone else who is new to the martial arts.....

[SevenStar]

I haven't read this thread yet, so this may have been said, but completeness is in the eye of the beholder. IMO:

in depth stand up work
in depth ground work
possibly some stick and knife training

That's it.

I don't care about classical weapons anymore. I don't care about forms. Knowing how to wield a broadsword is great, but does not make me any more complete of a fighter, nor does knowing 97139720841 forms. Notice that I stated in depth knowledge. In my definition, this is key. A style that "has grappling in its forms" but you really do know in depth grappling training is deficient, IMO. a style that has grappling but lacks in sttiking is also deficient.

philosophy and spirituality, IMO should not be part of MA training either - I have books and church for those things. My martial training should be just that.

[SevenStar]

Modern arts which focus on kicking, punching and grappling will platue to a point but traditional arts will give you a life time of learning.

you're kidding....right?

[MasterKiller]

philosophy and spirituality, IMO should not be part of MA training either - I have books and church for those things. My martial training should be just that.

Books and church are good for learning, but application of principle requires physical action, especially in a ch'an/zen model. It doesn't have to be martial, but it can be if that's the path you choose.

[SevenStar]

I might have lost you in a level of proficiency that most ppl don't get to. TCMA teaches you to evade and yield so that your opponent falls into empty space. You then wait for the precise moment to strike.

A little philosophy of ying and yang will help. Soft counters hard. If they are all tense up you relax and meditate.

that's funny, muay thai, bjj and judo teach the exact same thing...