Shaolin-do teaching the SUPER SECRET invincible internal style

[brucereiter]

Technically, there is a difference.

Wah Lum has a bunch of Wah Lum forms and CLF has a bunch of CLF forms, which means all the forms in those systems should share the same principles.

SD has a bunch of forms from a bunch of other systems, and many of those systems do not share similar principles. In effect, it's like trying to learn several martial arts all at once.

Now, back to the program.

????????????????????????????? wah lum temple seems to teach alot of matieral "not related" to the wah lum temple ????????????? what do you mean when you say wah lum has a bunch of wah lum forms

Program Description

"PEE WEE" PROGRAM
The "Pee Wee" Kung Fu class is for children 3 to 6 years of age. This program will prepare your child for the regular children's class as the curriculum will include basic Kung Fu exercises and gymnastic skills. This class will be on Thursdays from 5:00 to 5:45pm. Registration includes tuition, shirt, pants, belt and shoes.

CHILDREN'S CLASS
This program is designed to help increase your child's learning abilities physically as well as mentally. Your child will become more flexible, coordinated and disciplined which will improve his/her studying habits.

ADULT KUNG FU
Wah Lum exercises, breathing techniques, self defense applications, philosophy and weapons training based on students ability.

ADULT SPARRING
Sparring is an optional part of the curriculum. A student will strive to develop their fighting capabilities at the same time developing endurance, strength, body conditioning, speed and reaction time. Students are permitted to join sparring after their first test.

TAI CHI CHUAN
Tai Chi Chuan is a slow moving exercise for the individuals who wish to practice a less strenuous exercise program. Tai Chi improves balance, tones the body and promotes longevity. "Chi" or internal strength is acquired after practicing Tai Chi properly for quite some time. It is an exercise program for overall health and is known to cure certain ailments and illnesses.

INSTRUCTOR'S TRAINING PROGRAM
Advanced trainees in the martial arts will be able to open his/her own school with the intensive Instructor's Training program. Student will be taught intensively and privately by Master Chan towards that goal. Each student will be considered based on ability and martial arts experience.

PROFESSIONAL STUDENT PROGRAM
Students will be tested as to previous experience and ability. There is daily training Monday through Saturday for Kung Fu, Tai Chi, or both. They include:

Kung Fu - Wah Lum exercises, breathing techniques, self defense applications, philosophy and weapons training based on students ability.

Tai Chi - Yang Style , Chen Style, Pakua Tai Chi, Compulsory 24 and 42 step available. Breathing techniques, silk reeling, basic Tai Chi exercises, philosophy and weapon training based on student's ability.
For more information, click here.
LIVE IN TRAINING
If you would like additional information on class schedules, special programs or an application for the Professional Student Program send e-mail to kungfu@wahlum.com or call (407) 275-6177.

CLASS SCHEDULE



Wah Lum Kung Fu of U.S.A. Headquarters
851 North Goldenrod Road, Orlando, FL 32807
Phone: 407-275-6177
Fax: 407-281-0132
kungfu@wahlum.com

[Judge Pen]

How many styles of SD are there?.

I meant to type a style other than SD. My bad.

[MasterKiller]

????????????????????????????? wah lum temple seems to teach alot of matieral "not related" to the shaolin temple ????????????? what do you mean when you say wah lum has a bunch of wah lum forms

Who said anything about Shaolin Temple?

I said Wah Lum forms are all Wah Lum. The Tai Chi is separate. If you want to learn Mantis, you don't have to learn Tai Chi also. In SD, all the styles are mixed together. That was my point.

And not to open a can of worms here, but Wah Lum isn't pure northern mantis either. Their stuff has a distinctly southern flavor mixed in with their mantis.

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

And they teach almost as many forms as SD (not claim to know, but actually teach--I know the claims of 900 forms prevail, but I think that our style only has about 150 that have been taught).

Yeah, but they teach 150 Wah Lum forms. Not 15 Cha sets, 15 Choy Lay Fut sets, 15 Tai Chi sets, 15 Bagua sets, etc...

[Judge Pen]

Yeah, but they teach 150 Wah Lum forms. Not 15 Cha sets, 15 Choy Lay Fut sets, 15 Tai Chi sets, 15 Bagua sets, etc...

I'm just saying that there's other stuff mixed in and their mantis forms have a disctinctly southern flavor to them. Like someone who specilized in a southern art later learned mantis. That's just my personal observation on the matter.

SD's forms are SD's forms. They all have their own bent on them for a number of different reasons.

[lxtruong]

How many styles of SD are there? The long Long First is Cha Chuan Set A, what ever the heck that means. There is also a Set B that hasn't been taught. The "childs " form is called such from the formal name meaning the first or young Long fists set. ( The actual name eludes me at the moment)

We like to joke that if there is a "kids" long fist there obviously must be a "geriatric long fist" and a "middle aged long fist". Perhaps a "tweener" long fist?

[Judge Pen]

We like to joke that if there is a "kids" long fist there obviously must be a "geriatric long fist" and a "middle aged long fist". Perhaps a "tweener" long fist?

I can show you what middle-aged long fist looks like. I'm working on it right now.

[yutyeesam]

I'm just saying that there's other stuff mixed in and their mantis forms have a disctinctly southern flavor to them. Like someone who specilized in a southern art later learned mantis. That's just my personal observation on the matter.

But a Southern influence on Mantis is not the same thing as teaching Long Fist, Mantis, Hung Ga, Tai Chi, etc etc etc in one curriculum. If there's a Southern influence on their Mantis forms, at least its consistent throughout the curriculum. Grandmaster Feng Zhi Qiang has a Xing-yi flavor to his Chen Family Taijiquan. But it is consistent. It's not like he's teaching Xing-yi for a few months, then Chen.

It seems that SD tries to teach different styles separately in one curriculum.

I think teaching many styles in one curriculum like this doesn't allow you to explore the rich and deep subtleties of one style.

In defense of SD, though, I go back to what Bruce Lee said, a punch is a punch, a kick is a kick, a lock is a lock, etc, and that styles do have a tendency to separate people.

-123

[Judge Pen]

But a Southern influence on Mantis is not the same thing as teaching Long Fist, Mantis, Hung Ga, Tai Chi, etc etc etc in one curriculum. If there's a Southern influence on their Mantis forms, at least its consistent throughout the curriculum. Grandmaster Feng Zhi Qiang has a Xing-yi flavor to his Chen Family Taijiquan. But it is consistent. It's not like he's teaching Xing-yi for a few months, then Chen.

It seems that SD tries to teach different styles separately in one curriculum.

I think teaching many styles in one curriculum like this doesn't allow you to explore the rich and deep subtleties of one style.

In defense of SD, though, I go back to what Bruce Lee said, a punch is a punch, a kick is a kick, a lock is a lock, etc, and that styles do have a tendency to separate people.

-123

I think that's one of the common misconceptions; It's not like we only sample a style for only a few months. For example, I focused almost exclusively on Hsing-I for two and 1/2 years. I've been focusing, almost exclusively, on Hua Chuan for the last three years. Is that enough to "master" that system? He11 no, but it does give me an idea of the respective principles and subtleties. I study that style enough to see its principles starting to creep into my own personal martial style. For example, my explosiveness and efficiency of movement went up dramatically after studying Hsing-I. Now that I'm focusing on Hua, my ability to evade and cover distance is noticeably improved. No I can't claim to know hua or Hsing-I as well as someone who studied it exclusively (or even from someone that only studied it for a couple of years from a teacher that taught it exclusively) but it does give me an idea as to its flavor and I can continue to study it on my own if I choose.

It's a starting point only; its akin to learning a style for a couple of years before starting over in another style. But what you get from it is good and useful, and it does build on itself. If I find someone that teaches a style I'm interested in that I was introduced to in SD, then I would explore what they have to offer and delve deeper into a particular style. Right now, I'm very happy where I am and what I am being taught.

[Brad]

I'm just saying that there's other stuff mixed in and their mantis forms have a disctinctly southern flavor to them. Like someone who specilized in a southern art later learned mantis. That's just my personal observation on the matter.

Tam Tui (different spelling of Tan Tui?), mantis, and I think Mok Gar (something about that being a popular style in the area the Wah Lum temple used to be... or something like that). Wah Lum has had some problems in the past (at least with some instructors) in admiting where there forms came from when asked (or just ignorant of some facts).

Deleted the rest of my post before people start responding... going to rethink a couple things and post again latter (want to try not to go over so much old ground)

[Judge Pen]

Deleted the rest of my post before people start responding... going to rethink a couple things and post again latter (want to try not to go over so much old ground)

I was going to respond to what you had posted earlier. Now I'll wait.

[Crushing Fist]

after looking around a bit I have seen two different long fist varients called "Hua Quan" with different translations...

one is "flower fist" the other "chinese fist"

would either of these be the Hua we practice or is this yet another "Hua"

I always thought it was the Hua as in Hua Shan...

also, the brown belt forms known as "china hands" have a very long fist feel I've always thought, and this long fist style known as "chinese fist" makes me a bit curious. does anyone know where the "china hand" sets originate?

and totally off topic...

does anyone know what style of Hsing I it is we have? from what I've read it sounds like its hebei but I'm just guessing here. Some things I've read/been told recently makes it seem that we got our Hsing I from the same source as our Pa Kua.

[MasterKiller]

after looking around a bit I have seen two different long fist varients called "Hua Quan" with different translations...

one is "flower fist" the other "chinese fist"

would either of these be the Hua we practice or is this yet another "Hua"

I always thought it was the Hua as in Hua Shan...

also, the brown belt forms known as "china hands" have a very long fist feel I've always thought, and this long fist style known as "chinese fist" makes me a bit curious. does anyone know where the "china hand" sets originate?

and totally off topic...

JP might correct me here, but I believe your Hua is "Hua Mountain" style. It's a different beast from Hua (flower), Hua (Essence), or Hua (China) style.

More on Hua (China):
http://www.chinavoc.com/kungfu/schools/cata_hua.asp

[Crushing Fist]

whats with all the Huas?

thanks for the link MK

I found another site that seems to blend the Hua Mountain with the Hua "China Style" though i have no idea of its credibility.

http://www.plumpub.com/info/knotebook/boxhuashan.htm

they both mention Cai Mao and Cai Guiqin.

has anyone read "chronicles of the tao" by deng ming-dao?

its a semi-biography of kwan saihung who lived at Hua Shan as a monk, and eventually started a kung fu school in california...

anyone have info on this school?

[Brad]

I think Hua (China) was the one atributed to Hua shan. Hua in this case means "glorious" which is the name use for China in Chinese. My source: http://www.plumpub.com/info/knotebook/boxhuashan.htm
BTW, they have a relatively cheap vcd series on the style for sale there if you SD Hua Quan folk want to compare your forms.

Edit: I see you beat me to it Anyway, I don't know much about it other than the two Hua Quan's (along with Cha Quan, Hong Quan, and Pao Quan) were used in forming the original modern wushu back in the 50's & 60's.

[Judge Pen]

JP might correct me here, but I believe your Hua is "Hua Mountain" style. It's a different beast from Hua (flower), Hua (Essence), or Hua (China) style.

More on Hua (China):
http://www.chinavoc.com/kungfu/schools/cata_hua.asp

I think that's correct, but I've not been able to compare Hua (China) and our Hua. They may be, as Brad says, one and the same. The website www.chinahand.com is a link to a school that teaches the same hua as we do. If you go here: http://www.chinahand.com/Fun%20Stuff/our_forms.htm and click on "Hua Chuan 3 by Alaan" you will see our Book 3 (with a few obvious differences in how a particular technique is done, but its the same form). If you poke around their links you will find some other schools that teach our hua too.