Shaolin-do teaching the SUPER SECRET invincible internal style

[Brad]

If a possibly fake history and funny looking uniforms are the worst problems in your school, then I think you're doing pretty well... If you think what you learn is useful in your life, and your teacher isn't doing anything too crooked that would really endanger the school's future (like molesting kids, setting himself up as a religous leader, illegal contracts, running tax scams, getting involved in illegal drugs, running a gang, etc,) then you're better off than a lot of people out there.

I know, a bit diiferent than the anti-SD stuff I usually spout... but I don't really care about that stuff anymore (I'm no historian... wtf do I really know about those kind of things?).

[lxtruong]

If a possibly fake history and funny looking uniforms are the worst problems in your school, then I think you're doing pretty well...

In our defense, you can't really call wearing karate gis a "funny looking uniform". Now have you see the Kuk Sool Won uniforms for their masters? Now THAT is a funny looking uniform.

[Judge Pen]

If a possibly fake history and funny looking uniforms are the worst problems in your school, then I think you're doing pretty well... If you think what you learn is useful in your life, and your teacher isn't doing anything too crooked that would really endanger the school's future (like molesting kids, setting himself up as a religous leader, illegal contracts, running tax scams, getting involved in illegal drugs, running a gang, etc,) then you're better off than a lot of people out there.

I know, a bit diiferent than the anti-SD stuff I usually spout... but I don't really care about that stuff anymore (I'm no historian... wtf do I really know about those kind of things?).

Who are you calling funny looking?

I like wearing frog-buttons personally (although most of the time we work out in cuffed pants, a T-Shirt and our sash, the gis didn't bother me when I wore them. It's like putting on your best suit before trial, just having it on can focus you toward your goals a little more.

We had a demonstration Saturday night here in Tennessee and one of our teachers has a very sucsessful kids class. He had two students one boy about 6 years old and the other girl must have been barely three years old. These two were amazing. She did one of our basic tiger forms and nailed it. The boy did an advanced monkey form that was awesome. All arguments about history, lineage etc aside, these two kids were having a blast and they were learning a lot of discipline and determination to be able to do these forms as well as they did and in front of a fairly large crowd.

[Ray Pina]

We learn history to know the past the past shapes the future. I feel the forms are a recreation of history and by training in them i can somehow "know"the creator and his or her personality or what "special" idea they were trying to convey. By doing so I can preserve history and make a difference in myself. Also some forms have certain emphasis I feel that is the "secret" / "special" technique or way. Sure I pay for the seminars but I also pay for a book that could teach a form. How would you like to spend your money? they are both of history. Training in something that was made up with out an empirical test of time is a waste of time , it hasent been proven. KC

The Apple 2C worked, so did the Commadore 64 ..... You have a choice. You want one of those, or the new Apple Powerbook?

Now, I'm the wrong one for this thread because I think all form is bull$hit. Even if the moves worked that way, why train them in a sequence that will never take place? Fights are unique.

Once you see that, wouldn't it be more beneficial to just train the principle the one move in the form is trying to teach? Everything is pretty much a variation of covering, collapsing or pushing down; lifting up; pushing or pulling; inside position or outside position.

That's why chi sau is useful. You're hands are either both outside, both inside, or one of two possible combinations of inside and outside. Can you lift, press, cover, trap from there?

Then there is not having the hand at all and looking for it.

That's it. Train all of that --- believe me, it's enough to keep you very busy -- and you're now training in fighting.

The proof that form is crap?

I see very, very few form champs or wushu practioners in general who can fight at all, never mind loving and thriving on it. I don't personally know any fighters who attribute form for their fighting attributes.

Form = keep coming and paying me.

[kwaichang]

Hi let me introduce myself I am a forms man that can fight . Now you know me. If Fighting is all there was to martial arts why not buy the best gun possible if it is all about winning. You apparantly do not understand forms or katas what ever you call them remember boards dont hit back but the mind does KC

[chud]

The proof that form is crap?

I see very, very few form champs or wushu practioners in general who can fight at all, never mind loving and thriving on it. I don't personally know any fighters who attribute form for their fighting attributes.

Form = keep coming and paying me.

Ray, your comments about combat training (and chi sau especially) are well taken, however I must ask you a question. I notice from the link in your signature that you practice an internal style, I assume this means that you do some TaiChi. Do you not believe that the TaiChi form has value?

[tree beard]

well, i searched the forums for golden leopard and i found this old one...

so, you all will be happy to know that i went to the seminar this past weekend and guess what...

I LIKED IT!!!!

and i recognize that it just eats at your balls that i went and spent my (husband's) hard-earned money on a kata that you will NEVER know, but why does it affect you so? i mean, it did me no harm, spending MY money. now, had i invested the same amount of money in, oh say, meals at mcdonald's, then you might have a compelling argument.

besides, this whole thread was started on false information. there were never any words published by the sda even related to "super secret" or "invincible" that i ever saw. but, clearing that point up didn't stop you. you just continued to change your argument and we continued to be unaffected. after all of these pages, did you succeed in deterring even one member of sd?

[Judge Pen]

Most people here don't care about the SD debate one way or another. And others just like to argue over anything.

I'm glad you liked the form.

[Golden Tiger]

Yes, it was a nice 2 forms that he taught out. Also, it was the largest turnout by far...324 people attended. My only complaint (as always) is that it was a lot of material to be taught out in one day. I long for the days of when he was activrly teaching and we were able to get it in small doses. But that aside, it was nice.

My review:

Small forms based on building speed and teaching the proper places and combinations (up to 7 strikes at a time) to hit. On the top level, very good training indeed for close fighting and multiple strikes, on another level, many of the internal theories are being used to make the attacks a little bit sweeter.

On a scale from 1 to 10 (1 being the lowest, 10 the highest) I give it an 8.

And welcome Tree beard, don't think I have met you before. Glad you came to the seminar and enjoyed it. Oh, and be prepared to grow a thick skin for these guys...

[MasterKiller]

[Pai Mei]

Like all American women, you only know how to order dinner and spend a man's money.

[/Pai Mei]

[Judge Pen]

Yes, it was a nice 2 forms that he taught out. Also, it was the largest turnout by far...324 people attended. My only complaint (as always) is that it was a lot of material to be taught out in one day. I long for the days of when he was activrly teaching and we were able to get it in small doses. But that aside, it was nice.

My review:

Small forms based on building speed and teaching the proper places and combinations (up to 7 strikes at a time) to hit. On the top level, very good training indeed for close fighting and multiple strikes, on another level, many of the internal theories are being used to make the attacks a little bit sweeter.

On a scale from 1 to 10 (1 being the lowest, 10 the highest) I give it an 8.

And welcome Tree beard, don't think I have met you before. Glad you came to the seminar and enjoyed it. Oh, and be prepared to grow a thick skin for these guys...

The first form being primarily hands and the second being more kick oriented? Multiple strikes combos to precise targets? Did he go into the internal theory and the pressure point combinations or was there the time?

[Golden Tiger]

The first form being primarily hands and the second being more kick oriented?

No, both had both hands and kicks. Both, from what I could gather, were primers for a shift from the physical to the internal.

Multiple strikes combos to precise targets?

Very precise..to the exact point needed you could even say.

Did he go into the internal theory and the pressure point combinations or was there the time?

Yes, quiet a few of them in fact.
Yes, and were series of combinations based on the above question but that was only briefly mentioned. If you new the theories, then it was very clear.
No, there wasn't enough time. But with what they got, by the next seminar, most will understand what is going on.

I'll probably stop there. No need to tell it all. JP, snd me a pm if you have another questions.

[serene_dragon]

The proof that form is crap?

I see very, very few form champs or wushu practioners in general who can fight at all, never mind loving and thriving on it. I don't personally know any fighters who attribute form for their fighting attributes.

Form = keep coming and paying me.

Some people dont have a clue

[kwaichang]

JP why didnt you go to the seminar Golden Leopard ? KC

[Judge Pen]

They will be taught in Tennessee sometime this year. Master Garry was taught the forms by Master Sin, but I'm not sure when they will be taught here. I've been assured that we will get all 4 leopard forms before Liu Shing is taught out.