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Thread: Northern Mantis vs Southern Mantis

  1. #16
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    Thank you for taking this debate seriously. I would say that Southern Mantis is more spiritual and Northern Mantis is more philisophical and chi-orientated.

  2. #17
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    I Just Want To Know What The Difference Is Between The Two Styles. To See It In Action Would Be The Coolest Thing Ever

  3. #18
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    Smile When Northern and Southern Tanglang Cross hands...

    Well, here's what I could imagine:

    The SPM guy (whatever styles) is going to assume a ready stance.

    1) Feet about shoulder width, toes inward and gripping the floor, and relatively high and relaxed yet all slacks in the body structure tightened.

    2) Hands up in some kind of a guard (bai Jong Sau) most likely right pheonix eye punch and left hand a palm.

    3) Elbows down and closing access to the center line.

    4) Head leveled to lower (chin tugged). Chest hollow, back rounded, and Dan Tien is firm.

    This would also have the hip a little more squarely facing the opponent. The advantage is the it will have all weapons available to him.

    The NPM guy (say a TJPMer) is going to be mobile more or less in a Bi Shi (closing posture). He will be bringing in the Monkey disposition and footwork for searching an opening in the ready stance of the opponent.

    Assuming there is not eye poking and groin shorts, here's what will happen.

    Strategy for the SPM guy:

    It is more than likely the SPM will wait for the other guy to initiate.

    1) Stop Kick to the knee of the opponent and pheonix eye punch (PEP) to an openning of the opponent preferrably a weak point (ie throat)

    2) Toe trap and PEP in rapid succession. Follow in if opp. retreats in time. Maintain straight line attacks.

    3) If opp attemps to block punch while arm stretched out; clam down hard with elbows as breaks or with grinding motion to trap temporary. Or some types of hooking punch or down angled punch as "leaking" hand.

    4) Keep opp in front and at bay. Don't want to give any access to the side or back. Stomp and stop kicks to distroy the opp's lower line attacks.

    5) End fight as soon as possible. Use angle entry avoid getting hit as much as possible but will absorb punishment if need be (points deducted in that case).

    6) use sallow, spit, surface, and sink to unbalance the opp in close range and to add more omph to the strikes.

    Strategy for the NPM guy:

    It is more than likely that the NPM guy will initiate some form of attack (ie a back hand slap.) and attempt a disciplined plan of offense.

    1) will use the 12 key words with 5 types of Shou Fa (ie Gou Lou Cai, Fanche Lulu, Mo Pan Shou, etc..) for entry and take whatever that is available. Discipline takes over after the initial clash.

    2) close gap as quickly as possible. Sticking and leaning as soon as an opening is availble. Using Shuai (throwing) and Na (grappling) to takedown.

    3) Dodging, Deceiving, leaping and shifting to get to the side and/or back of opp.

    4) In close range elbow hard and knee hard.

    5) Takedown and establish control. Ground fighting if necessary.

    BTW, that's only my perspective and experience as NPM guy (CCK TCPM). Others may drastically different. I would take as long as it needs to finish the fight. My motto is "make haste without being hasty", "using slow to yield to the fast" and "Don't fight fire with fire, be like water...".

    The rest of course is depended upon the contestants and it's highly speculative until proven with actual match.

    Mantis108
    Contraria Sunt Complementa

    對敵交手歌訣

    凡立勢不可站定。凡交手須是要走。千着萬着﹐走為上着﹐進為高着﹐閃賺騰挪為
    妙着。


    CCK TCPM in Yellowknife

    TJPM Forum

  4. #19
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    Nice post, Mantis108.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mantis108
    Well, here's what I could imagine:

    The SPM guy (whatever styles) is going to assume a ready stance.

    1) Feet about shoulder width, toes inward and gripping the floor, and relatively high and relaxed yet all slacks in the body structure tightened.

    2) Hands up in some kind of a guard (bai Jong Sau) most likely right pheonix eye punch and left hand a palm.

    3) Elbows down and closing access to the center line.

    4) Head leveled to lower (chin tugged). Chest hollow, back rounded, and Dan Tien is firm.

    This would also have the hip a little more squarely facing the opponent. The advantage is the it will have all weapons available to him.

    The NPM guy (say a TJPMer) is going to be mobile more or less in a Bi Shi (closing posture). He will be bringing in the Monkey disposition and footwork for searching an opening in the ready stance of the opponent.

    Assuming there is not eye poking and groin shorts, here's what will happen.

    Strategy for the SPM guy:

    It is more than likely the SPM will wait for the other guy to initiate.

    1) Stop Kick to the knee of the opponent and pheonix eye punch (PEP) to an openning of the opponent preferrably a weak point (ie throat)

    2) Toe trap and PEP in rapid succession. Follow in if opp. retreats in time. Maintain straight line attacks.

    3) If opp attemps to block punch while arm stretched out; clam down hard with elbows as breaks or with grinding motion to trap temporary. Or some types of hooking punch or down angled punch as "leaking" hand.

    4) Keep opp in front and at bay. Don't want to give any access to the side or back. Stomp and stop kicks to distroy the opp's lower line attacks.

    5) End fight as soon as possible. Use angle entry avoid getting hit as much as possible but will absorb punishment if need be (points deducted in that case).

    6) use sallow, spit, surface, and sink to unbalance the opp in close range and to add more omph to the strikes.

    Strategy for the NPM guy:

    It is more than likely that the NPM guy will initiate some form of attack (ie a back hand slap.) and attempt a disciplined plan of offense.

    1) will use the 12 key words with 5 types of Shou Fa (ie Gou Lou Cai, Fanche Lulu, Mo Pan Shou, etc..) for entry and take whatever that is available. Discipline takes over after the initial clash.

    2) close gap as quickly as possible. Sticking and leaning as soon as an opening is availble. Using Shuai (throwing) and Na (grappling) to takedown.

    3) Dodging, Deceiving, leaping and shifting to get to the side and/or back of opp.

    4) In close range elbow hard and knee hard.

    5) Takedown and establish control. Ground fighting if necessary.

    BTW, that's only my perspective and experience as NPM guy (CCK TCPM). Others may drastically different. I would take as long as it needs to finish the fight. My motto is "make haste without being hasty", "using slow to yield to the fast" and "Don't fight fire with fire, be like water...".

    The rest of course is depended upon the contestants and it's highly speculative until proven with actual match.

    Mantis108
    "Mantis108" (if that is your real name) you clearly have too much time on your hands - instead try to practice the tiger spiritual. I'm sure I can help you out with this famous quote by me: "If you are a tiger, then you are no one's lesser. If you are a dragon, then you are no one's lesser. If you are an idiot, then you are everyone's lesser. If you are a tiger, then you are someone's lesser. The true tiger spiritual achieved through not just wisdom, but acknowledgement of your dark and light sides."

  6. #21
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Brookman
    "Mantis108" (if that is your real name) you clearly have too much time on your hands - instead try to practice the tiger spiritual. I'm sure I can help you out with this famous quote by me: "If you are a tiger, then you are no one's lesser. If you are a dragon, then you are no one's lesser. If you are an idiot, then you are everyone's lesser. If you are a tiger, then you are someone's lesser. The true tiger spiritual achieved through not just wisdom, but acknowledgement of your dark and light sides."
    What

    Excellent post from Mantis108
    A wise man knows, that to know is to know that to know is not to know

  7. #22
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    Agreed

    ...Good Effort Mantis108
    No "System" can out perform the limitations of your mind...

  8. #23
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    Vancouver, B.C. Canada
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    Smile Hi Guys,

    Thanks for the support. I really appreicate it.

    Warm regards

    Mantis108
    Contraria Sunt Complementa

    對敵交手歌訣

    凡立勢不可站定。凡交手須是要走。千着萬着﹐走為上着﹐進為高着﹐閃賺騰挪為
    妙着。


    CCK TCPM in Yellowknife

    TJPM Forum

  9. #24
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    I agree Mantis 108 has always been a great source of information. I also can see how the main question is seen as trolling. Is this style better then that style or my big brother can beet up your big brother… is a bit immature. I think it would have been better put to compare the strengths and weakness of each style, and how they can be used to counter each other. Much like mantis 108 did. To say that southern is better then northern is to say I train in southern and know nothing about northern styles, but since my Sifu said we’re better then we must be…. I have not seen much southern mantis but from what I did see it is mostly hand movements. I do like the lunging forward grabbing movements. I can not detail how I would fight any given style and it would be foolish to generalize it in that fashion. As even in the same style different people move differently. From my perspective I would be more interested in my opponents stature then style. I have not trained long enough to know this style or that style, so for me it is more important to understand my style. If the opponent is rooted or bigger then I am I would be more inclined to evade and trap the arm. I am a firm believer that if you can control the arm you can control the body. Even if it only gives you enough time to run away, and avoid getting the sh!t knocked out of you. If the opponent is smaller or more agile or just jumping around I would try to adhere to them and then find they weakest angle and knock them down, and of course if necessary run away. I do not believe in fighting someone else’s style. If they like to box or wrestle I am not going to try it their way I will stick with my own method. As for the challenge a the temple in Orlando, how about some dates and names it might be a bit more convincing if you could provide more then my Sifu said… Did this individual go to the temple and fight some one or was it more like they won in a tournament??? Seems any two equally skilled fighter have equal chance of winning and if one wins the first time the other may very well win the next. Any given Sunday.

    Happy Halloween everybody…
    RibHit
    fm
    RibHit
    “Being fast is fine but accuracy is everything.”
    Wyatt Erupt
    Feeling jumpy!!!
    Thread Killer...>>>
    Tommy M

  10. #25
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    Question Comparison of NPM and SPM

    I have a question in the comparison of NPM and SPM. Does SPM use the same 12 word poem? And how did SPM come about? I have heard some stories but I’m not sure if they were about SPM or just different versions of the NPM story. The whole kicks from the north and hands from the south is a bit general and has been used to describe kung fu as a whole and not so much individual styles. Would like to hear more about Southern styles. Not just PM.


    Thanks,
    fm
    RibHit
    “Being fast is fine but accuracy is everything.”
    Wyatt Erupt
    Feeling jumpy!!!
    Thread Killer...>>>
    Tommy M

  11. #26
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    depends on which line of SPM one follows. The origins or developments are explained differently, although several lines tie back to Fukien Shaolin of a Hakkanese monk. Some lines say the style was born of the observation of a fight between a mantis and a bird. Others may say that SPM isn't really mantis at all and that it was labeled that during dangerous times to hide it from persecutors and that it was developed entirely outside of any shaolin.

  12. #27
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    http://cclib.nsu.ru/projects/satbi/s.../wushu/sm.html - Great resource on SPM.

    But I'm really interested in reading about NPM. If anyone knows any informative sites can you please link?

    BTW.... SPM would OBVIOUSLY win! Why? Cause its my style. Am I terrible for saying that? I dont see why I would be. Its like me saying that the Eagles are the best. Why? Cuz I live in Philly! Its called pride and I very much enjoy rooting for the the home team just like I root for my style. I don't think its immature at all... I'm just having a little fun. But seriously though.... Jook Lum Southern Praying Mantis is ultimate. Seriously.

    J-Hon
    Last edited by J-hon; 11-02-2005 at 10:43 AM.

  13. #28
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    Thanks guys.
    J-hon I can agree with that. Cause the Buccaneers are the best and even though I live in the south I must root for the northern style cause that's the style I train in. So no that does make you a bad person, just misguided as far as the Eagles anyway, LOL. I am kidding since the Bucs will be lucky to pull 500 this year way there playing. Seriously though the style and techniques are important but it is the fighter that makes it mean something. I can do hook puck grapple all day long does not mean it will work as well for me as it would say mantis108 or others. I will have to check out the website later as I have to get to class.
    Thanks again,

    fm
    RibHit
    “Being fast is fine but accuracy is everything.”
    Wyatt Erupt
    Feeling jumpy!!!
    Thread Killer...>>>
    Tommy M

  14. #29
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    Wow. Mantis 108 That Was Deep Thanks For The Big Picture. I Think In Just Excited To Learn More About Both Styles Being That Im A First Year Student, The Way U Broke That Down Was Amazing

  15. #30

    who would win

    previously mega fist stated he knew the answer about who would win. And the winner is..............
    "All the skill in the world won't hold up to a real confrontation if you are too afraid to use it."

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