How do you fight a taller person?

[SimonM]

It may seem like I'm picking on you, but I'm not... I just don't like any of your posts

"safe ground environment" is about as overused as the "all fights go to the ground" thing. I work in a bar and have gone to the ground several times.

One time I was doing some sparring on concrete... The epitome of the "unsafe ground environment". I was fighting a guy whose standing game was better than mine so I decided to try and take it to the ground. I managed an opening for a throw leading off of a jab he left hanging out for a microsecond too long and hucked him to the ground. You know what? Throwing this guy over my back (IE: Up 6 feet) and then smacking him with the concrete ground didn't even wind him. He literally kicked at my legs once and rolled back to his feet because I was too slow going down and trying for a mount. My point? The ground is not necessarily fatal in the street. Now still I'd not want to be on the ground facing multiple opponents.... but I never have been.

[SimonM]

the punching hand is in motion. You would have to be blindingly fast to kick him while keeping contact with the arm. AND you'd still have to kick him with sifficient force. I'd love to see you pull it off though. really.

I don't think I even bothered replying to that one because I disagree with the entire pressure point median premise. But good retort without denying the premise in question.

[kidswarrior]

Many good posts/ideas here. Will just add my two cents in case I can offer something--and so help--in a way not already covered (I read about 2/3 of posts before jumping to the end).

With a taller person, what I would look for first, and what I try to teach my students, is to try to guage what we're up against (often we can tell in his posture, foot stance, demeanor). Much depends on the opponent. What opening might he be giving/ what opportunity is he presenting: e.g., is he stationary/stiff (so easy to move around or draw a bead on); is he primarily a boxer, so very strong and fast from the waist up, but maybe unprepared for leg attacks; is he a kickboxer and therefore maybe very fast in striking with all four limbs, but used to rules/gloves (and so open to fingers to eyes, nose, throat, strikes to groin); is he a grappler, trying for a takedown (I use longer strikes to keep him at a distance; with a taller person who is also a confident grappler, may have to chip away a bit to wait for the right moment for a finishing blow--much like a boxing jab to set up a left hook or right cross). Anyway, this doesn't completely answer the question, but in my mind, and if one of my students were asking this, it's where I'd begin. Then we could pick two or three techniques that might be pretty effective.

Second consideration is me--or you--or the student I'm instructing. What kind of fighter are we at heart: a striker, a grappler, a good mix; what am I naturally good at (e.g., I personnally have good hand speed and long arms, so at 50+, can still out 'box' most teenagers--but I'm a terrible grappler and always will be); do I like to relentlessly attack, and take the punishment he might dish out, or am I a careful fighter, waiting him out for just the right opening; is age a consideration (the older we get, the faster it pays to end it since I'll become winded more quickly), etc.

Anyway, lots of good material to work with on previous responses. Just thought I'd add some of my own impressions.

Peace.

[Mr Punch]

With a taller person, what I would look for first, and what I try to teach my students, is to try to guage what we're up against (often we can tell in his posture, foot stance, demeanor). Much depends on the opponent. What opening might he be giving/ what opportunity is he presenting: e.g., is he stationary/stiff (so easy to move around or draw a bead on); is he primarily a boxer, so very strong and fast from the waist up, but maybe unprepared for leg attacks; is he a kickboxer and therefore maybe very fast in striking with all four limbs, but used to rules/gloves (and so open to fingers to eyes, nose, throat, strikes to groin); is he a grappler, trying for a takedown (I use longer strikes to keep him at a distance; with a taller person who is also a confident grappler, may have to chip away a bit to wait for the right moment for a finishing blow--much like a boxing jab to set up a left hook or right cross). Anyway, this doesn't completely answer the question, but in my mind, and if one of my students were asking this, it's where I'd begin.

Welcome to the forum.

With respect, you've got a helluva lotta too much there! You're talking about a whole strategy for sussing out and weighing up your 'opponent' (I'm assuming the thread has moved on to the street, since this is the street forum):

1) If we're talking about the street; it isn't an 'opponent', it's a guy who may or may not have weapons, may or may not have friends, may or may not be on drugs and may or may not want to kill you.

2) You won't have time! I think I'm a pretty good judge of posture and things when I see someone walk across the room, but in the heat of the moment (and this isn't sparring or some kind of match where you sometimes get a couple of 'feeler' punches to see what they're made of) there is no chance.

All this assessment training will get your kids stabbed in a real fight.

Then we could pick two or three techniques that might be pretty effective.

Bingo! Stick to that! KISS!

BTW, of course your idea of working with your students' strengths and weaknesses is good.

Small technical points:

is he a kickboxer and therefore maybe very fast in striking with all four limbs, but used to rules/gloves (and so open to fingers to eyes, nose, throat, strikes to groin)

If he's some kind of kickboxer or not the chances are he'll have faster head movement and footwork than your chances of hitting him accurately in the eye with your fingers. The throat is also easy to cover AND usually covered by kickboxers etc, not to mention a small fast target. And the groin will not necessarily put someone out quick enough if at all.

[kidswarrior]

Welcome to the forum..

With respect, you've got a helluva lotta too much there!

OK, I can take that. I did go on and on. But it was a pretty sweeping question.

All this assessment training will get your kids stabbed in a real fight..

Actually, I 've lost 16 students in 16 years, and it's usually not using their heads/rushing that got them killed. (And ditto for three-five times that number who got injured but survived).

Bingo! Stick to that! KISS!

Well, the 'Stupid' part certainly fits I've got much to learn.

BTW, of course your idea of working with your students' strengths and weaknesses is good.

Yes, this is where my whole post was headed, but the preface is an important part of a martial arts student's training. No, it may not be simple--may take years to become proficient and quick--but still necessary, in my opinion.


Thanks for furthering my education, Ronin.

Peace.

[kidswarrior]

Guess what I'm really trying to say is, self-defense/protection and even combat is as much about awareness and smarts as technique. And I believe we can train that awareness and smarts to a degree. Or in the obverse, perfecting techinique without the mental training/mindset, while possibly OK for some, is not my way of practicing the arts.

Peace.

[Zaharia]

To be a proficient martial artist, one must learn to make quick judgements of ones opponent. What works on one is not nescessarily what will work on another