Selfless Rant (Training Methods)

[monkeyfoot]

Yes well I would hope that my kung fu would be used when I fight (although I doubt it would be purely mantis due to not having spent 10 years plus in the system).

What Im saying though is that no matter who you are, you cant play everything exactly by the book in a fight. Some of your movements will not be kung fu at all, or any martial art for that matter. When fights get close, grabby, and messy, style seems to go KAPPPOOOOP.

So what I was saying was, im not going to sacrifice my ass to the attacker merely because something isnt considered 'correct' to the style. If i need to smash his head on the wall.....hes gonna get it.

craig

[Wong Fei Hong]

I tottaly agree with a lot of these points, one of the guys i train with was a sea commando our equivalnt of a navy seal, basically there is only 8 of these guys per year trained out of 10,000
Thing is this guy has it in him to kick the **** out of ppl. If you took him and taught him control, the only thing it would do is ruin his abilities. Ive seen a lot of ppl who have been ****ed up by training all their lives to learn to pull punches.

[TAO YIN]

Seven!! Excellent reply.

"To be honest, I think that in some respects some of them (the untrained) have a slight advantage over us."

As Oso pointed out earlier, I also think ABSOFUCINLUTELY. One of my best, and worst students ever, was a certified schitzophrenic, while my other best and worst was a big angry dummy. Why I taught them I don't know, but anyways...

This whole deal of simplicity in bashing and being a basher, aside from many other things, is one of the main reasons I think MMA has dominated and will dominate until people start taking their blinkers off. As we know MMA is about method and function; it's not so much about theory and mystique. I guess there is much to be said about who is training what and if they are looking into the mirror or not. Some people are into forms and two man, while some people are into bagwork and fighting, while some people are into all of it.

[SevenStar]

I tottaly agree with a lot of these points, one of the guys i train with was a sea commando our equivalnt of a navy seal, basically there is only 8 of these guys per year trained out of 10,000
Thing is this guy has it in him to kick the **** out of ppl. If you took him and taught him control, the only thing it would do is ruin his abilities. Ive seen a lot of ppl who have been ****ed up by training all their lives to learn to pull punches.

I see the point you're trying to make and agree to some degree, but in regards to special forces guys, I think you're wrong. The thing with them is the mindset and discipline they have been trained to have. One of our bjj brown belts (he's also a judo black belt) was a SEAL. He's placed in every national level bjj tourney he's entered over like the past 3 years and he was at one time ranked like #2 in the world in judo.

Then also, the style they are training should probably be considered. If we put him in a point fighting style, then perhaps he would be affected...

[SevenStar]

Some of your movements will not be kung fu at all, or any martial art for that matter. When fights get close, grabby, and messy, style seems to go KAPPPOOOOP.

IMO, that is very martial. what is and isn't considered fighting goes well beyond what a style should or should not look like.

[Wong Fei Hong]

I see the point you're trying to make and agree to some degree, but in regards to special forces guys, I think you're wrong. The thing with them is the mindset and discipline they have been trained to have. One of our bjj brown belts (he's also a judo black belt) was a SEAL. He's placed in every national level bjj tourney he's entered over like the past 3 years and he was at one time ranked like #2 in the world in judo.

So what part did you disagree with ? you just evaluated what i said ?

[Becca]

However, the "purists" of TCMA as they call themselves seem to think that cross training is a sin and that their "traditional" art is all they need... Comments as to why you agree or disagree would be appreciated

My Sifu is something of a purist. He had his elbow broken a few months ago sparring with a more senior Sifu. He never missed teaching use a class, and his version of teaching is very much hands on. I'd say that if he feels that's all he needs, more power to him.

My question to you: Why are you more conserned with everyone else's traing and beliefs?!?!?!? To each their own.

NOW, GO TRAIN!!!

[SevenStar]

So what part did you disagree with ? you just evaluated what i said ?

I don't think that training the guy you were referring to would hurt him, provided he's training in a contact style.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

My Sifu is something of a purist. He had his elbow broken a few months ago sparring with a more senior Sifu. He never missed teaching use a class, and his version of teaching is very much hands on. I'd say that if he feels that's all he needs, more power to him.

My question to you: Why are you more conserned with everyone else's traing and beliefs?!?!?!? To each their own.

NOW, GO TRAIN!!!

Becca, I could care less how you or your Sifu train. My rant started because of those who claim that everything can be found in TCMA. Cross training in other styles can and will benefit you. By the way, I see in your profile you study Pai Lum, which is my primary style. This is a very good system, as you probably know, it is a hybrid of Five Animals, Pai's family style, Kenpo, Judo, and many other systems Daniel K. Pai learned and held rank in. Pai Lum is a hybrid cross training style. There are many ways to train and become a better fighter and the point I was trying to make was not to limit yourself to one thing or discipline.

And yes, I will go train as I do every night. But thanks anyway for the advice.

[Becca]

But you forgot to answer why the prattle of others bothers you so much...

And everything I need to learn at this stage of my training can be found in my style. I have also trained ninjitsu for 8 years. That is what I needed at that time and place in my training. Do you care ? No. And nor should you... Which reallly makes me wonder why you care about the beliefes of people who have even less in common with you than a fellow cross trainer.

And P.S. Traditional is more of a state of mind than a collection of movements...

[Chief Fox]

I would say that many kung fu styles (if not all) are made up from pieces of other styles. Mantis is influenced by Tiger and Monkey amoung other things. Wing Chun is influenced by snake and crane. So in essence, if you study a specific style of kung fu then you are cross training in other styles because of the influencing elements.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

But you forgot to answer why the prattle of others bothers you so much...

And everything I need to learn at this stage of my training can be found in my style. I have also trained ninjitsu for 8 years. That is what I needed at that time and place in my training. Do you care ? No. And nor should you... Which reallly makes me wonder why you care about the beliefes of people who have even less in common with you than a fellow cross trainer.

And P.S. Traditional is more of a state of mind than a collection of movements...

What bothers me is not TCMA, it's TCMA who have a watered down, non-sparring, too much emphasis on forms, style of martial arts that claim it is the most lethal and deadly art that exists yet they do not train in an alive setting. Do I care that these fools believe themselves to be something great, absolutely not. I do care about the ignorant novice martial artist who is looking for good training and doesn't know any better. Also, if you call an art that was used for fighting and killing traditionally a traditional art, it should contain elements of fighting, such as hard sparring, ground fighting, conditioning, and so on. It becomes a real problem when underqualified people spout off about being martial artists who are **** poor fighters. It makes the martial arts look like a joke and discredits those who are for real, and that is what I care about.

[SevenStar]

I would say that many kung fu styles (if not all) are made up from pieces of other styles. Mantis is influenced by Tiger and Monkey amoung other things. Wing Chun is influenced by snake and crane. So in essence, if you study a specific style of kung fu then you are cross training in other styles because of the influencing elements.

While that is true, cross training in the sense of "being complete" involves training a striking style and a ground style. Looking at it from that perspective, it is not crosstraining. Not only that, but you specifically aren't cross training. You are merely studying a style that is the result of someone else's cross training.