CLF's bread & butter techniques

[JAZA]

I agree with my friend Frank.
In my opinion if you close the doors of your hand to make a flat leopard fist you are making a solid beam like structure ready to support compression strains, but this structure is prone to fail on the doors( knuckles, wrists) if you apply little momentum like when you hit with an angle or the target moves when you connect it.
In the other side if you make a romboidal structure (like in the picture) you can hit hard "soft" targets and in the case of apply momentum or even hit a "hard target" you can collapse your leopard to a clenched fist quickly. It like a sismical structure, solid but mobile.

http://www.choyleefut.de/graphics/cl...5_PauChoy2.jpg
http://www.choyleefut.de/pages/masterclass4.html

In my opinion, it's not a question of mine is correct, yours is wrongs, just different perspective of the same style.

[hskwarrior]

see,

on a heavy bag tested out which would be the most effective way to throw a panther fist without injuring myself. So in the past i've tried a straight/flat handed panther fist and on more than one occasion after putting a little power behind the punch i found that one of two things were happening.

1) with a flat panther (no bends at all) my would collapse downwards and actually begin to hurt.

2) again with the flat panther, after striking a heavy bag i noticed my fingers would buckle upwards and felt as if they would break.

***Now, remember- i'm trying to strike with the same power as i would with a solid flat fist.

But after some fine tuning, i tried different degress of bends before i discovered that all it took was a very slight bend downwards (just a hair) and the panther fist became more powerful, and my fingers weren't bending in either direction at all. that is why im confident with the way i do the panther fist now.

Seriously, if your panther fist is too straight you are more likely injur yourself, and possibly never throw another one again.

peace.

[hskwarrior]

Jaza-your're the man!

That's exactly what im talking about. That first link is 99% the way i do it and found it to be a little more solid than your average panther.

the only thing i find fault in the way chan yong fa is holding that fist is his ring finger and pinky are sticking out just a little too much. amongst my classmates that is what we call the "UGLY" fist. His panther looks a little different than most.
but the idea is there.


try this. Make your panther fist. now pull the middle and ring finger away from the palm where only the index and pinky remain. Feel the pressure of those two fingers pressing into your palm. then add the other two fingers. Pressing inwards with the thumbtip and the pinky tip (all Inwards).

Can anyone tell me, if i take some photo's and save it on my computer, can i link the photo's from there or should it be on a website?

hsk

[Infrazael]

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess we still have alot to learn.

[hskwarrior]

okay, i tried to take some pictures and post it here but i don't know how to link just the photo instead of the whole website. but if you check out my site and go into "general applications" photo album you will see the photo's of the way i shape my panther fists.


http://www.hsclf.zoomshare.com

[Mano Mano]

My preference is for the panther fist with the thumb against index finger because of its stronger structure, however my Sifu uses the other panther fist.
From personal experience as I’ve been on the receiving end of both types from some of my si-hing’s and also some of my si-di (that Shaka Brown can be dam unpredictably fast), I found the panther fist that my Sifu uses does hurt more than the other and seems to be a lot more of a piercing strike.

[Eddie]

http://www.hsclf.zoomshare.com

nice view from your house. I love that mountain in the back. where do you live? do you live just outside the city?

[Shaolindynasty]

Gowgee- yes it is a fairly common tactic for us to "uproot" with those techniques. Especially the second one labeled "na".

[hskwarrior]

thanks eddie.

i live right outside of san francisco. to the right of that picture is the San Francisco airport. But yeah its a nice view, lots of planes flying over though.

can't lie, beats having to listen to gunshots all night long while wondering if one of them are going to him me.

But it gets so foggy here sometimes you can't even see the street below. but thats the way i like it. i love cold weather.

hsk

[Eddie]

cool. looks nice.
you must come and visit me sometime.

your pantters look very solid, ill give it a try.
do you ever practice panthers on boxing style focus mitts/ targets? they usually are pretty hard, and helps to condition finger knuckles

[hskwarrior]

eddie,

one of the ways i train my panther when not practicing is to lets say cup my left hand while striking it with my right panther (hard enough to buckle fingers).

Then when i worked in a warehouse i used to practice piercing cardboard boxes on the shelves as i walked by. there's nothing like the snap of a cardboard as you're walking by punching holes in them. lol

with my personal students yeah we use the little focus mits, sand, or even punching bags. I encourage my students to develop their panthers slowly, not too quick. Don't want any mishaps happening. For example, i was drinking one day at a picnic, and i saw a big chunk of ice and thought to myself "can you break that piece of ice with your panther?" so i hit it! Didn't break it one bit.

But i did manage to have a big chunk of meat torn from my knuckle. Lesson learned.! LoL

At my sifu's eddie, we have a big 8 foot banana bag about 100 pounds and i would strike that with my panther until i got it to move.

I do practice my panthers regularly, it is one of my favorite techniques next to tiger claws and sow choys. Love dem sow choys! Man i would hit that 100 pound banana bag with all i got doing sow choys until that bag begn to bend in half.


peace eddie.

hsk

[hskwarrior]

"Ice Don't Hit Back!!!"


LOL

[Eddie]

ja, i read before that you said you hit your panther fist into your hand, and i think its a pretty good exercise too.

heavy bag drills with panthers are also cool.

a month or so back, at the club i was working, Smirnof (sp?) had a promo and at the door, they had this big block of ice with a smirnof bottle inside and some slogans written in snow - you know, usual promo things. anyways, some of the guys at the door started talking about how they want to break the block of ice and started playing around with each other. Now this bloc of ice was about 15 cm thick, 70cm x 50cm big. i didnt think i would ever be able to break that, so i told the skinniest guy to give it a try. did all the usuall mumbo jumbo stuff where I tell him to hit throw the block of ice (my mr miagi impersonations) etc, and then stood back so he can hit the block of ice. thought he will hurt himself and then we can divert our attention elsewhere . Now this dude is a skinny Goth (I work at a Gothic/Electro Alternitive club), and really not into exercising or anything. He hit the ice block once, and broke the block of ice, it was so funny. made me realise its actually not so difficult to break the ice so to speak. anywways, thought it was a funny story to tell.

[Fu-Pow]

okay, i tried to take some pictures and post it here but i don't know how to link just the photo instead of the whole website. but if you check out my site and go into "general applications" photo album you will see the photo's of the way i shape my panther fists.


http://www.hsclf.zoomshare.com

Frank, judging from your pictures, it looks like we are pretty much saying the same thing. In the picture where you touch the thumb to your first finger .....the fingers are lined up with the top of the hand. When you don't touch, the fingers aren't lined up and when you hit they will fold back.

However, you can line up without touching the thumb. I think its the alignment of the fingers, bones in the hand and wrist that are important. If putting your thumb there helps you do that then more power to ya.

Nice discussion. Thanks for the pics.