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Thread: Testing

  1. #1

    Testing

    Next month, I am taking a test to become a Disehing. what were your test like to become a Disehing, Sehing, or Sifu
    "All the skill in the world won't hold up to a real confrontation if you are too afraid to use it."

  2. #2
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    Hi Shadow Skill,

    Si Hing means "elder brother", right? What does "disehing" mean though?

    Cheers - AQ

  3. #3
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    Dai Si Hing refers to the first student of a school.

  4. #4
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    si hing = older brother

    dai si hing = big oldest brother (this is the guy under sifu in the school)

    dai si hing is usually the instructor as well, but in traditional schools, you don't generally have two sifus in teh same school.

    Dai Si Hing will usually go out and open another school and in so doing become sifu of that school while his own sifu becomes si gung to his students.

    The reason trad schools don't have two sifus in the school is because of the correlation to 'father'. I.E you don't have two dads in the house.

    Not that it has to be hard and fast like that, just that that is how it is in many traditional kungfu schools.

    In wing chun (sometimes others), they use the term 'gau lin' (teach/practice) which means 'coach' in chinese. The coach is instructor in the same house as the sifu.

    Nowadays, the term sifu has come to mean a lot of things to a lot of different people. sort of a soup of ideas out there as to what a sifu is or is not. It's all good and frankly, the whole title and who's who stuff isn't important and certainly a name or a title says nothing about an individuals skill and ability in a martial art as we've likely all seen by now.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  5. #5
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    Clfnole is the most correct here.

    Si Hings are older students or older brothers.

    Dai Si Hing basically means you are the highest ranked or you are the very first student of your teacher.

    byt the way, clfnole, thanks for the vid, my sifu has received it and thanks you for the kind gesture. you did a good job the copy is great. the movie reminded me of like a soap opera more than a gung fu move as we know them...

    thanks again.,

    and oh, shadow skill, good luck.


    hsk

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by hskwarrior
    Clfnole is the most correct here.

    Si Hings are older students or older brothers.

    Dai Si Hing basically means you are the highest ranked or you are the very first student of your teacher.

    byt the way, clfnole, thanks for the vid, my sifu has received it and thanks you for the kind gesture. you did a good job the copy is great. the movie reminded me of like a soap opera more than a gung fu move as we know them...

    thanks again.,

    and oh, shadow skill, good luck.


    hsk
    Actually, in proper form, clfnole is correct. The dai si hing is the longest student in the school and classmate who has been with the sifu the longest.

    however, this is not always true. When I was in school, I became si hing to others who had been there longer, even though in actuality, they were my si hing. This is hwat happens when the titles are applied as ranks as opposed to just remaining as the old style traditional familial heirarchy.

    It's neither right nor wrong because in the end what really matters is whether you are on teh road to achieving kungfu or not.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  7. #7
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    how did you become a si hing over people who were your si hing in the first place?

    if you say because you learned more then them you are completely wrong, and is an egotistal thing because you now know more than them.

    regardless of skill in the hierarchy of the school especailly when its as traditional as mine, you will forever bow down to the si-hing -the first, very first, student. if not you may get booted.

    now there are times when i've been asked by my di -sihing to review him on his forms. does that make me his si hing? NO 100% no. he is still "THE" di sihing, and i recognize that.

    what you may need to do is realize that within a family there is always hierarchy, you big brother will never let his little brother take his place sort of thing.

    and if in your case that is what happened for you, then your situation was just an individual thing and won't cover most traditional schools.

  8. #8
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    In the traditional sense dai si hing is just the oldest student and nothing more. In many cases the dai si hing doesn't have the best skill level it is just he followed sifu first.

    To use it as a title is okay but it is "westernizing" what it really is. Chinese kung fu has a family hiearchy and people within the system know who is better than who so there is no competion with titles.

  9. #9

    humanity

    TCMA teaches humanity first, MA second - hence respect for heritage, your elders and people. so tai shi hing is sifu's first student similar to elderst son. regardless of MA ability.

    but in modern age, this is slightly greyish. in past students lived with their sifu but this is no longer true. tai shi hing is now equated with teaching assistant, hence I have several tai shi hings as several senior students have led classes for my sifu and he has called them tai shi hing.

    also, schools can have more then one sifu but must be at the same generation or different styles. same kf brothers can start their own school or more than 2 sifu's from different styles can share the same school.

    anyway, what kind of test are you doing and what will lead to?

  10. #10
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    Di Si Hing, biggest older brother. Our school is very traditional, and the Di Si Hing is the oldest Brother actively training.

    With that position comes responsibilities as well. Basically, making sure that no problems rise up to bother Sifu. Organising whatever needs to be organised amongst the other brothers and sisters. Supporting the Sifu and implementing his wishes in the class.

    While the Di Si Hing may teach, more often, he helps supervise the teaching done by the older Si Hing. His training begins to become that of learning how to teach, learning how to lead a school, learning to carry the responsibility. The Di Si Hing is generally considered the heir apparent.

    AT least, that's how our Sifu trains us in our school.

  11. #11

    Di Si Hing

    di si hing as it relates to me is that aside from his children I have been with him the longest ( in less u count the people who started before me and only show once evere blue moon). He has taught others before me but they are no longer in class. Di Si hing in our school is a rank like asst. instructor. I'm also aware it means big brother. and in that aspect that is also accurate.
    now the you guys have discussed what the title means. the question still remains... so what were / are your test like. thats what I'm most interestead in.
    "All the skill in the world won't hold up to a real confrontation if you are too afraid to use it."

  12. #12
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    Wasn't there a question in here somewhere?

    To get back to the original question:

    Next month, I am taking a test to become a Disehing. what were your test like to become a Disehing, Sehing, or Sifu
    I think what everyone here agrees on is that, titles such as Si-hing or Dai Si-hing are not traditionally associated with rank/skill. They traditionally refer to a 'pecking order' to when people began training with thier Sifu.

    I have seen schools have a Dai Si-Hing whereas he was the oldest active/currently training student in the school.

    I have seen it where the DSH is the best student in the school. The next one to take over the school or next in line for the lineage.

    We did not 'test' to become a Si-hing under my Sifu, and I do not test students in my school for that rank. But, I have heard of other schools doing that, and all I can say is "I have seen much worse things done to the culture surrounding CMA." If schools want to use it as a title to work for and to earn, cool. Nothing wrong with that. Its up to the school I believe, and the purpose of forums like this is to share information, NOT JUDGE. (that's my opinion, not judging or 'hating')

    Sidebar: Amongst my training brothers, I have older and younger ones. Not all my Si-hings have more knowledge than me or are better at KF than me. That is not what the relationship is about. You should always respect your Si-Hings - this is part of Chinese culture, just as we should always respect parents and elders (even though we may be smarter or know better than them )

    Just yesterday, I had one of my Older training brothers along with one of my Younger training brothers over at my school. Although our skill ranges vary, we each treat each other with respect, and I value all my Si-hing advice and suggestions. In my opinion, valuing these relationships helps to teach us humility, patience and to be virtuous.

    Just a thought...

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    Tooting my own horn for just a sec, our school is the current longest running and oldest KF school in America. so we are still very traditional.

    in our school the Dai Si Hing is my sifu's very first student. nothing more, nothing less. it has nothing to do with skill. it has everything to do with respect, regardless if you happen to be a better fighter than the Dai Si Hing.

    if one happens to dispute the legitimacy of the Dai Si Hing over skill then you are being the upstart. the one to cause drama in your school and can be the reason for getting booted.

    but to answer the original question, in the more private traditional schools there are no testings for Dai Si Hing, it is what it is.

  14. #14
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    I agree with HSK warrior.

    When there are several older si hing currently training, I think the Di Si Hing rises to the task. Its a natural leadership, skill and respect thing, it is given, not taken.

    In our school, we call the more senior members Uncles, and it is based upon age, not skill, however there is a correlation for the most part.

    If you are going to use rank, choose another measure. Fathers, Uncles, brothers and sisters supports a whole different aspect of a Pai (family). Rank is obvious to every brother and sister, my personal opinion is that marking it with belts is a commercial compromise to traditional teaching.

    Why is it so hard for some people to accept that the guy that joined the week before you will always be your older brother, even if he sux? What, none of you guys can best your real older brother at anything? And, if you can, doesn't he know it?

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    Exackery!!!!!!!!!:d

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