Houston Shaolin Kung Fu Academy & The Shaolin Monk Tour

[GeneChing]

You're fishing for some bizarre answer like "Xinghao teaches Bak Sil Lum." You can't accept the standard basic Songshan Shaolin curriculum of Xiaohong, Dahong, etc. So we're at an impasse. Now there are some lineages that run through Shaolin like Wu Gulun, etc. *and* there's no denying that there are more than a few wushu sanda 'monks' in America. As I've said before (which is the phrase most often used for trolls, isn't it?) Xinghao was a 1st-gen wushuguan monk. Anyone in that position had to be very diverse in his curiculum. Think about what that must have been like. He had to meet and greet visitors on a daily basis and more than a few were skeptics like yourself. He had to answer challenges and live up to the 'myth' of what a Shaolin monk had to be. And that position wasn't given to him, it was earned. He had to best thousands of students in the area, people that train constantly, many for more hours a week than most of us do for regular work.

Anyway, just to bait you a little more, what do you think of the other Houston monks? Perhaps someone can post their websites here too? I'll look them up when I have a few more moments, but if someone has quicker access....

[Songshan]

See I don't understand why you keep asking the question. You have been given the phone number to the school on several occasions. If you were truly interested in an answer you would pick up the phone and call.

Why are you dissin the school? Do you want to become a student? If not then whatever they teach is no concern of yours.

BD has a point. Bungbukuen can only repeat his one question over and over because he is making a statement more than a question. Maybe BBK should concentrate on his own training rather than putting down other schools.

[B-Rad]

So this is what it comes down to. When students of Houston Shoalin are pushed for a simple answer as to what system is being taught they go silient.

No they don't. You were givin a simple answer, you just chose to ignore it, or for whatever reason you don't understand it. And since the simple answers don't seem to work for you, you're just going to get more and more complex descriptions added to the chaos you created... it's kind of funny to watch

[Songshan]

Anyway, just to bait you a little more, what do you think of the other Houston monks? Perhaps someone can post their websites here too? I'll look them up when I have a few more moments, but if someone has quicker access....

Yep got em right here.....

Shi De Shan

Shi Xing Ying

Shi Yan Feng

Shi Xing Hao

[richard sloan]

Then they have the pretentiousness to just list 'traditional Shaolin'.

seems a little pretentious on your part actually.

maybe the part you are missing is that the form clusters in Shaolin such as Xiao and Da Hongs, the lohan clusters, etc are systemic, especially when combined with appropriate chan and other instruction vehicles.

Xiao Hong Chuan is the mother form of 18 other fists, for example...

For your basic premise to work there would have to be a provable break in transmission, in addition to the PRC influence of sport wushu, and there is where your premise falls flat on it's face. Because while there is obviously prc wushu there is also unbroken transmission within the traditional Ch'an families or camps such as within Su Xi's camp. Yong Xin himself seems to have recognized some misteps shall we say with this.

Songshan is not beholden to you to provide an answer better answered by his shifu.

Why don't you step up to your own plate, make the call, and report back rather than hound one student.

[bungbukuen]

It is clear that contemporary performance based wushu (i.e. chang quan as an example) and sanda make up a large component of the curriculum at Houston Shaolin. The school claims to also teach traditional Shaolin but makes no mention of any system. It is perfectly valid to ask what traditional Shaolin system is being taught at Houston Shaolin?

Cheers!

[Songshan]

[richard sloan]

It is clear that contemporary performance based wushu (i.e. chang quan as an example) and sanda make up a large component of the curriculum at Houston Shaolin. The school claims to also teach traditional Shaolin but makes no mention of any system. It is perfectly valid to ask what traditional Shaolin system is being taught at Houston Shaolin?

Cheers!

Of course you can ask. Duh. But you don't recognize the systemic cluster of Shaolin forms pinned together through chi kung and ch'an that is being presented by Houston Shaolin. Then you ask as if you are asking the whole world your question and pretend to be awed by the silence when only one student of Houston Shaolin even posts here. Maybe Songshan has only been training there 2 months, maybe 2 years who knows- the system is Shaolin, because while subsystems exist like the ones you mentioned, and were further developed upon leaving the temple, it is still accurate to say "Shaolin" is a system and this is what it is composed of- mother/father fist systems like tong bei and xiao and da hong, etc. You are looking to hear "Lohan" or "Black Tiger" or "Inverted Crushing Skull Fist System" or god knows what other stuff as if there is a complete list out there which you can cross reference but Shaolin has sets, form clusters, etc- styles/systems large and small- overall of it is the umbrella Shaolin which can be referred to as an umbrella system.

Your assumption is that Shaolin has no cohesive systemic curriculum to develop fighters fully in the round as it were and you are wrong for lots of different reasons.

I have news for you, if Houston Shaolin teaches san da the way I feel safe in assuming they do, then all the punches, kicks, throws come from TRADITIONAL Shaolin forms...no matter if they are used in wushu competitions- hence they are certainly accurate to claim they teach TRADITIONAL Shaolin.

Note that their claim has no need of attaching the word 'system,' since it is inherently implied.

You are probably being confused by many of the modern wushu performance team "monks" and shows, but before Yong Xin purged the temple most of the monks who came through its process were transmitted a curriculum that existed pre-1928 Shi You San attacks. And that is being unfolded piecemeal, unless you have the ability to invest 6-8hrs every day or are in the door...and even if you are in the door I would feel safe to say you are really just scratching the surface. It takes 3-5 years of just ji ben gong before you even have a foundation for the system to root in.

[kungfudork]

ok bungbukuen...i never get involved in this BS, but since you insist. i trained with shi xinghao for 3 years after meeting him in china. i didn't train chang chuan nor san da at the school. i stuck with the traditional stuff...learning basics and applications. if you have a problem with the school, which it is apparent that you do.....it sounds more personal than anything else, i can say you can come talk to me anytime you want. what is it that you train and how do you think it differs from what i have learned at shi xinghao's school. who is your teacher? why do you seem to attack the school with such enthusiasm as you do? i have nothing to hide and nothing to lose.....so tell me your story. i agree you are a troll, but you have as much right as anyone to state your opinion. so what is your problem with my shrfu's school? you doubt the ability of shi xinghao to teach application or any kind of fighting ability......i don't. just because the school has sanda and long fist in it's curriculum doesn't mean that is what it is based on....those aren't the main classes. actually you have to attend the traditional classes to even enroll for the sanda or long fist, because those aren't the basis of the school, but that is beside the point. i feel as though you are attacking the school and have something to gain from it......so let me know what that is. i would be more than happy to discuss this in any manner you like. you want to know what system we learn....it is the one that shi xinghao wishes to pass on to us. if you need to know how to contact me personally....just ask. i'm here. hope to hear from you soon!

laterz,
dieter wagner (yes, my real name...i have nothing to hide)

[richard sloan]

bong bo is a mantis form...

[Pk_StyLeZ]

BTW, you aren't part of Deshan's school, are you?

HAHAHAHA LOLZ OMG HAHAHHA I CANT BELIEVE YOU SAID THAT GENE
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHA

good one

hi my shaolin brother =)
i been missing =) and i come back and i see all this crap. i read 4 pages and i was hoping to read more info on the actualy performance it self. but boo none. im going to leave my opinion out on this, cause obvously this guy not going to change his mind and i got better stuff to do then try to convince him. he is no one to me. not on my level, got nothing to prove to him. =)

but yeah. is anyone attending this *show*. if so when?i am going on the first at 7pm. =)
say hi to me =D

[bungbukuen]

I wanted to learn more about what specific system was taught at Houston Shaolin.

Richard you are going in the opposite direction from this discussion - I am looking for specifics and you are making spectacular generalizations. I do not know what you are basing your Shaolin Umbrella system on because you provided absolutely no details on it, except for making a quick and vague reference to Tong Bei (I am assuming the system) and two forms from the Hong Jia system (Xiao Hong and Da Hong Quan). In a previous thread titled "Where did kungfu come from?" you made the same kind of braod based generalizations without providing any specific facts with regards to system techniques, tactics, principles, strategies, training protocol, etc... There you were also accused of 'blurring the lines of systems / styles'. Quite obviously you are attempting to do the same thing here again.

My only assumptions come from what I have read on the Houston Shaolin website or on this forum. It is qutie simple. I have asked numerous times on this thread but no one has provided any relevant details with regards to what specific traditional Shaolin system of combat is being taught at Houston Shaolin? From what I have gathered so far they are teaching a mish mash of contemporary wushu, sanda, and an assortment of modified forms.

Some students say they train applications (kungfud0rk), some people say the applications are all trained in sanda (Richard Sloan), some people said they do not train applications (drunkmunky), and some students do not know altogether (Songshan). You guys are making a mess of things and I just want to know what system they study. It is not a trick question.

Cheers!

[richard sloan]

accused of...?

LOL.

this has to be one of the worst distortions of an exchange I have honestly ever read.

so reading is not exactly fundamental for you.

This will help you in future exchanges and I urge you to enroll as fast as possible, otherwise this will be as tedious as ascertaining which dries faster, taupe or burnt sienna.

http://www.rif.org/

[Songshan]

so reading is not exactly fundamental for you.

This will help you in future exchanges and I urge you to enroll as fast as possible, otherwise this will be as tedious as ascertaining which dries faster, taupe or burnt sienna.

http://www.rif.org/

hahahaha

but yeah. is anyone attending this *show*. if so when?i am going on the first at 7pm. =)
say hi to me =D

I will be at the early show for sure...but probably not the late one (gotta work). If I do go to the 7pm show I will stop by and say hi. Its been a few years since I seen ya Mark but I remember who you are

and some students do not know altogether (Songshan).

My only question to you is why don't you call the school? Oh yeah by the way......bungbukuen.....we train traditional shaolin.

Super Cheers!

[Songshan]

ok bungbukuen...i never get involved in this BS, but since you insist. i trained with shi xinghao for 3 years after meeting him in china. i didn't train chang chuan nor san da at the school. i stuck with the traditional stuff...learning basics and applications. if you have a problem with the school, which it is apparent that you do.....it sounds more personal than anything else, i can say you can come talk to me anytime you want. what is it that you train and how do you think it differs from what i have learned at shi xinghao's school. who is your teacher? why do you seem to attack the school with such enthusiasm as you do? i have nothing to hide and nothing to lose.....so tell me your story. i agree you are a troll, but you have as much right as anyone to state your opinion. so what is your problem with my shrfu's school? you doubt the ability of shi xinghao to teach application or any kind of fighting ability......i don't. just because the school has sanda and long fist in it's curriculum doesn't mean that is what it is based on....those aren't the main classes. actually you have to attend the traditional classes to even enroll for the sanda or long fist, because those aren't the basis of the school, but that is beside the point. i feel as though you are attacking the school and have something to gain from it......so let me know what that is. i would be more than happy to discuss this in any manner you like. you want to know what system we learn....it is the one that shi xinghao wishes to pass on to us. if you need to know how to contact me personally....just ask. i'm here. hope to hear from you soon!

laterz,
dieter wagner (yes, my real name...i have nothing to hide)

Dieter???? My god, your still alive!!!! What's up?