Why is this not Understood?

[ronro]

I was talking to Jared1211 who only trains his phoenix fist by substituting an open hand blow.

However Gabe, I think you are making exactly the same mistake because you only train it with protective gear. This means you are not actually hitting people with it and so you can't know its capabilities in an actual fight.

*awaits streetfight story featuring PE fist in starring role*

[SevenStar]

Now what you're doing is changing my words around. Did I say one time that my style was too bad for MMA? No, I am not training my style for MMA. It's as simple as that. Not because I'm afraid or that it is too bad for tournaments. Simply because I am taking martial arts. Not for tournaments but for self defense and my love for martial arts. Get your facts straight before you point your finger and say I said something that I didn't. A fighter efficient in SPM could fight in MMA, more power to him if he does, but I'm not.

1. my facts are straight
2. get YOUR facts straight. I wasn't talking to you. I was responding to your set of generalizations with another set of generalizations.
3. yes, add some ground work and an spm guy could fight in mma. ANY style cna be used in mma...

On the other note. Yes, I would do it in a normal fight because I'm doing the same thing I would with my open hand, but I change the shape of my hand and that's all. If anyone here knows about the phoenix eye they know they train it over and over and over again. It gets really effective.

I used to train the phoenix eye all the time when I was in CMA. But I never used it in sparring. Guess what? I have never used them in a fight, either.

I also train judo. Out of near 100 throws, I have used about 3 in a real fight and 8 in competition. Why? because those are the same ones I use when I randori.

[gabe]

I was talking to Jared1211 who only trains his phoenix fist by substituting an open hand blow.

However Gabe, I think you are making exactly the same mistake because you only train it with protective gear. This means you are not actually hitting people with it and so you can't know its capabilities in an actual fight.

*awaits streetfight story featuring PE fist in starring role*

You are not even worth replying to. If you've never experienced anyone using it against you, or don't have a clue how to use it, what's your opinion worth?

[SevenStar]

Actually, you wouldn't use it in a real fight. Because you don't train it.

What makes you think if you do train it, you can't use it? And when I say train, I don't mean forms so don't bother with that line.

LOL. I used to, and I never used it then either. and you need to read more closely. I was talking to jared who uses an open hand instead of the phoenix eye.

[SevenStar]

You are not even worth replying to. If you've never experienced anyone using it against you, or don't have a clue how to use it, what's your opinion worth?

possibly. But you don't know what his experience is, do you?

[SevenStar]

1. Some do...

2. Some do...

3. Some don't...

4. Some do...usually the ones that can make it work....

5. Chi isn't really about putting anything INTO anything external. When you strike with chi power it's like condensing that energy into your fist (for eg) to make you hand harder and therefore inflict more damage. You can still do this with a glove on but the chi doesn't 'pass thru' it. When people talking about hitting with 'chi' (ie passing chi into someone elses body) they are probably talking about the effects that are associated with using chi to perform a strike with great 'ging'.
Or they are jokers with fantasy powers......

completely agree. These were merely generalizations in response to the poster's initial generalizations.

[SevenStar]

Why do people love to use strawmen?

Anything can be deadly on the street.

If you understood that some use their hands differently, you wouldn't be expecting them to perform with the same equipment you do. If someone develops a high level of skill with a gun, why should they be able to enter an archery contest. Are you going to try to lecture on the overlap between those skills? Or which is more effective on the street?

You use what you train, right? Why do you expect people to use what you train, and not what they train?

If you debate, at least have a valid point. I wasn't talking about ANYTHING that you just stated. However, to address your "point" (i use that term loosely) Any manner that you use may use your hands which cannot be used in sparring with a decent contact level, should be questioned, IMO.

[gabe]

If you debate, at least have a valid point. I wasn't talking about ANYTHING that you just stated. However, to address your "point" (i use that term loosely) Any manner that you use may use your hands which cannot be used in sparring with a decent contact level, should be questioned, IMO.

From your posts, I now see you were just making generalizations to make a point.

But to respond, it seems very clear Ronro does not make any effort to train it. If you don't try, or already have dismissed it, what's the point in arguing.

To your second point, we do spar with it. Where did you miss that? We wearing mobile pads on our chest and sometimes masks, which all allow a great deal of contact. And I've repeatedly said, contact and sparring is essential.

Now as to the point I was making, you have great expertise in your judo. You make several techniques work in competition and in the street. That's what you train. You can make things work in your chosen competitions and your training is suited accordingly. Why not respect other formats that don't conform to your competitions or your methods of training. You have repeatedly said that all styles should be usable or adaptable to all formats. What if those 3 moves you have such skill in didn't conform to a particular competition. Why would I expect you to be able to compete there? And if you are able to use it in the street, why would anyone criticize you at all? Maybe you see my point now. But maybe not.