MTV2's FINAL FU

[Average Joe]

Tai kwan dorcc that has to sum up the entire show. It is nothing like what I expected to see either and the fact that one of the competitors is complaining that the competition is bogus is finally a moment of truth about it. And yes the show should be called the final do but since fu means man I guess it is no matter that it is chinese. Just a great shame that there is very little chinese martial representation.

[Shaolindynasty]

especially if they did it in a pit of nacho sauce.

Wouldn't that burn???

[amphymixis]

I enjoyed watching their attempts at the horse stance. why were they acting like they never heard of the horse stance??! Isn't that a basic kungfu exercise? most black belts I know can hold that position for long periods of time without breaking a sweat, but the final fu idiots struggled with two minutes. and these people are suppose to be world champs.

[Shaolinlueb]

the horse stance issue.

1. you said they were all tae kwan do'ists.
2. how many tae kwan do schools you know practice the deep horse stance?
3. for not ever practicing it, they didnt do too bad form the sound of it.

4. its mtv they jsut cater to what people want. you all see the gymnastics challenge where they were all jumping around and flipping and ****. i was like wtf... xma gay.

*edit
by no way am i defending this show. i fvcking hate it

as for the coce'd up catfight in a pit of nacho cheese sauce, bring it ON BABY!!! id pay ppv for that ****.

[Hieronim]

.thats like 20 or 30 blows landed each.....and neither one got hurt...WTF?

boxers go through 10 rounds and often neither get hurt or knocked down, wtf.

[Hieronim]

I caught the last ten minutes of an episode last night. The two guys with the lowest points had to "spar." They called it light contact sparring or some such, but when one guy made the slightest of contact with the other guy's head, they warned him, then deducted a point. It looked like an old school girly girl slap/pillow fight. One guy had the other one backing up the whole fight, was totally dominating him in their little silly game of tag, and still lost on points.

There's an XMA guy on the show, and they actually list that as his style. Nuff said.

I've said before on these boards that point sparring is the devil (more or less). It actually trains people to be worse fighters than if they had no training at all. Just watch an episode, and my point will be made, you'll see guys wading into each other throwing rapid fire strikes without any structure (because raw number of hits is all that counts), and without any effort to protect their heads. And find me one clip of a kung fu fioght on the net that doesnt look like a *****/slap fest, esp with wing chun.

My favorite part is the collective delusion among the participants. It takes me back to some of my very early training. The people participating really think that their performance in this competition represents some indication of genuine martial prowess, like the guy that can do a flying spinning back kick the highest and ****hest is the most dangerous person on the planet. I just can't believe there are still people who are so naive.

This show sucks ever so badly, because I also can't look away from such a trainwreck.

first off it isnt point sparring, because they dont stop after getting hit like in those old karate tourneys they kep going so its full contact. And secondly hitting to the head is also illegal in kyoukishin and almost any karate style. Watch that movie fighting black kings where thos ekung fu guys get killed by them.

[Hieronim]

Everyone that has anything to do with that show deserves an "extreme asswhoopin'.

I think its would be a bad idea for any real fighter to go on that show.
Wing chun especialy. The challenges and more so the sparing would be super stacked against you i.e. jumping kick worth 3 points. How much do we train ariel kicks in wing chun. And these challenges. you really dont need and fighting ability at all. Not to mention i just know that I would get kicked off first time i tried to fight because when the fists start flying i am going to punch one of them dudes in the face without thinking about it and knock thier ass out.
The only challenge i kinda wanna see are the one where they have to hold the bowls on thier arms and keep em stait long as pos.....who wants to bet these TKDers all drop it in no time.

lol you dont even have enough control to hit someone below the head you have no skill, thats like saying oh if I fought in the ufc I would just use my dim mak and kill them casue when the fists start flying I cant help myself.

[dwid]

first off it isnt point sparring, because they dont stop after getting hit like in those old karate tourneys they kep going so its full contact. And secondly hitting to the head is also illegal in kyoukishin and almost any karate style. Watch that movie fighting black kings where thos ekung fu guys get killed by them.

Full contact? You're an idiot. Ever hear of "continuous point sparring." There is nothing full contact about final fu.

As far as your comments about boxing. Strike two. Nobody goes 10 rounds boxing and is not hurt. They maybe don't show it during the match because of adrenaline and whatnot, but those guys are like walking bruises for the next several days. The difference is that the final fu peeps, being so unused to any physical contact at all in their combat simulations are just gigantic p@ssies who treat minor contact as the end of the world.

[Hieronim]

there is no such thing as continuous pioint sparring. if its ocntinuous its not point sparring. Just because they dont hit hard doesnt mean they cant, or what you see on tv could be deceiving. How do you know they arent bruised up too afterwards? And most kung fu people are pussies btw that dont do anything regarding contact, and fight like nothing out of their style.

[godzillakungfu]

there is no such thing as continuous pioint sparring. if its ocntinuous its not point sparring. Just because they dont hit hard doesnt mean they cant, or what you see on tv could be deceiving. How do you know they arent bruised up too afterwards? And most kung fu people are pussies btw that dont do anything regarding contact, and fight like nothing out of their style.

Really?




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No it isn't full contact. Someone lied to you.

[Hieronim]

whats the difference between that and full contact than? how is kyoukishin karate full contact but that not?

[GLW]

Just for some clarification:

To my knowledge, one of if not the first time Continuous Sparring was done was way back in 1986 or 1987. It was BEFORE Sanshou came out and was an attempt to do something that was more real but not as big of an insurance nightmare as Full Contact. It was tried first in the Chinese Martial Arts only events pioneered by Jeff Bolt. At that time, No one had seen something that was NOT the old 3 point type of fighting that was so common at Karate events.

As things developed, it was seen as a bridge to get to Sanshou....and then Sanshou pretty much became a beginning and end in itself. On the way to that, somehow the KArate events sort of adopted the idea as well...but kept some of their point fighting ideas...like not allowing strikes to the back and such.

The most recent incarnation of the rules on the Chinese Arts side come from the US Wushu Union. Most Chinese events use some or all of these rules or slight variations thereof. The Sanshou rules are pretty standard as well.

The Continuous Sparring rules are typically as follows :

1. Protocol
a. Starting the Match
1. (1) Each fight will begin with the fighters facing each other approximately 15 feet apart.
2. (2) The fighting will be continuous with no stopping except for clashing, illegal activity, injury or any other reason deemed fit by the judging panel.
b. During the Match
1. (1) A Break will be called by the Referee should any of the following events occur:
1. (a) Head contact that might result in an injury or a call for Warning/Disqualification.
2. (b) A competitor aims for or hits an illegal target.
3. (c) A competitor successfully applies a series of repeated unanswered techniques to the opponent.
4. (d) One or both competitors goes to the floor.
5. (e) When any Judge signals that they have seen a competitor commit a violation.
6. (f) When the Referee needs to stop action to prevent injury.
7. (g) When either or both fighters go out of bounds
2. (2) The Referee will restart the match after a stop in the action in the same way it originally began.
2. Rules
a. Level of Contact
1. Technical Fighting shall be light contact and shall emphasize the control of technique and finesse and not the use of excessive force. (2) Light Contact is defined as contact that causes no bruising or injury to the opponent and does not move the opponent from a stable stance. Contact to the head should not cause the head to whip. (3) Excessive Force is defined as anything that is not light contact. For example: (a) A head strike that results in bleeding, whipping of the head and/or neck, bruising or swelling of the face. (b) Unreasonable force to the body, for example, a kick that moves an opponent from a stable or rooted stance.
b. Legal Contact Areas
1. (1) Torso - front, sides, and rear kidney-area
2. (2) Outside of thighs
3. (3) Outside of shins
4. (4) Entire arm
5. (5) Front and side of head gear
c. Legal Non-Contact Target Areas: Please note that these areas are legal for non-contact techniques only. Any contact to these areas will result in a Warning or Disqualification.
1. (1) Front of face
2. (2) Horizontal strikes across the top of the head gear
d. Legal Techniques
1. (1) Punches
2. (2) Kicks
3. (3) Open hand strikes to body targets only
4. (4) Sweeps to the outside of the opponent's front leg
e. Illegal Target Areas
1. (1) Neck
2. (2) Spine
3. (3) Groin
4. (4) Front, inside or back of legs
5. (5) Knee joint
6. (6) Ankle joint
f. Illegal Techniques
1. (1) Knee strikes
2. (2) Elbow strikes
3. (3) Finger strikes
4. (4) Take-downs or throws
5. (5) Joint locking or breaking attempts
6. (6) Head butts
7. (7) Biting
8. (8) Floor or ground fighting
9. (9) Open hand strikes to the head
10. (10) Sweeps to an opponent's back leg or sweeps that attempt both legs of an opponent
11. (11) Sweeps to inside of the leg
12. (12) Dangerous blind attempts at spinning hand or foot strikes
g. Warnings shall be issued by the Referee for any of the following violations:
1. (1) Execution of any Illegal technique
2. (2) Contact to any illegal or non-contact target area
3. (3) Excessive force (without malice or intent)
4. (4) Failure to break on the call
5. (5) Running out of the ring
6. (6) Exposing an illegal target area
7. (7) Execution of blind techniques
8. (8) Any coaching from the sideline
h. Cautions—A caution shall be issued by any judge or by the Referee for the following violations:
1. (1) Equipment or clothing violations—Equipment not legal or in poor condition, wearing jewelry, spitting out mouth piece, etc. (Note: a competitor who comes to his/her match with improper equipment or clothing will be issued a caution immediately and have one minute to retrieve appropriate equipment/clothing.)
2. (2) Any other action not covered by the rules in which safety is an issue.
3. (3) Two cautions shall equal one warning.
i. Disqualification
1. (1) A competitor shall be disqualified immediately upon accumulation of three Warnings.
2. (2) Execution of a technique that causes the opponent to bleed will also result in Disqualification. Note: bleeding from a self-inflicted wound is not cause for the opponent's disqualification.
3. (3) Competitors who are disqualified in a match shall be considered to have lost that match and shall be entitled to whatever award, seeding, etc. the match loser is entitled.
j. Expulsion
1. (1) Expulsion will result from deliberate or serious violations of the rules, such as:
1. (a) Deliberate excessive force/intent to injure
2. (b) Deliberate targeting of an illegal area, for example: deliberate targeting of face, top of head, back of head, spine, etc.
3. (c) Deliberate violation of any rule
4. (d) Rude or belligerent behavior
5. (e) Use of objectionable or abusive language by a contestant or by his/her coach, schoolmates, etc.
6. (f) Commission of any infraction that would incur a warning that also results in serious injury to the opponent.
2. (2) A competitor can be expelled without having previously received any warnings.
3. (3) Competitors who are expelled will not be awarded any placing, seeding or ranking, nor will they be allowed to continue in the fighting. However, all results to the point of expulsion will remain unchanged
6. Judging Guidelines: Each competitor shall be scored based on demonstration of fighting skills in the following five categories:
a. Attack Skills
1. (1) Accurately aims techniques at target areas without simply "flailing" arms to hit something
2. (2) Begins an attack sequence and changes smoothly/naturally to defense if opponent counters attack
3. (3) Creates openings using combinations of attacks, rather than trying to overcome opponent with a single, forceful technique.
4. (4) Controls speed and power in attacks; does not punch/kick as hard as possible
b. Defense Skills
1. (1) Blocks incoming attacks effectively
2. (2) In addition to blocking, uses footwork and body motion to defend against and evade opponent's attacks
3. (3) Converts blocking/evasion naturally into counter-attacks with techniques aimed at target areas
4. (4) Blocks/counters without endangering self
c. Body Motion
1. (1) Shows naturalness, fluidity, and connectedness in movements
2. (2) Utilizes movement of the entire body (waist and spine) instead of isolated arm/leg strength
3. (3) Shows efficient motion and directed energy; does not appear rushed or overworked; does not "bounce" and "jab" wasting effort
4. (4) Advances and retreats using stable stance and good footwork without losing balance
d. Reaction Skills
1. (1) Reacts to opponent; moves naturally in response to an attack or counter
2. (2) Shows adaptability in application of attack and defense techniques
3. (3) Turns a defensive situation into an attack and vice-versa.
4. (4) Demonstrates ability to capitalize on opponent's weaknesses or mistakes.
e. Overall Impression
1. (1) Uses a variety of footwork, hand/leg techniques, attack combinations, defensive maneuvers and counter-strikes
2. (2) Controls the match through either a variety of successful attacks, or the ability to defend and successfully counter the majority of the opponent's attacks
3. (3) Utilizes the ring area effectively and stays in ring
4. (4) Does not lose composure; shows concentration and calm demeanor
5. (5) Displays obvious elements of a Chinese martial arts style


Which is a lot more open and alive than what the MTV show allows.... No strikes to the back...what is THAT all about.

[Hieronim]

so basically its liek full contact but with more rules and restrictions? Isnt mma like teh street but with more rules/restrictions? or at least thats what the jkd/mma faboys claim when they want to claim how tough they are.

No strikes to the back...what is THAT all about.

do boxers allow strikes to the back or the back of the head/neck area? do muay thai allow shin kicks to the lower back? does muay thai allow judo throws? does muay thai allow slams? why not? heck muay thai allows almost no samdup grappling.

[canglong]

Girl Fight on Oxygen this show is for real highly recommend watching this one.http://www.oxygen.com/

[wushu24]

If this show was on ESPN, I would be disappointed. But it's on MTV2, targeting young teenagers to maybe someone in their early 20's. It's just another reality tv show, with a slight martial flair. Kids who have never had any martial arts experience will enjoy it, and may even sign up at their local school.

It's entertainment, and although the sparring matches kill me, it's better than road rules or some other reality tv show.