Involved in arrest this morning.

[KC Elbows]

I don't agree with some of the criticisms of technique or approach, but the whole "heroism is the only way to go" lacks reality of any sort. If you haven't had to walk away from a situation because you could do nothing to change it, called the police when it was probably all over, and not liked it, then you were lucky.

MOST people do what they can to help things, MOST of the time. I've yet to meet anyone who does so all the time, I suspect they're dead.

[Chief Fox]

So I'm driving down the street with my 4 year old son in the back. As I'm driving I see over on the side walk some guy beating up a girl. Before I realize I had driven past. I go around the block and come back. I pull up to the curb half way out in traffic and lean on the horn. I stay in the car and yell at the guy, "If you hit her again, I'm calling the cops!". He comes up with a few excuses like, he was helping her, she fell down, stuff like that. Each time I say "NO! you were beating her up, I saw it and if you hit her again, I'm calling the cops!". The girl starts to say, "yeah, he's gonna call the cops!". I tell her that she needs to stay away from him and I tell him that he needs to go cool off. He leaves.

I stayed in my car and could have driven away at any time. I stayed in the car because I'm not interested in having my son witness me being killed. I was half way out in traffic drawing attention to myself so cars would have to go around me. I used a firm voice the whole time. I don't even have a phone so I really couldn't have called the cops anyway.

I kinda feel like I did the minimum. BUT, the minimum worked. I helped that girl.

[neilhytholt]

The last time I some poor guy being hassled, there was this little guy, about 4'8". He was trying to steal a cart full of groceries from the supermarket, and literally 5 cop cars were there, and this female cop had this poor guy on the ground, with his arm stretched behind at a very uncomfortable angle.

I almost ... almost ... stepped in and told her to go easy on the guy, but I feared for my own safety especially with the show of firepower and force.

So I just walked by and walked away ... still kindof guilty about that one. I mean, the poor guy was just trying to feed his family. Didn't need to get abused like that.

[PangQuan]

sometimes the best and only thing you can do is make a phone call. not every situation can be properly handled by one gung ho individual.

its the mentality that someone else will take care of it that makes the difference.

when you see a horrible car accident take place, do you keep driving or do you stop, get out and help as much as possible.

its not always a serious dangerous situation that is in question. sometimes its just going out of your way to help.

i for one have been in a situation where i needed someone to step outside the box and help. with out that help i would likely be dead. and i have myself helped where no one else was near or could help.

often times its not about heroics, often it comes down to you are the only one that can do anything and either you do or dont. no heroics considered.

[KC Elbows]

So I'm driving down the street with my 4 year old son in the back. As I'm driving I see over on the side walk some guy beating up a girl. Before I realize I had driven past. I go around the block and come back. I pull up to the curb half way out in traffic and lean on the horn. I stay in the car and yell at the guy, "If you hit her again, I'm calling the cops!". He comes up with a few excuses like, he was helping her, she fell down, stuff like that. Each time I say "NO! you were beating her up, I saw it and if you hit her again, I'm calling the cops!". The girl starts to say, "yeah, he's gonna call the cops!". I tell her that she needs to stay away from him and I tell him that he needs to go cool off. He leaves.

I stayed in my car and could have driven away at any time. I stayed in the car because I'm not interested in having my son witness me being killed. I was half way out in traffic drawing attention to myself so cars would have to go around me. I used a firm voice the whole time. I don't even have a phone so I really couldn't have called the cops anyway.

I kinda feel like I did the minimum. BUT, the minimum worked. I helped that girl.

You should have used a guillotine choke.

[PangQuan]

no, no...monkey steals peaches is what that situation called for.

[KC Elbows]

Now that I've thought about it, not only should you have choked that guy out, but then you should have choked your own son out for sitting there and being like those other do nothings on this thread, then commenced to beat that woman senseless for not applying situational awareness and aliveness training in her life. Only then would all the loose threads of justice have been tied tight.

Next time you're in a similar situation, remember what I've told you.

[neilhytholt]

BTW if you stay out of parks at night then you'll never come across somebody being raped in a park at night.

And anyway, how do you know they're getting raped and not just having a good time?

So the easiest thing is just stay away from parks at night.

[KC Elbows]

no, no...monkey steals peaches is what that situation called for.

No, far too style specific a choice.

You need to remember, the only reason anyone does anything is to then post about it and soak in the adoration of the forum members. If you use monkey steals a peach, you will have to deal with twenty pages of "how did you test that against a resisting opponent", whereas you can do a choke and then point to the move in your form, choke, oh, we call that "anaconda doesa what she wanna".

[DragonzRage]

shaolintiger,

As a police officer, here's my take: First off, good on you for stepping in to help an innocent and defenseless person. Different cops might tell you different things, but I for one have no issue against you stepping in for a situation like this. Now if you were like this one fellow I had last week who rushed out of his house to confront a group of chollos tagging a wall across the street... yeah that would've been pretty stupid and not worth it. But when a defenseless lady is at risk of getting hurt or killed, I say its the right thing to do.

I don't have a problem with the fact that you took action, but I might have a problem with the way you did it. If you had a cell phone on you, I think you should've hung back for a second and put in a quick 911 call before stepping in, just so you know you already have a unit rolling. Although it ended harmlessly enough, you could've been stepping into the fight of your life for all you knew. You were unarmed. And to step into that without ensuring that you have back up on the way is not the smartest thing to do for obvious reasons. Of course if she was already getting beaten, then to not step in right away would definitely jeopardize her life. From what you described, it doesn't sound like that was the case though.

As has already been beaten to death on this thread, the whole thing with knee riding suspect #1 while suspect #2 is standing behind you was pretty stupid. Unfortunately, martial arts training in general tends to teach certain bad habits for dynamic street situations, especially when it comes to tunnel vision. You're so used to going toe to toe or grappling with a single unarmed opponent that when something like this incident happens, you instinctively revert to your training. It sounds like the guys you ran into were fairly harmless clowns, as most of these trolls are. But there is a significant minority of them who are desperate/stupid/crazy enough to kill you without thinking twice about it. There's a huge homeless problem in my city, and you'd be amazed at the type of crap we find on them sometimes. They carry shanks, belt buckle knives, brass knuckles, clubs, etc. A lot of them attach big padlocks to the end of a chain, using this as a makeshift slungshot. We even find guns on them occasionally (but rarely). On top of that, a lot of them have at least some kind of disgusting disease(s) festering in their blood. It indirectly endangers your life just to have them bleed on you... god forbid you run into one that bites.

SO anyway, when you walk into a situation like this, you gotta make sure you maintain a tactical mindset and keep "the big picture" in view. I was a martial artist before I became a cop, and although it equipped me with good physical capability to deal with some of these ****heads out there, I definitely had to unlearn the stupid things that martial arts training taught me as well. IMO, being MMA'ists in particular tends to make us a bit overconfident in our abilities out on the streets. As weak as some of the traditional guys are, a lot of them at least tend to think in a paranoid/survivalist mindset, which is actually very useful for practical purposes. But as MMA'ists, I think we're so used to actually kicking a$$/taking punishment and physically dominating people that some of us develop an unconscious "superman" complex, which causes us to strut around a bit too confidently and possibly make poor decisions in real life or death situations.

Anyway, hindsight is always 20/20 and at the end of the day you helped an innocent person and got two ****heads off the streets. So good job. As much as I hate being a monday morning quarterback regarding an incident I did not even witness, I just wanted to put in my 2 cents. You sound like a good guy and I just don't wanna see you get killed in the future simply because you were doing the right thing in the wrong way.

Oh, and I highly doubt that anyone I work with would've arrested you for assault in this situation. You didn't excessively kick the crap out of anyone. And based on the victim's statement, I'm sure that any assault charges those trolls might've wanted to press against you would obviously be completely unfounded.

[PangQuan]

BTW if you stay out of parks at night then you'll never come across somebody being raped in a park at night.

And anyway, how do you know they're getting raped and not just having a good time?

So the easiest thing is just stay away from parks at night.

sometimes you just find yourself walking through the park at night because its between you and your destination.

you only need about 20 seconds or less to tell if a woman is being oppressed in the bushes...

[neilhytholt]

sometimes you just find yourself walking through the park at night because its between you and your destination.

you only need about 20 seconds or less to tell if a woman is being oppressed in the bushes...

Nope ... never go through the park especially at night. Unless you're looking for trouble.

[Ou Ji]

To be against guns is like being against footware.

I'm against hammers myself. A lot of lives could be saved if hammers weren't so easily accessible. Screwdrivers too.

Since I'm not politically correct I'm fine with beating up on low lifes. I think he should have jacked them both just to be safe. I'm sure the women would have covered his story.

[ShaolinTiger00]

Dragonzrage,

You're absolutely right regarding teh cellphone and I swear if I had even thought about what I was doing for a second, I think there were several options that I should have taken.

I heard that scream, saw the lady and that was just it. click. I didn't even remember dropping my messenger bag or anything. I just ran over to help her.

and not that it matters now or even then but I never let crackhead #2 behind me. Let me try to paint this picture. Imagine a T shape with 2 parked cars and an open lane in front of them. I was standing at the bottom when I arrived. Lady was to my right, guys to the left. As I arrived I got closer and closer to her as she was sort of trapped between her car and another . so by the time this all went down she was to my right and the guy was to my left and his buddy was behind him and moving away. thought I did lose sight/thought about him for a while after I got the guy in control I looked up and checked on him.

Ironically I am a CCW carrier in my home state of Ohio though seldom carry. but as I work in a neighboring state, I never take my pistol.

[David Jamieson]

hindsight is 20/20

there's a lot of what ifs being thrown around here which for me is not the point.

the event is over, the action you took was the correct one according to the outcome that did occur.

use the experience as points towards the next possible situation.

"what if" is always something that never happened, it is the least valuable advise in my opinion.

"what is" and "what did" are the real factors in learning. Not all the second thinking and what someone else would have done is not relevant, they weren't there, they didn't do it and frankly, they can't honestly say that in reviewing your event that they would have acted in anyway at all. THey have yet to be in your situation and ergo cannot acurately speak to it.

some may have shared similar experiences, in which case, tehy will likely agree with what you did. these people are the ones who can relate. no offense to anyone, but if it hasn;t happened to you, you can't presume to fully understand.