Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 80

Thread: Fight Science

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    88
    The thing that bugs me about these martial arts shows that have been popping up, is that kung fu is so generalized. The kung fu practitioner punched like Bruce Lee, not like a Shaolin Monk (for example) who could probably crush someones face with a straight punch. There's a lot more hip twisting and follow-through than what that guy did. It just bugs me because people who don't know any better assume that all kung fu is the same when they see these shows. It kind of makes kung fu seem weak or inferior to Karate or Tae Kwan Do... any of the more popular styles in the states.

    I can't wait for the day a fan of Shaolin, who is also a filmmaker, makes a documentary or TV special on Shaolin Kung Fu.
    If the brain were so simple we could understand it, we would be so simple we couldn't.

    Lucky Numbers 11, 8, 39, 46, 5, 17

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    San Diego, California, USA
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by hjt View Post
    the show was eh boring

    but it did show how boxing, muay thai and grappling are stronger styles than kung fu, karate and tkd.

    which technicially is MMA
    Actually, it did not show that. They commented on advantages and disadvantages of all the styles involved.

    There was clearly an agenda to promote style vs style BS. They could have had MUCH better Karate and Kung Fu guys. I giggled when I saw the punch measurments, I know a few guys that can throw twice the power (2000+psi) of any of the demonstators on the documentary....

    But trying to use the information presented to determine which style is the best?

    Rediculous!

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Science City Zero
    Posts
    4,763
    Quote Originally Posted by QuaiJohnCain View Post
    Actually, it did not show that. They commented on advantages and disadvantages of all the styles involved.

    There was clearly an agenda to promote style vs style BS. They could have had MUCH better Karate and Kung Fu guys. I giggled when I saw the punch measurments, I know a few guys that can throw twice the power (2000+psi) of any of the demonstators on the documentary....

    But trying to use the information presented to determine which style is the best?

    Rediculous!
    First, it's ridiculous.

    Second, it suxord. Who was the karate guy? Who was the kung fu guy? The MT fighter would have eatne most of the other people for a post-workout meal.

    Garg.
    BreakProof Back® Back Health & Athletic Performance
    https://sellfy.com/p/BoZg/

    "Who dies first," he mumbled through smashed and bloody lips.

  4. #34
    I'm assuming the director called ISKF on whom to call for the show...

    I saw a wushu expert being comapared to a serious boxing instructor, and a world class Muay Thai boxer...

    hmmmm......... ???? A wushu guy who plays at gymnastics (with tinfoil weapons thrown in to boot ) being compared to guys who are legit competitors...lol..... not a fare comparison ... The TDK guy with all is muscles seem to look no more convincing than the Wushu guy....IMO...

    The one who got down played the most was probably was the most deserving… Rickson Gracie....and jujitsu

    hey ...I know...said in my most sarcastic voice possible…………….

    ..... "let's do a show called "Fight Science" and give the art and the man out front of the art (that very art that has caused a revolution in the world community) less time than any other art on the show.... I think less than five min..he was on...what BS!!!!!

    And for fun we can throw in some Wushu weapon play by clueless gymnast. bouncing all over the mat... nice......

  5. #35
    p.s....


    I was waiting for the techno music and glow chucks to come out.....

    any moment...I thought to myself....

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by QuaiJohnCain View Post
    Actually, it did not show that. They commented on advantages and disadvantages of all the styles involved.

    There was clearly an agenda to promote style vs style BS. They could have had MUCH better Karate and Kung Fu guys. I giggled when I saw the punch measurments, I know a few guys that can throw twice the power (2000+psi) of any of the demonstators on the documentary....

    But trying to use the information presented to determine which style is the best?

    Rediculous!
    I'd like to see some evidence to back this up on equipment as reliable as that used for this show. Somehow, I am doubting that it will ever come to fruition.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by hung-le View Post
    I'm assuming the director called ISKF on whom to call for the show...

    I saw a wushu expert being comapared to a serious boxing instructor, and a world class Muay Thai boxer...

    hmmmm......... ???? A wushu guy who plays at gymnastics (with tinfoil weapons thrown in to boot ) being compared to guys who are legit competitors...lol..... not a fare comparison ... The TDK guy with all is muscles seem to look no more convincing than the Wushu guy....IMO...

    The one who got down played the most was probably was the most deserving… Rickson Gracie....and jujitsu

    hey ...I know...said in my most sarcastic voice possible…………….

    ..... "let's do a show called "Fight Science" and give the art and the man out front of the art (that very art that has caused a revolution in the world community) less time than any other art on the show.... I think less than five min..he was on...what BS!!!!!

    And for fun we can throw in some Wushu weapon play by clueless gymnast. bouncing all over the mat... nice......

    Give me a break, guy. The wushu guy wasn't the best choice, but he was probably all of 135 lbs soaking wet and still managed to hit 2/3 as hard as the boxer. They also gave him props for his speed.

    As for the Gracie's, so what? What more could have been done to highlight grappling? They showed how obscene amounts of pressure are applied to weak points. Did you want them to do a neck crank, choke, arm bar, knee bar, heel hook, bicep slicer, etc? Considering they'd be the only ones doing it, it would take away from the whole "multiple masters" aspect of the show.

    Life is a lot better when you don't go through it measuring and judging everything you see. It was an entertaining show at its base regardless of who was repping what style, what the extremely limitted and highly unscientific tests revealed, etc. It wasn't made for a scientific look into the martial arts. It was made to entertain people who have little to no idea about them. Enjoy it for what it is.

  8. #38

    fighting science

    This is in regards to the Nation geographic fighting science show which they aired last night. It was a 2 hour special on the break down of how martial arts generates power as well as the damage it does to the opponent

    Is it me or the show is just flawed….I mean I’m no scientist, and I took
    phsyics back in high school pass/fail…
    but the stuff they did seemed freaking flawed as hell

    #1) the punch power – okay, this $150,000 dummy can measure the power being
    delivered, and in the end
    the boxer punched the hardest, and the kung fu guy the weakest….unless they
    didn’t mention it further or I missed
    it while the machine measured the forced impact delivered, did they not
    calculate or factor in the size of each individual..
    I mean the boxer was a huge guy at least 200+ lbs, while the kung fu guy
    looked like a single ramon noodle with a kung fu shirt on maybe
    about 135 on a wet day. And, by the way, did they have to pick a wu shu guy,
    for crying out loud, wu shu people have no power, they’re liking
    jumping gazelles before the lions pounce on them. I mean isn’t simple
    caluclation invovle f = ma (mass and accelertaion). Oh by
    the way watching how the kung fu guy, he was toast… saw him trying to tense
    up and use muscle at the end to generate power.. Duh

    I mean I was watching little league baseball, and they have 2 measures of
    throwing power… they have the actual speed which is
    like 68 to 70 mph and then what it actually translates to in the big leagues
    which is like 90mph…

    #2) Kicking power – this was just a gay expereiment again… You’ve got
    kawate, (hehehe) tae kwon do, kung fu (uggh flying double kick) that
    wouldn’t even knock over michael jackson… so they all do their kicks and so
    far the tae kwon do is the strongest.. but wait.. Muay thai is better…
    why, coz he’s gonna do a knee???? WTF??? That’s like comparing apples and
    oranges… Why don’t you compare the powers of a shot gun vs. a bb gun…
    that didn’t even make any freaking sense… If that’s the case, why not let
    the thai guy throw a freaking elbow for the punch in the very first test…

    #3) Reaction – this is actually the 4th test, not gonna talk about the speed
    (oooh kung fu fastest, and hits like mosquito bites).. anyway they had
    a machine that the tae kwon do guy would react to and he would have to hit
    the pads everytime the lights went on.. The premise was they mentioned how
    do marital arts master seem to move before the opponent, its because unlike
    “regular” humans they react so much faster…. This could be even the gayiest
    of all the test… Coz reaction speed is such a useless and dwindling skill……
    why not get the reaction of a tae kwon do guy whose freaking 60 years old…
    made it look like the
    tae kwon do guy was super fast.. NOT… guys test on reaction based on eye
    hand coordination.. I’ll take the bet of a 14 year old kid’s eye hand
    coordination playing
    the hardest level of Dance Dance Revolution video game VS that tae kwon do
    guy any day, and there’ll be no contest…..ugggh, reaction what a useless
    test on ability to move before the opponent

    #4) finding center – so they get a stroke ninja guy who can balance on these
    plum flowers… all the other martial artist were falling off left and
    right….Uhhh, let me guess the ninja is the ultimate in balance.. uh, really
    gay test, I’ll take some circuis solei dude or girl and put them up against
    this ninja, and the demonstration of the di-mak hit to the soler
    plexes….eeeeeek… Who conducted these experiements…

    #5) breaking – Even more useless, but the worst demonstration, was having
    this guy do a shoulder ram through 10 long stacked bricks…. Uhhh, oooh
    martial arts.. the guys freaking 275lbs running at full speed through wimpy
    bricks.. for crying out loud, should I be impressed with this. That’s like
    me lifting 10lb dumb bells and bragging about it…. Who cares… I mean what’s
    more impressive the elephant who moves a large object or a little ant that
    can carry like 10 to 20 times its size… what was the point of all this….. Why
    not just get hulk hogan and have him punch erkel in the face, that’s
    impressive….

    Anyway the best part of the show, was how the body reacts to the pain.. that
    was cool…

    the 2nd part of the show was about weapons..yada, yada, yada

  9. #39
    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Ford Prefect View Post
    Give me a break, guy. The wushu guy wasn't the best choice, but he was probably all of 135 lbs soaking wet and still managed to hit 2/3 as hard as the boxer.
    I'm not knocking the guy... I said it wasn't a fare comparison...but I could have picked any number of CMA guys that would have qualified better……………..

    Rather than try to legitimize the art of Wushu by comparing Wushu boy up against real martial arts competitors which only made him look wanting in the prowess factor

    As for the Gracie's, so what?
    So what?.....So What????? You must be living in a cave..... Or you are the show's producer....right?

    What more could have been done to highlight grappling? They showed how obscene amounts of pressure are applied to weak points. Did you want them to do a neck crank, choke, arm bar, knee bar, heel hook, bicep slicer, etc?

    Well let me see...they highlighted hokey Ninja cat walking skills and Wushu boy and girl twirling tinfoil broad swords and fake spears (to include TKD man with his fake jo.) ..and spent an hour of the show on testing nothing but strikes.............considering what grappling has done to the martial arts scene in the last ten years..... The shows title was hardly legit.......don’t ya think?


    Life is a lot better when you don't go through it measuring and judging everything you see.
    How does one measure improvement? However I’ll acknowledge that doing something for the sake of it being fun is a major plus…and probably what drives us the most


    It was an entertaining show
    No it wasn’t………….. it was fiction

    Enjoy it for what it is
    Someone serves me crap I say so.... I can't help it if you don't like my opinion...
    Last edited by hung-le; 08-21-2006 at 02:12 PM.

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by ZhuiQuan View Post
    The thing that bugs me about these martial arts shows that have been popping up, is that kung fu is so generalized. The kung fu practitioner punched like Bruce Lee, not like a Shaolin Monk (for example) who could probably crush someones face with a straight punch. There's a lot more hip twisting and follow-through than what that guy did. It just bugs me because people who don't know any better assume that all kung fu is the same when they see these shows. It kind of makes kung fu seem weak or inferior to Karate or Tae Kwan Do... any of the more popular styles in the states.

    I can't wait for the day a fan of Shaolin, who is also a filmmaker, makes a documentary or TV special on Shaolin Kung Fu.
    exactly....I agree..

    Instead they go out and get Wushu experts (although some fight...most do nothing but gymnastics)

    Or they go out and get Hollywood models who do martial arts/like that "final fu" crap.....

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    1,093

    Perspective....

    Dude - I work behind the scenes in Television.

    Ive worked on Dramas, sport and News.

    Ill let you in on a little secret.

    We make almost 98 % of it up as we go
    Training is the pursuit of perfection - Fighting is settling for results - ME

    Thats not VT

    "This may hurt a little but it's something you'll get used to"- TOOL

    "I think the discussion is not really developing how I thought it would " - LoneTiger108

    Its good to be the King - http://nz.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqmgJIJM98

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    5,714
    #1 - The thing about bodyweight is a legit criticism, except that you hear TMA guys boasting about how hard they punch all the time, and how boxers can't punch "for real". I don't know how they picked the people, or how good they were in the wider scheme of things.

    #2 - presumably they let the kickers choose the type of kick they were going to do, or choose what they thought was their styles most powerful kick, or whatever. I don't see that you have much cause for complaint here.

    #3 - There are only so many ways to measure reaction time objectively. It's only a small part of being able to react effectively to an opponent, but it may give an edge. All your thoughts about Dance Revolution, etc. don't do much for me, I'm afraid. AFAIK much of the pure reaction time is genetic, anyways, so style training is pointless. We had a setup like this at our school for a while (an Impax bag), it was useful for things like determining which kicks could be delivered fastest, and getting some feedback on your speed and power.

    #4 - It's Cirque du Soleil, other than that you're probably right.

    #5 - It's probably a LITTLE different from you lifting 10lb dumbells and bragging about it.

    Duh, I gather you didn't like the program much then?

    It sounds to me like it might have been better done in Brainiac style, with a bit of humour thrown in - assuming they could find enough MA'ers who could take a joke at their expense.
    "Once you reject experience, and begin looking for the mysterious, then you are caught!" - Krishnamurti
    "We are all one" - Genki Sudo
    "We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion" - Tool, Parabol/Parabola
    "Bro, you f***ed up a long time ago" - Kurt Osiander

    WC Academy BJJ/MMA Academy Surviving Violent Crime TCM Info
    Don't like my posts? Challenge me!

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Minneslovakia
    Posts
    2,906
    It was complete and utter BS. Sure, they had Rickson Gracie and Don Inosanto....for all of like 3 minutes. The rest was psuedo-scientific evidence that such and such punch was more powerful from a guy who was 350lbs.

    Here's a good way to sum up this show.

    The ninja's dim mak chest strike was the deadliest attack. He was also dubbed "T3h m05t d34d7y w4rr10r!!!1!" They gave no stats on anything he did, said his punch compressed the chest two inches (and was more powerful than a full force spinning kick from TKD), and stroked his LARPer ego.

    Don't watch it. If you've seen the XMA show on discovery then your not missing a thing.

    Except maybe for common sense situations:
    1. a proper crucifix can break your neck
    2. a Thai knee to the chest is a great way to f@ck some one up
    CPA's current P4P List:
    -Bas Rutten
    -Captain Jack Sparrow
    -Cindy Lauper
    -Lester Moonvest

  14. #44


    I'm not knocking the guy... I said it wasn't a fare comparison...but I could have picked any number of CMA guys that would have qualified better……………..

    Rather than try to legitimize the art of Wushu by comparing Wushu boy up against real martial arts competitors which only made him look wanting in the prowess factor


    But they didn't. You expect the producers of an entertainment show to go out and research who would be a good representative out of the 3 trillion styles of kung fu to bring in rather than "Kung Fu" champion from the US. To the layman, this guy seemed more than qualified. I just don't see why you have your panties in a bunch over it. Who cares?



    So what?.....So What????? You must be living in a cave..... Or you are the show's producer....right?

    Well, I have practiced BJJ regularly and competed under a blackbelt from Brazil as well as training submission grappling lightly for the 5 years since I did so... I think I have a good handle on grappling and it's import in fighting. As for a tv show made for the masses in which different masters pit their skills against each other... considering there was only one master there, it would be hard to stick to the show's premise. Expecting it to do so is narrow minded.


    Well let me see...they highlighted hokey Ninja cat walking skills and Wushu boy and girl twirling tinfoil broad swords and fake spears (to include TKD man with his fake jo.) ..and spent an hour of the show on testing nothing but strikes.............considering what grappling has done to the martial arts scene in the last ten years..... The shows title was hardly legit.......don’t ya think?


    The hokey ninja tested his balance with everybody else... hence the premise of the show.

    The people twirling tin foil weapons in unrealitic combat displays stuck to the premise of the show.

    Highlighting how grappling has changed the way sport fighters train does not stick to the premise of the show. It is a show comparing similar skillsets of a broad range of artists. Why is that hard to understand?


    How does one measure improvement? However I’ll acknowledge that doing something for the sake of it being fun is a major plus…and probably what drives us the most

    Measuring improvement in one's chosen hobby, career, etc is quite different than measuring and inturn getting all worked up about the cross-sectional display of martial artists in a TV show produced by lay people to entertain lay people.

    You don't get to MacDonald's and expect filet mignon. You're complaints about "crap" are akin to somebody whining that the service at Denny's wasn't comparable to the Four Seasons. It is what it is.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Tampa Bay, florida
    Posts
    59

    Fight Science, Fighting Arts, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by cjurakpt View Post
    well, it seems pretty cool ....

    as far as MA TV shows go, the best that I have ever seen is one that was being broadcast on Fit TV about a year ago called Fighting Arts - this French Canadian Aikido BB woman went around the world spending time with a variety of local teachers in Thailand, Brazil, India, Japan, Filipenes, Europe, studying the particular arts for about a month each, to try to really get the flavour - there's not hype, it's all straightforward, and goes into pretty good depth about the specifics of the styles - since she was already a BB in Aikido, she knew how to behave properly, and was able to get some of the teachers, all very skilled, to really open up on on camera and show some very good stuff
    Yeah, that Fighting Arts show is awesome, and it comes on FitTV on my cable occasionally....She's got spunk, and I'D love to train with someone wo's been exposed to all that! She's studied almost everything...
    I thought the 'Fight Science' show was very entertaining and informative, and my 10 yr old son liked it, but what do we know anyway, we are Shaolin-Do FIGHTERS Who'da thunk there was so much force delivered with a knee strike??

    Hell, IMHO, ANY POSITIVE MA program is a good program!
    "Let's get the hell out of here" - J. T. Kirk. in City on the Edge of Forever

    "you've got to ask yourself a question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, PUNK?" Harry Callahan

    "Mens Sana In Corpore Sano"

    Follow the advice of Teddy Roosevelt: "Speak softly, but carry a big stick".

    "Regulate the breath, and thereby control the mind."
    -- B.K.S. Iyengar

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •