On Behalf of Grandmaster Doo Wai

[Reality_Check]

I believe I answered both Chris' questions, in my last post. But I will provide more details now. First, why would a lay person think he needs a knee replacement? The answer is because of the severe pain, stiffness, lack of movement, etc. At that time for example, I had severe pain in my knees especially when going up and down steps stairs, etc. I went to an orthopedist and he gave me anti-inflammatory medication which I took for several months and I did not feel any better. The orthopedist told me I might need TKR in the future if the symptoms continue. Afterwards, I met Grandmaster Doo Wai, he sold me some Bak Fu Pai dit da jow and I do not have any knee problems today. As a matter of fact I sell BFP dit da jow. It is an excellent remedy for a variety of muscle and bone related injuries.

Thank you for the answer. Although, I am curious as to why it took several pages and two days for you to actually answer the questions posed by Chris. On a side note, I had the same symptoms you did. I also went the anti-inflammatory route. In my case, as in yours, they didn't work. As it turned out, I had a partially torn patellar tendon which required surgery. No amount of dit da jow would have healed that. Fortunately for you, your knee problems were much less severe.

Now, as that is out of the way, please feel free to address my supposition re: the relationship between Bak Fu Pai and Bak Mei. I would also appreciate some comments regarding the following.

From a 1990 article in Ancient Sets of Kung Fu, authored by GM Doo Wai:

"Bok Fu Pai (White Tiger) Kung Fu, has been conserved in a most traditional way, it was handed down from father to son until now. From Fung Doe Duk, the secret of White Tiger Kung Fu was passed to Kwong Wai Jung, then to Jok Wan Jung, then to Yee Too Jung then to Wou Shan Jie, a monk whom in exchange for food and lodging taught the White Tiger System to Doo Kow, whom in turn passed it down to his son the present head of the system, Grandmaster Doo Wai.
In 1968 Grandmaster Doo Wai came to the United States, settling on the West Coast where he still resides and teaches but a few privately."

In Bak Mei's lineage, Kwong Wai learned from Bak Mei and, in turn, taught Juk Fat Wan. If Bak Fu Pai is separate from Bak Mei, why are these two in it's lineage? In addition this would seem to contradict lineage trees on other Bak Fu Pai websites that list Doo Tin Yin as having learned from Fung Doe Duk. I hope that you, or Dr. Harout, can clear up this inconsistency.

Also, I was hoping you or Dr. Harout would address the similarities (i.e. how they are almost identical) between Bak Fu Pai's Chum Bo Kuen and Bak Mei's Jik Bo Kuen (please see my first post on page 13 of this thread for a visual aid).

Thank you, in advance, for your replies.

[cjurakpt]

I believe I answered both Chris' questions, in my last post. But I will provide more details now. First, why would a lay person think he needs a knee replacement? The answer is because of the severe pain, stiffness, lack of movement, etc. At that time for example, I had severe pain in my knees especially when going up and down steps stairs, etc. I went to an orthopedist and he gave me anti-inflammatory medication which I took for several months and I did not feel any better. The orthopedist told me I might need TKR in the future if the symptoms continue. Afterwards, I met Grandmaster Doo Wai, he sold me some Bak Fu Pai dit da jow and I do not have any knee problems today. As a matter of fact I sell BFP dit da jow. It is an excellent remedy for a variety of muscle and bone related injuries.

sounds like a typical visit to the ortho: NSAIDS and see ya later; but it still proves my point, which was that you didn't actually need a knee replacment at that time, regardless of what the ortho thought that you "might" need in the future (and for him to say that, IMHO, was innappropriate, BTW, for a number of reasons, but that's another discussion...); so while you may have genuinely believed that you needed a TKR at that point, i am telling you that if you had actually met the proper diagnostic criteria for one, the jow would not have made a difference at all; so GM DW's jow etc. was not a miracle cure; it basically did what jow is supposed to do: decrease inflammation locally (also, I wonder if he had you alter your activity regimen at all, or gave you some exercises to do for your knees...); therefore, all we can say about GM DW based on you as an example, is that his healing skill is typical, as opposed to extraordinary

still waiting for the skinny on the lecture tour...

[Reality_Check]

still waiting for the skinny on the lecture tour...

This is the only "evidence" that I can seem to find:

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache...s&ct=clnk&cd=4

...I gave a lecture at UCSD medical center...

I apologize for the Google cache link. The original message on Doo Wai's forum has been deleted.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

OMG, I'm so sick and tired of listening to Ironman, Harut and Doo,...what a bunch of tools!

The stories, the lies, the 'video clips'. It's just soooo ridiculous.

They don't like our opinions regarding Doo's video clips.

Then they start making claims which they NEVER provide any info for. Listing a bunch of teachers in a line (which belongs primarily to another style) mean nothing. NO ONE ELSE BESIDES THESE GUYS DOES, OR EVER HEARD OF THIS STYLE? PEOPLE, USE YOUR COMMON SENSE. WHAT DOES THAT SOUND LIKE TO YOU? S - C - A - M - M - E - R - S !

They start tell us about Doo's Wonder Medicine and how it healed Ironman and prevented him from getting Total Reconstructive Knee surgery, which under duress, we find out he only THINKS he needed. He then retorts with "well how do I know, I'm not a doctor!"

Well, I've not been diagnosed with cancer, but I think I had it, but my teachers snake oil juice and his healing spirit got rid of my cancer. No...I wasn't diagnosed with it, but I felt pain and the medicine I took in the past didn't seem to work.

Do you see how ridiculous this sounds?

Then the best part it, he's pumping it up BECAUSE HE SELLS IT!!! Talk about yer objective opinions here...

And then the part about Doo thanking me and Dave Ross...for increasing their DVD sales and traffic to their 'school.' UG...I am so mad at myself for helping them. How could I fall into this well-layed mental trap of theirs. Here I thought I was searching for the truth, and possibly exposing a bunch of frauds, while instead, I inadvertantly helped them. I can't believe I was tricked with mental-fu. I suppose that the Doo family were also psychiastrists to the Emperor of the Tang Dynastys Royal Family as well.

And I emplore all the readers here to look at their message boards. It's a f*cking joke! More so then their posts here.

And did Ironman just tell us that he or his teacher can hit us with a 'hot-Chi-punch' from across the room? Ninja please...

And that people he knows can start a fire and burn stuff from their Chi? Where are these guys? They should be on TV's survivor - during the begining of every season when they haven't earned/won the materials they need to make fire. They should just have Doo or these other mystical Chinese Chi-Blast Masters.

And why does Doo and these guys use the word "SHIFU" which is a mandarin term and then in the same sentance use BOK FU PAI which is Cantonese. It's info like these that make me think that Doo isn't even posting here. It's probably just a few of his monkeys trying to preach their phony gospel.

IMO - Doo Wai is scamming people by saying that BFP is some old style which he is the head of . It's clearly (to me) some Bok Mei derivative. The forms were changed and renamed. And frankly, that's okay with me. Everyone has the right to add or subtract and pass on what they learned, in any matter which they see fit. No problem there. It's when people LIE about doing that and try to pass stuff off with a fake history and stories to gain credibility. That is where the problem is.

IMO - All the coconut break videos are fakes. I've broken coconuts and a bunch of other materials. They are not too hard to break, but I still feel that the videos are completely fake. Doo bounces the coconut 3" onto a carpet floor (I'm not exaggerating) to show how strong it is, and rolls it around a bit. It is obviously 'wet' which he points out as well, but he says how it's not 'leaking'. Here is the kicker; HE NEVER TURNS THE COCONUT UPSIDE DOWN. It's just such bullsh1t.

I said Doo's form looked like sloppy Bok Mei. To me, it does. I'm not saying he's the worst practitioner I've ever seen, but I have seldom seen worse from a Chinese guy claiming to be a living Grandmaster. He flais his arms around and has no stance whatsoever. And it doesn't matter what style you do, it's very easy for anyone to tell - he's just not very good. And that again, is okay. Not everyone is great, some people are just so-so. I don't begrudge him of that. It's just that since he is not good at Bok Mei, he can make up a new name and use Bok Mei tech. When a Bok Mei person critiques him, he can say - what do you know? This is Bok Fu pai, it's different that Bok Mei. The sames rules don't apply. My sloppy bok mei is really high-level skilled bok fu pai! (Sticking tongue out at bok mei critic)

These guys are exactly what's WRONG with TCMA today. And if these guys don't like my opinions, or my words, they can kiss my a$$. That includes Doo as well, if he truly is behind these posts. He should be ashamed of himself.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

This is the only "evidence" that I can seem to find:

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache...s&ct=clnk&cd=4



I apologize for the Google cache link. The original message on Doo Wai's forum has been deleted.

WOW, anyone notice QUITE a difference in the posting styles of DOO on this board, and the posting styles of DOO on his own board..hhmmmmm

One guy writes in fairly proper English, the other in foreigner-English. What does THAT sound like to everyone????

[Reality_Check]

I've actually brought that up in the past. On the old Southern Fist board, I asked GM Doo Wai why his writing style is so different from the way he speaks. He speaks perfect, accentless English. However, his writing is atrocious.

I never did receive a reply.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

OMG!

You have got to read this. It's insane. I actually think that they are posting, pretending to be Jim Lacey - who is posting neg. sh1t about them on their forum. I really think they are making all this stuff up - and creating posts by Jim Lacey to have an imaginary opponent to fight with.

This is really some unbelievable sh1t. I've never seen anything like this...LOL

Enjoy: http://doowaibfp.forumup.org/about460-doowaibfp.html

Lets start some kind of fundraiser to get these guys to get under the care of some mental health professionals. I seriously didn't realize what these guys were about until I read thier forum (who has 19 members, consisting of the guys who are posting here)

[Lama Pai Sifu]

I've actually brought that up in the past. On the old Southern Fist board, I asked GM Doo Wai why his writing style is so different from the way he speaks. He speaks perfect, accentless English. However, his writing is atrocious.

I never did receive a reply.

Reality Check,

Did you read the post on their forum, where Jim Lacey is claiming to be YOU??? This is soo twisted....

[Reality_Check]

Yes, that forum is a tad...off. Also, I believe that the posters "Bak Fu Pai" and "Grandmaster Doo Wai" are the same person. The writing styles (including misspellings) are too similar for coincidence. Which means, Doo Wai is having conversations with himself on that board. I suppose that is an easy way to reach a consensus.

[Reality_Check]

Reality Check,

Did you read the post on their forum, where Jim Lacey is claiming to be YOU??? This is soo twisted....

Yes, that seems to be a rather transparent attempt to discredit me (I doubt that is really Jim Lacy, it just seems too convenient). Which, naturally, makes me suspect that my comments earlier in this thread hit a little too close to home.

[Reality_Check]

http://doowaibfp.forumup.org/about461-doowaibfp.html

Reality check, you are a moron, from the video clips everyone knows grandmaster doo wai has accentless english.
Are you claiming you spoked to Grandmaster Doo Wai ?

Ah...this brings back memories of Southern Fist.

My comment was:

He speaks perfect, accentless English.

Apparently, reading comprehension is not a Bak Fu Pai skill.

[cjurakpt]

"Bak Fu Pai Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 10:51 am Post subject: That Lima Kung fu shifu moron is fantasizing that he is a movie producer. He gotta get a life instead of feeling insecure when someone he doesn't even know or met does a fast kung fu form. That shows he is nothing but a wannabee that can talk a lot of talk and has a school. He is the con man."

Well Mike, I guess that says it all: you obviously fantasized your entire relationship with Lau Kar Leung, and you're obviously a wannabe con man (with a school, to boot)..waita minute..I think I know where GC went to post now...

oh, BTW, we all know that you have never actually been to Peru, so obviously you can't know authentic "Lima" style kung fu...

[cjurakpt]

Oh! I'm infamous! They posted my comment about the gim set on their forum!

"Karma.
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 12:38 pm Post subject: Ha Ha Haaa Mr. Sword expert.
It must have been that recently added amazing performance of straight sword on your site that captivated them (which, BTW, was about the sadest, poorest performance of gim I have ever seen, and anyone affiliated with that deomonstration ought to be ashamed of themselves for posting it; and don't try the "you don't know anything about internal sword work" - sorry, it happens to be one of my areas of specialization...)
Ha ha Ha Haaaa Mr. Sword expert, yeah Ok Mr. sword expert and know it all. Mr. cjurakpt a sword expert that has the right to judge Bak Fu Pai forms. If he was a expert he won't be complaining about other people's sword form. No expert as egotistic as that."

I would have replied to this directly on their forum, but I wanted for someone to actually read it...

so:
1) I never said I was an expert: I said that gim is an area of specialization for me, meaning that I have above average knowledge in that area, cerrtainly enough to know when I see something that is far below average...

2) I'm not judging a BFP form: I'm judging gim technique, which is, even across many different styles, fairly uniform, due essentialy to the nature of the weapon, its intrinsic characteristics; and there are some major problems with this form: DW's stances are non-existent, he doesn't even look at what he's doing half the time, and he waves the gim around in a way that has nothing to do with how it is applied in fighting; and what's with that bizarre switching from regular to reverse grip and back? sorry guys, he should have looked at a few more DVD's before he went out and made up his own sad little routine...

3) Im not complaining about it: if I was compaining, it would mean that somehow the form is having a negative impact on my life, and I'd have said something like "Geez, watching that form made me break out in hives, I wish they would take it down."; I'm not complainnig - I'm just saying it's bad, pure and simple;

4) these guys are so funny: if I hadn't said anything about my background in gim, they'd have been like "what can you know about it, Mr. External- hard style, non-straight sword knowing person?"; when I qualify my response, then it's "you can't be an expert because an expert is ego-less"; well, I don't know where you get your reasoning from, but expert and egoless have absolutely nothing to do with each other: Hui Neng, the Sixth Zen Patriarch, was an illiterate peasant, and expert at nothing, and he "got it" without any training at all ("No mirror, no dust, etc.") - likewise, we all know plenty of experts who are way full of themselves...anyway, I am neither expert nor egoless: but I do know crap when I see it...

and so does anyone else with half a clue: so let them judge for themselves...

http://www.tigerkungfu.com/videos/Emei.html

[Reality_Check]

To quote what a wise man once said:

"ouch!

coffin, meet last nail..."

[cjurakpt]

Score: BFP guys 100 points / Fake Beitch guys 0 points

yeah, 100 CRAZY points...