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Thread: Baji & Xingyi

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPJ View Post
    nice one!!!
    Originally Posted by Lee Chiang Po
    You then walk backwards, forcing him off his feet and then drag him by the eye socket and lips. You can pull so hard that the lips tear away. You will never hear such screaming.

  2. #17
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    Hsing-I's cannon fist is extremely powerful but I wouldn't say it's the most powerful punch... I would say, "punching that way is the most powerful way to punch."

    Driving off the foot, arms held in tight and taking that power and sending it from thrusting off the back leg (like a speed skater), adding hip and waist, upper back, shoulder, elbow, wrist and finger (last two for speed and bite) is very, very strong.

    Good boxers do the same thing when they are grounded and throw a heavy uppercut. Or a good hook uses the same mechanics, just the relationship or shape is different.

    All punching should be based on this formula, but for reasons outside of one's control... usually time to hit an opening or one's position ... perhaps you have to up-root yourself for a moment to hit your target .... or sink and not drive.... then you use more hip/waist then driving off the foot, etc.

    The ideal and what can be achieved are not always the same. Though you train to have all parts doing their job.

  3. #18
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    size does not mean you would have a stronger punch its a proven fact

  4. #19
    Skill being equal, size and weight does make a difference.
    Many times size and weight without skill make a formidable blow.
    Everything must follow certain laws of nature, even martial arts.

  5. #20
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3doyXlLkPo&NR

    Dan Da: one man part of 2 man drill

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42pM7...elated&search=

    Dui Lian: 2 man drill

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPZ1j...elated&search=

    clips from Meng Chun in celebration of Wu Xiu Feng birthday.

    Last edited by SPJ; 01-20-2007 at 02:08 PM.

  6. #21
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    Ray has a good point or two.
    Msg-
    You must be new to the martial arts. All things being equal, the bigger, stronger fighter will win. Physics boy, physics. That is the "proof."
    I have studied both Baji and Xing Yi, and in the end all this coversation is accomplishing is a lot of mental masturbation. Their is no ONE style with the single most powerful anything, or we would all be training that ONE style. Training is what seperates the "girls from the boys" so to speak. Just because you train __________ (fill in the blank) does not mean you will have the strongest anything. How do you train? How were you taught? Where in your training are you? ETC. ETC.
    I have met Baji guys who could not throw a decent punch if their life depended on it, same with Xing Yi.
    If you all really, truly want to understand things better I suggest analyzing the principles behind the technique/style. If you understand one principle you will understand 10,000 techniques. Just because you understand 10,000 techniques does not mean you understand one principle! We are all governed by the same laws (gravity being one example), so these discussions that start with "Which style is more......." are silly to the point of craziness.

    Hope that helps,
    Cheers
    Jake
    "Gravity doesn't lie, and the ground never misses."
    Jake Burroughs
    Three Harmonies Chinese Martial Arts Center
    Seattle, WA.
    www.threeharmonies.com
    three_harmonies@hotmail.com
    www.threeharmonies.blogspot.com

  7. #22
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    Here is a very nice clip of xiao baji jia (from outside the Wu Tan circles):

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfY32aGvAS8
    "Its better to build bridges rather than dig holes but occasionally you have to dig a few holes to build the foundation of a strong bridge."

    "Traditional Northern Chinese Martial Arts are all Sons of the Same Mother," Liu Yun Qiao

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Three Harmonies View Post
    If you understand one principle you will understand 10,000 techniques. Just because you understand 10,000 techniques does not mean you understand one principle!
    I know what you were going for in the above statement, but I couldn't resist nit-picking. I think it might be more accurate to say "just because you can execute/apply", because if you understand the technique, you understand the principle behind it.

  9. #24
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    Hey bro. I too think I know what you are getting at, but if I may.....
    The main problem I see with many teachers is that they do not understand WHY something works. They may know HOW it works perfectly, inside and out. But not WHY. This is not the systems problem, this is the issue with the individual teacher. This is what differentiates a good teacher, from a good practitioner! I know many people who can apply certain techniques flawlessly, but when you ask them to break down the reasoning as to why it works, they stare at you blankly. Nothing wrong with that, we are all in different places on our own paths.
    My overall point is every style has something to offer. All styles are powerful, though certain ones cater to certain things. No one style is more powerful than another, or we all would be studying that one style.
    Cheers
    Jake
    "Gravity doesn't lie, and the ground never misses."
    Jake Burroughs
    Three Harmonies Chinese Martial Arts Center
    Seattle, WA.
    www.threeharmonies.com
    three_harmonies@hotmail.com
    www.threeharmonies.blogspot.com

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Three Harmonies View Post
    Hey bro. I too think I know what you are getting at, but if I may.....
    The main problem I see with many teachers is that they do not understand WHY something works. They may know HOW it works perfectly, inside and out. But not WHY. This is not the systems problem, this is the issue with the individual teacher. This is what differentiates a good teacher, from a good practitioner! I know many people who can apply certain techniques flawlessly, but when you ask them to break down the reasoning as to why it works, they stare at you blankly. Nothing wrong with that, we are all in different places on our own paths.
    My overall point is every style has something to offer. All styles are powerful, though certain ones cater to certain things. No one style is more powerful than another, or we all would be studying that one style.
    Cheers
    Jake
    I agree with your statement and knew what you meant, I was just nit-picking.

  11. #26
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    No worries. I am glad at least one person got it
    "Gravity doesn't lie, and the ground never misses."
    Jake Burroughs
    Three Harmonies Chinese Martial Arts Center
    Seattle, WA.
    www.threeharmonies.com
    three_harmonies@hotmail.com
    www.threeharmonies.blogspot.com

  12. #27
    I am sure geographical location has much to do with the cross pollination of many arts. It would only make sense that practitioners would learn from each other whether enemies or training brothers.

    Some even surmise that Baji and Xingyi stem from similar sources.
    Xingyi may be an offshoot of Baji or vice versa.
    We will never know the real truth.

    As long as we keep evolving, its all good to me.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Three Harmonies View Post

    ...may know HOW it works perfectly, inside and out. But not WHY.
    Well said!

    A person who knows HOW can only perform one task; A person who knows WHY can derive his/her own techniques and take the art to a higher level.

    Much like, a chef who can only copies recipes is no match with a chef who understands the art and can create his/her own recipes.

    Just like a chef who one taste of a dish and he could reproduce it; a martial artist who understand the inner workings of the mind and body can integrate techniques into his own just by looking at or crossing hands with someone.

    Cheers,
    John
    Dr. J Fung
    www.kulowingchun.com

    "打得好就詠春,打得唔好就dum春"

  14. #29
    Nice to know HOW, better to know WHY.
    Now if only people can actually DO.

    I have met many an instructor who knows the ins, outs, how, why, etc. for any specific technique in their arsenal, but when the proverbial stuff hits the fan, they cannot deal.

    Sad, but true.
    Principles and threories are nice, but if you cannot apply it then it is worthless.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by samson818 View Post

    Principles and threories are nice, but if you cannot apply it then it is worthless.
    Absolutely. That's why we need to train. Otherwise, the body cannot reflect what we know.

    Cheers,
    John
    Dr. J Fung
    www.kulowingchun.com

    "打得好就詠春,打得唔好就dum春"

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