Cross training with boxing

[petervasylenko]

Hello all, this is my fist post and dont know if this has been talked about before.
Im learning wing chun at the moment but wanted to know what you guys thought about training boxing aswell. ive been interested in boxing for years but only wanted to train it latley. I feel it might affect my wing chun in a negative way as i dont have a good enough grip on the concepts, ive only trained wing chun for 2 years.
Just seems that the priciples of both styles conflict with each other eg no shoulders in wing chun, no ducking and weaving. i think it would just confuse me.
What are your thoughts on this?

[leroyjnsn]

Hey that is a good idea. My boxing experience is low, and have only been training in WC for months. But I would think that training boxing would help with reflexes, mobility. I personally believe that there is nothing wrong with cross training. It keeps the mind open to new ideas I think. I know that it is good cardio!


Best wishes,
Leroy
"Committed to not compromise."

[petervasylenko]

im still uncertain because if i was in a situation, my body might get confussed because wing chun is telling me get within one step and punch with a step no shoulders, but boxing would tell me throw that hook now, get out of there couple jabs and a cross etc. it feels like it would "short circuit" my abbility to fight?

[couch]

Hello all, this is my fist post and dont know if this has been talked about before.
Im learning wing chun at the moment but wanted to know what you guys thought about training boxing aswell. ive been interested in boxing for years but only wanted to train it latley. I feel it might affect my wing chun in a negative way as i dont have a good enough grip on the concepts, ive only trained wing chun for 2 years.
Just seems that the priciples of both styles conflict with each other eg no shoulders in wing chun, no ducking and weaving. i think it would just confuse me.
What are your thoughts on this?

I took some time off of WC to learn some boxing. It was the best thing that I ever good have done IMHO!

I feel this because I learned so much about how cardio can actually be working INTO my WC training...not something separate.

Also, it gave me quite the perspective on how to train effectively: cardio, conditioning, bag work, partner work. Never once did we punch in the air. We were always hitting something and working on technique and footwork AT THE SAME TIME!!!

It has made me a better WC practicioner and instructor.

Don't worry about the "style" differences that you see...they will blur with time and then all you'll be doing is fighting.

Best,
Kenton Sefcik

[Ultimatewingchun]

See my old thread entitled: Wing Chun Boxing.

[Average Joe]

quote:
Never once did we punch in the air.

What kind of wing chun is teaching you to punch in the air.

[Shaolin Wookie]

I seem to think that boxing and WC would be completely different. I'm not sure that they would "combine" at all.

Boxing punchines line up the shoulder, elbow, and fist, thereby increasing the power of a punch. WC is more concerned with speedy retaliation than KO power, and will only truly combine the elbow and fist. As a matter of fact, there aren't any CMA that really use Boxing alignment for punches. It's all a part of remaining relaxed, ready, and speedy.

Secondly, the footwork in boxing allows one to move in and out of range at will, utilizing an entire floor with full 360 degrees of scope, rooted in the toes. WC has very limited footwork. It's all based on economy...economy of action, motion, power, speed. Its root is in the heels and instep, and secondarily in the toes.

Thirdly, boxing attacks from all angles. WC is a veeeery linear style, and one presses one's advantage by moving straight at the opponent. Hence....centerline style.

I don't think they'd blend well, but such as they are opposites, you'd be getting educated in the things WC will not teach you in great depth, and often casts off as unnecessary. But for power punches that'll F-up the skinny dudes at your WC school, boxing is awesome. (I'm more partial to boxing in this pairing. It's better for fighting, and it keeps you mobile, and you can press distancing and work on that jab ).

[Lipan]

Hello all, this is my fist post and dont know if this has been talked about before.
Im learning wing chun at the moment but wanted to know what you guys thought about training boxing aswell. ive been interested in boxing for years but only wanted to train it latley. I feel it might affect my wing chun in a negative way as i dont have a good enough grip on the concepts, ive only trained wing chun for 2 years.
Just seems that the priciples of both styles conflict with each other eg no shoulders in wing chun, no ducking and weaving. i think it would just confuse me.
What are your thoughts on this?

Remember that Wing Chun is conceptual. Chi Sao and all of the other WC tools are merely methods of developing a greater understanding for the WC theories. (Move foward when the way is clear, centerline concepts, ecomonomy of movement, sensitivity ect). Even the Boxer could utilize these concepts to their fullest and vice versa. As a WC fighter, why not throw the boxers hook if the way is not clear?

[samson818]

I dont see anything wrong with mixing western boxing and Wing Chun.
As long as you understand they stand on their own with separate philosophies, methods, and structures.
Wing Chun does utilize the body to support its punches.
In fact, much of its power comes from similar structural alignment the western boxing has. Alignment of the joints and their linkage/unlinkage.
It has been mentioned it is a conceptual art, many people will have their own understanding. Some choose to just employ their chain punches as fast weak strikes in a machines-gun like manner.

[sihing]

There's no problem mixing the two, I acutally recommend it. The problem happens when you train the two simultaneously. If one art form is not your core method, and you train to learn both at the same time you could run into problems IMO. Both methods teach different things. How to defend and generate power is just two of them. You are only confusing yourself and your bodily response when doing this. I would concentrate on one at a time, having either as a core base and then complimenting it with the other, using both when needed in a natural manner.

James

[Alan Orr]

Hi Guys

For me I have to say that Wing Chun is a Boxing art, the art of Chinese Boxing.

I think you should train with modern training methods ie bags, glove sparring, conditioning and so on. But the method of striking is wing chun.

I think we have a lot of wing chun guys that are forgeting we punch and kick.

Thats just my view of course. I students love to fight NHB, boxing, sparring etc all using wing chun chinese boxing skills.

My studnet Aaron just beat an army boxing champ in Pro NHB fight with his chinese boxing skills.

Look at a lot of MMA and you see people are starting to punch with their elbows more down and the body more square on.

I just produced my new DVD's on this area as I think we need to understand the correct way to train wing chun and its structure for combat.

Best

Alan

www.alanorr.com

www.alanorr.com

[samson818]

Sifu Alan Orr,

I'm curious, when you and your guys compete, do you still use Pak da, Tan da, and Lop Da? Do employ chain punches? Are you able to bridge the gap and use your chisao training when you make contact?
What WC techniques or strategies have been most effective in your experience?

Thanks for your input in advance.

[El Guapo]

quote:
Never once did we punch in the air.

What kind of wing chun is teaching you to punch in the air.

I think this all depends on what you consider
"puching in the air"
Compaired to boxing I would say the majority of my wing chun training is punching in the air. That is to say that my punches never land on a solid surface they merely strike air. Where as in boxing you train mainly striking actual targets i.e focus mits, heavy bags, speed bags sparring partners....
In my training one of the first things we do is punch in the air for a while something like 700+ times.
then in training techniques we punch at each other but pull our punches (hopefully) before contact, essentially punching air.
Why, how do you train punching in your wing chun?

[ZenGuy]

whem combining or even just doing wing chun and boxing i found that i ended up perfering to stand in amore natural boxing stance and especially after a few drinks the more primative style of boxing feels alot more natural.

u mite end up like bruce lee, using a wing chun/boxing hybrid?

i do like the powerfull cross' from boxing using the whole body behind the shot.

[Paul T England]

Hi All,

I think if your wing chun is lacking then maybe the boxing is good for long range. You sure can learn alot about strategy and fitness but some wing chun teachers such as Alan orr can already teach this as part of the wing chun training. I agree with Alan, that some wing chun people forget that its a boxing art.

Whats wrong with punching in the air, you telling me boxers and mma guys don't shadow boxing or do any solo drills. Thats what is going to help make you better than the next guy! (Obviously you need to be hitting things and working with partners for a large percentage of the time.) How many complete beginners can do a jab, straight punch, front kick, sprawl properly without practicing it in the air?


Stick with wing chun if you find a good teacher,

Paul