about Bruce Lee

[Shossain]

Real fighting, even among the most skilled, often looks sloppy and "unskilled" compared to the fantasies of movie fighting, forms dancing and demonstrations... especially when you throw in all ranges into the mix.

I am sure everyone here knows that quite well..

But when I watch real fightings of legends like Mohammad Ali and a few others including a very few on Bruce Lee I find it difficult to understand why most others can not dance like that at the ring and still can win to be a champion.. ofcourse.. all champions are not true champions.. and all champions are not legends..

With due respect to all.. I doubt if these people participating in the UFC and many other championships now a day that many are referring here can dance close to that level even in movies..

I would request you guys to close this thread without more mud slinging..

No matter what anyone have to say..

Bruce Lee is Bruce Lee.. a legend..


By the way did anyone try the punches? I could achieve 14 in a second..

[Knifefighter]

But when I watch real fightings of legends like Mohammad Ali and a few others including a very few on Bruce Lee I find it difficult to understand why most others can not dance like that at the ring and still can win to be a champion.. ofcourse.. all champions are not true champions.. and all champions are not legends..

With due respect to all.. I doubt if these people participating in the UFC and many other championships now a day that many are referring here can dance close to that level even in movies..

Because they are fighting, not dancing.

Lee could dance like that because he wasn't really fighting, he was acting in movies.

Ali could dance that way because he didn't have to worry about being taken down.

By the way did anyone try the punches? I could achieve 14 in a second..

Multiple punches per second is like dancing when it comes to actually fighting... not a whole lot of transfer to real fighting situations.

[Shossain]

Because they are fighting, not dancing.

Lee could dance like that because he wasn't really fighting, he was acting in movies.

Ali could dance that way because he didn't have to worry about being taken down.



Multiple punches per second is like dancing when it comes to actually fighting... not a whole lot of transfer to real fighting situations.

Frankly.. and with due respect to all.. I was expecting some more constructive response.. and the focus is now shifting..

However, I am adding some more of my views here..

Martial art is an art and not just a fighting tool.. those who does not agree probably do not practice martial art but some fighting methods only..

Dancing is not just dancing like a dance or to show off its a tool to implement a plan.. to change stances like on and off moving in and out taking control distracting focus of opponent.. its stepping at a faster pace with balance.. those who can dance will always dance in real fightings too.. it increases speed, control, power, all that one need in real fighting.. but for only those who can dance.. so to perform better than what one can do one have to dance..

About multiple punching.. in my opinion what is referred to in the above quote is just throwing hands and not punches.. multiple punches at speed with control and power and on target is something that not too many people can do.. while watching any real fighting one will find this to be the most devastating and a major reason for winning.. and if one can not punch without fighting how can one expect to punch in actual fighting?

So.. dance and see the difference.. enjoy the discovery..

[Knifefighter]

Martial art is an art and not just a fighting tool.. those who does not agree probably do not practice martial art but some fighting methods only..

BJJ, Muay Thai, Sambo, boxing, Judo, and wrestling are definitely more fighting method and less martial art.

Nothing wrong with wanting to have "art" involved. Just don't expect it to have any relation to actual fighting.

those who can dance will always dance in real fightings too..

Watch any combat system that involves takedowns. Judo, BJJ, wrestling, Sambo... you won't see much in terms of dancing in these. There's a functional reason for this.

while watching any real fighting one will find this to be the most devastating and a major reason for winning..

The major reason for ending a fight with punches is the power, timing and accuracy of said punches, not how many punches can be thrown in a short period of time.

Multiple, incredibly fast punches thrown one after another mostly work only in the pretend world of movies and demonstrations.

[PangQuan]

- Bruce Lee is a legend in one way or other.. these kind of talking can not touch him.. so it's better not to try something that would not bring anything good to anyone.. no matter whether he was good enough or not it will not make you any better.. you see.. you are already talking about him.. but nobody is talking about you other than yourself..

i believe this statement captures the essence of this "discussion" regarding bruce lee.

bruce lee simply was bruce lee.

"achieve a greatness beyond the standard set by those who came before you, without doing so, words mean nothing."

this is something a great man once told me.

i believe this quote i just wrote was something that bruce lee lived by, regardless of whether he was concious of this thought pattern.

i believe bruce lee reached a greatness many will not find in several life times.

i dont believe the goal of bruce lee was to defeat everyone in combat, or that would have been his focus.

i believe bruce lee wanted to develop methods for helping ANYONE to be able to reach these standards and possibilities.

my beliefs may be wrong.

but it doesnt really matter

[lkfmdc]

Bruce Lee

A guy with a unique physical condition (let's not be Ho mo about it), yes

A guy who wasn't "just" an actor, had martial arts skills, yes

A guy who invented cross training? NO

A guy who chose movies over fighter, ok, no problem

A guy who made martial arts very popular and helped push them mainstream, no doubt about it, yes

A great fighter? No evidence of this. A few fights with people whose level is hard to determine. No competition. Certainly had almost no grappling skills

If there wasn't a cult talking about how Bruce wold have KO'd Royce Gracie and won every UFC pretty much no one would care about Bruce Lee

Heck, a lot of JKD people have moved BEYOND Bruce Lee

[Yao Sing]

Knifefighter
Why the lieing quotes? Couldn't find something I said for real to bash?

How about fixing that and quoting something I actually said?

[Knifefighter]

That should be better.

[Yao Sing]

Well you're still off in fantasyland with that one but then we all know your grasp of reality is a weak one.

BTW, I returned the favor. Like it?

[Anthony]

"And here's what I find hilarious about this thread...all the Bruce Lee naysayers here wouldn't have lasted more than 60 seconds with the guy.

Who's kidding who around here?!"

I honestly think youre kidding yourself. I don't know about anyone else here but I think I could have beaten him in any venue (I think others here could have as well). Given any of my stats compared to his I don't think he could do anything to me. Not without a gun. I'm not asking, or trying to convince, anyone to believe this but it's how I feel. News flash.....you can actually be good without being famous.

That being said:

"he was very gifted, talented, and goal orriented. he worked very hard to accomplish everything that he did. did he have an ego? yes. but well, the guy was very successfull, and a large portion of the fuel for that success was his VERY well known ego, which allowed him the utter confidence to walk his path as he chose. we could all be so lucky

he deserves respect as an artist, human being, and as martial artist, as does each and everyone."

I pretty much agree.

"achieve a greatness beyond the standard set by those who came before you, without doing so, words mean nothing."

Great quote.....if everyone fealt this way this forum would be empty.

[sihing]

"And here's what I find hilarious about this thread...all the Bruce Lee naysayers here wouldn't have lasted more than 60 seconds with the guy.

Who's kidding who around here?!"

I honestly think youre kidding yourself. I don't know about anyone else here but I think I could have beaten him in any venue (I think others here could have as well). Given any of my stats compared to his I don't think he could do anything to me. Not without a gun. I'm not asking, or trying to convince, anyone to believe this but it's how I feel. News flash.....you can actually be good without being famous.

That being said:

"he was very gifted, talented, and goal orriented. he worked very hard to accomplish everything that he did. did he have an ego? yes. but well, the guy was very successfull, and a large portion of the fuel for that success was his VERY well known ego, which allowed him the utter confidence to walk his path as he chose. we could all be so lucky

he deserves respect as an artist, human being, and as martial artist, as does each and everyone."

I pretty much agree.

"achieve a greatness beyond the standard set by those who came before you, without doing so, words mean nothing."

Great quote.....if everyone fealt this way this forum would be empty.

You THINK you could beat Bruce? I can say the samething, too bad there is no way to find out eh, lol... I agree that you can be good without being famous, but Bruce was that. He only acheived fame for the last 3 yrs of his life, he was good for many many years before that.

You gotta love the internet.

Hey dude, maybe post some video's on utube and we can have inkling of your skill to possibly back up what you say, OK.

James

[rogue]

I heard from someone that knew someone that on the set of a movie he knocked out Judo Gene Labell. One punch. And one does have to ask why nobody from Brazil ever challenged him. The reason is simple, they are great fighters and recognized someone who was superior even to them. Bruce was and always will be the ultimate fighter.

The Real Original Lucky Louie!

[Shossain]

BJJ, Muay Thai, Sambo, boxing, Judo, and wrestling are definitely more fighting method and less martial art.

Nothing wrong with wanting to have "art" involved. Just don't expect it to have any relation to actual fighting.


Watch any combat system that involves takedowns. Judo, BJJ, wrestling, Sambo... you won't see much in terms of dancing in these. There's a functional reason for this.


The major reason for ending a fight with punches is the power, timing and accuracy of said punches, not how many punches can be thrown in a short period of time.

Multiple, incredibly fast punches thrown one after another mostly work only in the pretend world of movies and demonstrations.

JKD is not just a style or form of fighting method.. it represents the most recent and advanced martial art..


Yes.. because as mentioned these specific forms of fighting methods limited by rules.. and as such are not complete fighting techniques.. however, saying that I must agree, dancing is not mandatory.. but can give advantage during a real fight too..


Mohammad Ali, the 20th century sportsman of the century, used to dance in every real fighting.. even when he fought some of the other greatest boxers like Sonny Liston, Jeorge Foreman and Joe Frazier.. I am sure those were not movie tricks or Mohammad Ali did not try to act in the ring.. here is a specific quote on this "During the bout, Ali employed an unexpected strategy. Throughout the build up he declared he was going to 'dance' and use his speed to keep away from Foreman and out box him"..


No disagreement.. but speed is very important too.. that's what it means.. without speed the rest does not work because the target will move out/block/divert as it see something coming..


Another quote from Ali's fight.. "By the end of the eighth round Foreman was clearly flagging and Ali made his move, turning Foreman off the ropes and executing a combination for the knockout"..


Watching videos of his fights will give all a pretty good idea on what dancing and multiple punching is all about in real fights..

[rogue]

And also how to rope a dope, a very effective street technique.

[Shossain]

"I don't know about anyone else here but I think I could have beaten him in any venue (I think others here could have as well). Given any of my stats compared to his I don't think he could do anything to me.

I would love to see some stats as mentioned.. may be a comparison too.. instead of just mentioning..

Is it braveness or ignorance!!.. may be all here would love to see a fight against Dan.. probably the only person certified by Bruce still living with us in this world.. you may call +1 310 578 7773 to have it scheduled..