Introducing Levels in TCMA

[Chan Da-Wei]

Gidday,

First post on this forum and have been enjoying reading over old threads. The thread on Sifu Chan Tai-San has been especially interesting and enjoyable.

Putting the feelers out there to see if I can get some advice on an upcoming chance in our club...

I am helping my Sifu to introduce a Level/ Grade system into our classes. We have been training now for four years and some of us, including our Sifu, want to bring a more focused and succinct training regime to the classes.

In my mind, the purpose of introducing a Level/ Grade system would be to 1) formally codify and structure the curriculum to streamline teaching and learning and 2) provide beginners with a framework in which to measure themselves against in their training goals.

On the other side of the coin, we want to avoid the mc-gwoon “you want this belt, you learn this pattern, next belt, next pattern ….etc etc etc” mentality…

Its early days so any advice, feedback from personal or similar experiences at this conceptual stage would be useful.

Cheers and thanks.

[The Xia]

If you have a small group, I think you're better off without them. The rationale I can see for belts is if you have a large group where people are always coming in and dropping out and it's difficult to for the teacher to remember where each person is at. Belts can help alleviate that by giving the teacher a general idea of what people are working on. I think this practical reason is why most schools have switched over to belt systems (that and many people seem to walk into schools expecting them). The main problem that I notice with belts is that many students will see getting belts as the goal instead of improving their Kung Fu. I've seen it happen even in schools that aren't mckwoon belt-factories. I think the best way to reduce the number of students with this attitude is to emphasize that the skills are what counts, not the belts. But even if you do this, I think you'll still get some people who will look at it the other way around. But what can you do? Martial arts schools attract all kinds. There are certain kinds of people that are very into having a rank, wearing uniforms, adhering to formalities, and things like that. From my experiences with those types, they put belts on pedestals. And I have not been to a martial arts school that does not have at least a few of these types. That’s my two cents.
Good luck with your kwoon and welcome to the forums!

[Chan Da-Wei]

Thanks for this.

Yeah, our group is small at around 15 people and Sifu does have quite a good grasp on where each of us are at.

To be honost, my Sihing and I had resisted bringing in levels two years ago when one of our Si bak's discussed it with us. Prior to helping Sifu establish the school, we trained in Japanese arts over many years. Got over the whole belt thing a long time ago and got fed up with those who saw it as defining them.

So, not having belts in our KF class was a refreshing change that took away a lot of the 'crap' that goes with such a ranking system. Thus we opted to keep it 'beltless'.

Recently however, a friend of mine who I deeply respect and has trained for over 30 years told me that it was perhaps selfish of us (my si hing and I) to impose our preference not to have belts on the rest of the class and future students. Said that their training would benefit from the structure and while we did not want/ require it, perhaps the others (particulary beginners) did.

So we are looking into this again.....

[SevenStar]

The main problem that I notice with belts is that many students will see getting belts as the goal instead of improving their Kung Fu. I've seen it happen even in schools that aren't mckwoon belt-factories. I think the best way to reduce the number of students with this attitude is to emphasize that the skills are what counts, not the belts. But even if you do this, I think you'll still get some people who will look at it the other way around. But what can you do? Martial arts schools attract all kinds. There are certain kinds of people that are very into having a rank, wearing uniforms, adhering to formalities, and things like that. From my experiences with those types, they put belts on pedestals.

that's not a big problem as long as the criteria are correct. for example, in bjj a white belt will not be considered for promotion until they can regularly beat the other white belts and at least hang with the lower level blues. in this manner, the belts really mean something. the skill and belt go hand in hand.

[Adventure427]

That's pretty cool 7. I like that method of grading....based on your level of skill. I beleive i will teach one day and I definantly plan to use that as a structure. Where...you dont learn a new technique just because you have the other one memorized...you learn a new one when you are GOOD at the previous ones. It depends though...Some students aren't in it to win it (as i like to say)...there mostly just there to 'get a workout'. I personally want to be excellent, not just good. I want to be really good.

It depends on what level too though. Like i can totally understand and really admire/respect the bjj grading system at your club. And i plan to implement a similar thing in my school too (im not even close to having my own school though, i just kno where my hearts at)...it depends on where you are at though and what you are doing. Like right now im ANXIOUS to learn the footwork in my kungfu class.....i can't wait to learn that so I can drill the hell out of it...but it doesn't come until later...(yea im newbie)..so at THIS point i would want my students (The one concerned with being good) to be D-A-M-N GOOD at their footwork before taking em real far, because its the essence of the art (in my opinion)..and fighting.

[SevenStar]

That's pretty cool 7. I like that method of grading....based on your level of skill. I beleive i will teach one day and I definantly plan to use that as a structure. Where...you dont learn a new technique just because you have the other one memorized...you learn a new one when you are GOOD at the previous ones. It depends though...Some students aren't in it to win it (as i like to say)...there mostly just there to 'get a workout'. I personally want to be excellent, not just good. I want to be really good.

the students don't have to be in it to win - but as a teacher, you want to be sure you produce the highest quality students you can, right? our guys don't roll thinking "okay, I'm gonna tap everybody this time" - it's not competitive - it's training. rolling is fun and gives everyone a chance to use what they learned. rolling is done EVERY class, so it's easy to see progress, even in the guys who have no intention of competing.

[neilhytholt]

but as a teacher, you want to be sure you produce the highest quality students you can, right?

Only if they want their students to compete. Otherwise they don't seem to really care, do they? Students seem to be just a $ number per month for most teachers.