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Thread: Tim Allen tops Mamet's 'Redbelt'

  1. #61
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    a local review

    I generally like von Busack's reviews. They run in our Si Valley weekly. He has a certain acerbic quality I enjoy. I want to say that he's generally harsh on martial arts films, but I can't back up that statement with any evidence.
    Fight Club
    David Mamet makes like Chuck Norris in 'Redbelt'
    By Richard von Busack

    THERE ARE some thwarted expectations in Redbelt, David Mamet's middling, slightly baffling drama of Men With Codes. Richard (David Paymer), a loan shark, learns that he's out $30,000. Instead of raging about it, he clutches his stomach in panic. It must be a variation of the proverb about how if you owe a large enough amount of money, you own the bank, the bank doesn't own you. With a defaulting customer, Richard is now in trouble with his higher-ups. This clutching of the belly may be the most sensible reaction by a, er, microfinancier onscreen since Travolta's Chili in Get Shorty noted that if you break your debtor's legs, how is he going to pay you off?Similar common sense prevails in a moment where a traumatized rape victim (Emily Mortimer) is given her first lesson in self-defense. We also note some craft in the hard-bitten lines for Ricky "Satan's Librarian" Jay, here playing a fight promoter. The key incident in Redbelt, the story of a valuable watch, sounds like a true anecdote. (It may be something Mamet spun off from Maupassant, but it sounds plausible, like a piece of Hollywood gossip you just ache to believe.) In Redbelt, Mamet appears to be reaching out to an action-movie crowd. The foreign-language-training-tape quality of some of his dialogue doesn't seem to echo off the plywood of the sets, as it does in some of his other films. The gears mesh; it's just that the machine as a whole doesn't work.

    A thoroughly honorable West L.A. jujitsu teacher named Mike Terry is played by one of the very best actors around, Chiwetel Ejiofor. As in seeing Philip Marlowe, we can tell at a glance that Terry is honest: he lives in L.A. and yet he has no money. Through a chain of events, Terry encounters a powerful Hollywood star (Tim Allen). The star hires him as a consultant on an Iraq war movie he's shooting in the nearby desert. On the strength of this new job, Mike's wife, Sondra (Alice Braga), gets into debt. All of this pushes Mike in the one direction he doesn't want to go. This black-belt, whose motto is "There is always an escape," is being forced into a free-style prizefighting match he wants nothing to do with. The sinister gimmick: fighters have to draw lots, a black or a white marble, to see whether or not a limb will be immobilized before the fight.It seems that Mamet trained in martial arts for five years, and he has all due reverence for his teachers. He insists on the selflessness and the good hearts of such teachers. Fair enough. Even so, Redbelt is a Chuck Norris plot, no matter how much an intelligent director/writer refines it. Mamet would have thrived in the days when movies were 60 minutes long. Shorter running times would have let him glide by the weak spots, like the baffling behavior of a dumb but decent policeman who has fewer cops looking out for him when he's in trouble than any cop you've ever seen in a movie. A shorter running time might also make up for the almost translucent thinness of the female characters. As always in Mamet, the women here are men, second-class. They might be promoted to men someday if they keep up the good work.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
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  2. #62

    Thumbs up Redbelt

    This flick looks like it has potential. Although, I hope Couture isn't spending too much time lookin pretty cuz when he meets Fedor..it's gunna be for real, yo. Hope it goes down as an Xmas 08 Xtravaganza~

    http://www.apple.com/trailers/sony/redbelt/


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  3. #63
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    "As always in Mamet, the women here are men, second-class. They might be promoted to men someday if they keep up the good work."

    "The true meaning of a given movement in a form is not its application, but rather the unlimited potential of the mind to provide muscular and skeletal support for that movement." Gregory Fong

  4. #64
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    see this thread...
    "The true meaning of a given movement in a form is not its application, but rather the unlimited potential of the mind to provide muscular and skeletal support for that movement." Gregory Fong

  5. #65
    ..lol.

    Oh well..from the trailer..it seemed s'ok to me.

    It's all good.

    nospam

  6. #66
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    i hear redbelt is decent. dude scotty ferrel from sirius satelite radio is in it. :thumbup:
    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Mantis View Post
    Genes too busy rocking the gang and scarfing down bags of cheetos while beating it to nacho ninjettes and laughing at the ridiculous posts on the kfforum. In a horse stance of course.

  7. #67
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    Finally it's in the right forum! I hope to see it soon. I heard if you only watch it for the fights you will be disappointed, but it's a good movie.
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  8. #68
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    I saw it today and it's a well-made movie, IMO. I did not expect the fights to be great, so I was not disappointed. The acting is very good, however. I did notice at least a couple of characters in the film had an odd habit of saying something, then repeating it another 1 to 2 times quickly in a robotic manner, besides the guy giving pre-fight info to the fighters.

  9. #69
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    baffling

    I still haven't seen Redbelt. I really must. I never got a screener.

    I haven't seen Never Back Down either. I was going to skip it, but to hear it described as 'an MMA version of "High School Musical"' kind of makes me want to see it.

    I was expecting this review to go into Fighting. That's the next one on the horizon.

    When Mixed Martial Arts Meet the Movies
    By R. Emmet Sweeney

    Mixed martial arts (MMA) have come a bloody long way since John McCain legendarily dubbed the sport "human ****fighting" in 1996. Its flagship organization, the Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC), aired eight of the top 15 pay-per-view programs in 2007 (boxing had four), while two smaller outfits (Strikeforce and EliteXC) have recently inked deals to air events on NBC and CBS. With major media outlets slowly offering more coverage and the sport's popularity continuing to crest, it was only a matter of time before Hollywood got its opportunistic hands on those tantalizing cauliflower ears... right?

    Uncharacteristic of the movie business, producers are showing restraint in capitalizing on the fad, perhaps still haunted by McCain's "****" slam. David Mamet encountered fierce resistance to his new MMA influenced film, "Redbelt," as he tells Sam Alipour of ESPN.com: "Everybody in Hollywood passed on it. One of the things I talked about (in the pitch) was the demographics of UFC. Look at who goes to these fights. Look at how many follow on TV. It's huge among young males, exactly the demographic studios are trying to reach. You're wondering how you can get these people to see a film? Well, this is your answer. The reaction was baffling."

    Much of the reason still lies in the sport's "barbaric" reputation, a holdover from the early days of the UFC, when they advertised, "There are no rules!" and trumpeted supposed mismatches between heavyweights and lightweights. Editorials are regularly churned out about the "bestial" nature of the sport (shockingly, Don King and Bill O'Reilly have joined the chorus), despite the UFC's relatively clean bill of health (no life-threatening injuries to date), at least in comparison to pro boxing's spotty history. After McCain virtually bankrupted the business by encouraging governors to outlaw the fights (which 36 states obliged), the UFC was bought out in 2001 by the marketing-savvy company Zuffa. Although the UFC had already instituted a series of new regulations (no blows to the back of the head, etc.) that cleared them to hold an event in New Jersey in 2000, the new owners claimed to be innovators of the sport, and started to convince regulatory commissions, state by state, that they were safe enough to be allowed into their fair cities. In other words, they were no longer barbarians, but could still get fans to pay at the gate. Now even McCain says that "the sport has grown up," and most states have legalized it.

    Another reason for Hollywood's reluctant embrace of MMA is the question of whether these fighting styles can even translate effectively to the screen. Mamet brings this up in a 2006 Playboy piece he wrote about the sport — how do you film the jiu-jitsu fights themselves? He claims that the form never broke into national consciousness like kung fu or karate because it is inherently uncinematic: "A fight, to be dramatic, must allow the viewer to see the combatants now coming together, now separating... Jiu-jitsu involves tying up — that is, closing the distance and keeping it closed...It is not dramatic. It is just effective." Fights that employ this style tend to look like especially sweaty make-out sessions that go on for three rounds. "Never Back Down," an MMA version of "High School Musical" released earlier this year, dealt with this issue by literally skipping over the foreplay, utilizing MTV-style montage to jump to the submissions, eliding the minutes of groping and intricate body contortions it takes to get there. On "Redbelt," Mamet and cinematographer Robert Elswit (hot off of "There Will Be Blood") take a more intimate route, employing very tight handheld framing to capture the technical skill involved in these grappling battles. These fights are not about thrills, but as the main character Mike Terry says, "I train to prevail, not to fight." They are merely the most efficient means to an end. The main visual interest in the film, as Mamet noted in the New York Times, are the faces, which Elswit tends to shoot in profile on extreme edges of the widescreen frame, their bruised faces as purple as Mamet's prose is lean.

    The film continues Mamet's obsession with secretive male societies on the edge of the law (gamblers in "House of Games," security officers in "Spartan," thieves in "Heist"). "Redbelt" follows the moral path of Mike Terry (Chiwetel Ejiofor), an ascetic jiu-jitsu instructor who intones that "competition weakens the fighter." Mamet, a jiu-jitsu student for over five years, treats the martial art more as a philosophy than a physical skill, a conduit for self-discipline and moral purity. Terry is like a masterless samurai planted into modern day L.A, his codes of honor ridiculous to the more practical-minded citizens (and viewers) around him. Terry's refusal to compromise on the ethics of fighting leads him on a collision course with the market economy that's dying to exploit both his mind and body. Mamet's Manichean setup can be overwrought at times, but it's the necessary backdrop for his passionate defense of martial values. It ends in an improbable PPV fantasy, an alternate floodlit universe where the old samurai ways triumph for a night and momentarily silence the bloodthirsty bleatings of the marketplace.

    In other words, not good tie-in material for the UFC, which is still too busy trying to land a cable deal with HBO or Showtime to concern themselves with the movie business yet. But at this point it seems inevitable that an MMA movie genre will shortly work itself out, likely plotting a middle road between the populist street fights of "Never Back Down" and the angsty existential battles of "Redbelt." The visual grammar of MMA is in its infancy, but I hope the Mamet film provides the template: an economic, unobtrusive style seems appropriate for such brutally efficient fighting — a science more salty than sweet.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
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  10. #70
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    Though there is an MMA contest in it, I wouldn't necessarily consider Red Belt an MMA movie. It's a BJJ movie, which isn't necessarily the same thing.

    IMO probably still the best onscreen representation of MMA is Donnie Yen in Flashpoint. It was incorporated into the story without the entire focus being on it, and best of all, it was NOT a 'tournament movie' like most American MA films tend to be.

  11. #71
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    I really wanted to like this film...

    ...and I'm not 100% sure why I didn't. I'm a great supporter of any martial arts film that breaks the iron-clad stereotypes of martial arts. Redbelt just reinforced them.

    It felt over-written. The plot was painfully complex and excessive in its duplicity. I hate 'reluctant fighter' films. I've met so many fighters - real fighters - both champions in the ring and bangers in the street - and reluctance is not one of their personality traits. It's more of a weird defensiveness expressed by writers about fighters - writers who dream of being able to fight but lack that talent and determination for it - so they create this absurd device of a reluctant fighter that is somehow more noble than someone who just fights.

    I'm also tired of the old 'corrupt fight game' plot. Sure, there's corruption in any sport and probably more so in the fight game because of gambling, but come on. Show us something new here if your going to go there. There was such implausibility with some of the plot twists and some fundamental misinterpretations of the 'warrior code' that made the whole experience rather painful. Mamet claims to have studied BJJ but he's a nibbler when it comes to understanding any warrior code. There were some major contradictions there. Ejiofor's fortune cookie wisdom was trite and couldn't hold a candle to Master Po or Yoda.

    The acting performances were good. All the actors turned in decent work for what they were given. It's Allen's best performance since Santa Clause. And I'm a huge fan of Ricky Jay. His book Cards as Weapons was brilliant and held a prize position in my martial library until it was borrowed and never returned.

    The fight scenes were mediocre, but we weren't expecting much. There was a scene that sort of showed off some BJJ techniques, but the transitions were so forced and staged that it wasn't in the least way exciting. The finale move, a Jackie Chan-esque escape from an RNC was absurd. It was an obvious tip of the cap to the fortune cookie wisdom that had been pounded into us from the very first scene. But to go Jackie for the end not only belittled the BJJ theme, anyone who knows the slightest thing about an RNC knows that it was a sure way to snap your own neck. If I've got my RNC locked in, there's no way that would work, even if you were Randy Couture. Of course, Couture could peel me off like a banana skin in so many other ways. They should have gone with something like that. The highlight of that fight was that the villain was flying the colors of our newsstand competitor.

    Ultimately I was very disappointed in Redbelt. On reflection, I think it was because I was really hoping it would transcend of the genre. It's probably a decent film if you don't have that expectation.
    Gene Ching
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  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneChing View Post
    ...and I'm not 100% sure why I didn't. I'm a great supporter of any martial arts film that breaks the iron-clad stereotypes of martial arts. Redbelt just reinforced them.

    It felt over-written. The plot was painfully complex and excessive in its duplicity. I hate 'reluctant fighter' films. I've met so many fighters - real fighters - both champions in the ring and bangers in the street - and reluctance is not one of their personality traits. It's more of a weird defensiveness expressed by writers about fighters - writers who dream of being able to fight but lack that talent and determination for it - so they create this absurd device of a reluctant fighter that is somehow more noble than someone who just fights.

    I'm also tired of the old 'corrupt fight game' plot. Sure, there's corruption in any sport and probably more so in the fight game because of gambling, but come on. Show us something new here if your going to go there. There was such implausibility with some of the plot twists and some fundamental misinterpretations of the 'warrior code' that made the whole experience rather painful. Mamet claims to have studied BJJ but he's a nibbler when it comes to understanding any warrior code. There were some major contradictions there. Ejiofor's fortune cookie wisdom was trite and couldn't hold a candle to Master Po or Yoda.

    The acting performances were good. All the actors turned in decent work for what they were given. It's Allen's best performance since Santa Clause. And I'm a huge fan of Ricky Jay. His book Cards as Weapons was brilliant and held a prize position in my martial library until it was borrowed and never returned.

    The fight scenes were mediocre, but we weren't expecting much. There was a scene that sort of showed off some BJJ techniques, but the transitions were so forced and staged that it wasn't in the least way exciting. The finale move, a Jackie Chan-esque escape from an RNC was absurd. It was an obvious tip of the cap to the fortune cookie wisdom that had been pounded into us from the very first scene. But to go Jackie for the end not only belittled the BJJ theme, anyone who knows the slightest thing about an RNC knows that it was a sure way to snap your own neck. If I've got my RNC locked in, there's no way that would work, even if you were Randy Couture. Of course, Couture could peel me off like a banana skin in so many other ways. They should have gone with something like that. The highlight of that fight was that the villain was flying the colors of our newsstand competitor.

    Ultimately I was very disappointed in Redbelt. On reflection, I think it was because I was really hoping it would transcend of the genre. It's probably a decent film if you don't have that expectation.
    I haven't seen redbelt yet, had mixed feelings about it because of most of the stuff you just mentioned.
    I did order BlackBelt ( Kuro-Obi) and am looking forward to it.
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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneChing View Post
    ...and I'm not 100% sure why I didn't. I'm a great supporter of any martial arts film that breaks the iron-clad stereotypes of martial arts. Redbelt just reinforced them.

    It felt over-written. The plot was painfully complex and excessive in its duplicity. I hate 'reluctant fighter' films. I've met so many fighters - real fighters - both champions in the ring and bangers in the street - and reluctance is not one of their personality traits. It's more of a weird defensiveness expressed by writers about fighters - writers who dream of being able to fight but lack that talent and determination for it - so they create this absurd device of a reluctant fighter that is somehow more noble than someone who just fights.

    I'm also tired of the old 'corrupt fight game' plot. Sure, there's corruption in any sport and probably more so in the fight game because of gambling, but come on. Show us something new here if your going to go there. There was such implausibility with some of the plot twists and some fundamental misinterpretations of the 'warrior code' that made the whole experience rather painful. Mamet claims to have studied BJJ but he's a nibbler when it comes to understanding any warrior code. There were some major contradictions there. Ejiofor's fortune cookie wisdom was trite and couldn't hold a candle to Master Po or Yoda.

    The acting performances were good. All the actors turned in decent work for what they were given. It's Allen's best performance since Santa Clause. And I'm a huge fan of Ricky Jay. His book Cards as Weapons was brilliant and held a prize position in my martial library until it was borrowed and never returned.

    The fight scenes were mediocre, but we weren't expecting much. There was a scene that sort of showed off some BJJ techniques, but the transitions were so forced and staged that it wasn't in the least way exciting. The finale move, a Jackie Chan-esque escape from an RNC was absurd. It was an obvious tip of the cap to the fortune cookie wisdom that had been pounded into us from the very first scene. But to go Jackie for the end not only belittled the BJJ theme, anyone who knows the slightest thing about an RNC knows that it was a sure way to snap your own neck. If I've got my RNC locked in, there's no way that would work, even if you were Randy Couture. Of course, Couture could peel me off like a banana skin in so many other ways. They should have gone with something like that. The highlight of that fight was that the villain was flying the colors of our newsstand competitor.

    Ultimately I was very disappointed in Redbelt. On reflection, I think it was because I was really hoping it would transcend of the genre. It's probably a decent film if you don't have that expectation.
    Gene:
    Though I liked the film, I agree with you on a number of points.

    It felt a bit odd to me that the main guy, a BJJ master, was using an odd "samurai" philosophy and eschewed competition, when competitive matches and actual fights are what it developed on. Not to mention...I'm a bit dubious about a "samurai" or traditional philosophy about avoidance of contests. In most instances (there are exceptions of course), in fairly recent history (late 1800s to present), martial arts in Japan often place a heavy emphasis on competitive fighting. In fact, Maeda, whose jiu-jitsu became the characteristic "BJJ", was obviously one who was cut from that cloth.

    And I did feel that the walk-up backflip on the wall was out of place and dangerous. Then when everyone was holding him in awe because of it as if he were a god seemed out of place in the film.

  14. #74
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    Thank YOU Jimbo!

    The samurai/jiu-jitsu/no competition thing is exactly what I'm talking about. Japanese martial arts hold the duel in high esteem. Whether that's a duel on the field of battle or in a sumo ring or a baseball diamond, no where does it say that a samurai should not compete because it's not honorable. Quite the opposite.

    And the end was just plain weird. The Jackie-flip-RNC break and the whole belt thing. That was another thing that really bothered me. If Ejiofor's character was so honorable, passing someone their black belt in a locker room was pretty lame.

    What an odd role for Inosanto tho. I kept looking at him and thinking "that's not Inosanto, is it? No. Wait. It IS him!"
    Gene Ching
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  15. #75
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    My question is why did it last in the theaters for such a short time, borderline a direct to DVD movie.

    I wonder why it didn't connect with an audience? I mean surely, all the BJJ/MMA practitioners would have gone to see it, no?
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