Blame David Carradine, MMA vs. TCMA, Chest-beating, and why I’ve come not to care

[bodhitree]

Xia

I'm glad you're still alive (after the september Takeshi Kumite), and although you have recovered from your physical injuries, it appears that you are still suffering from the mental scars.

Let me tell you an ancient saying

the tiger has confidence in his path, the dragon also see's the goal ahead, this is the essence of the judo fist.....

[mickey]

The Xia,

I watched the pilot of Kung Fu again (just because of you). The last fight scene exemplifies what quite a few posters have said already about Chinese martial arts-- that they are one and the same with MMA. Thoough the choreography lacks sophistication and the camera angles sucked, you get the punching, kicking, throwing, fighting in the top mount position, as well as fighting from the ground. David Chow was the choreographer for the pilot and it is he who is facing Carradine in the last scene.

The series suffered from his absence.

Take a look for yourself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00p3c_Tl2Uk



mickey

[The Xia]

Xia

I'm glad you're still alive (after the september Takeshi Kumite), and although you have recovered from your physical injuries, it appears that you are still suffering from the mental scars.

Let me tell you an ancient saying

the tiger has confidence in his path, the dragon also see's the goal ahead, this is the essence of the judo fist.....

The wisdom of the ages never fails to set my Judo Fist at its rightful place.

[The Xia]

The Xia,

I watched the pilot of Kung Fu again (just because of you).

All for me! Should I be flattered?

The last fight scene exemplifies what quite a few posters have said already about Chinese martial arts-- that they are one and the same with MMA.

Although, I'd agree with that only if by "MMA," one is refering to a mixture of skillsets (like Ti, Da, Shuai, Na). Or the fact that traditionally, TCMA incorporates elements from other styles into its core.

Thoough the choreography lacks sophistication and the camera angles sucked, you get the punching, kicking, throwing, fighting in the top mount position, as well as fighting from the ground. David Chow was the choreographer for the pilot and it is he who is facing Carradine in the last scene.)

The series suffered from his absence.

Take a look for yourself:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00p3c_Tl2Uk



mickey

Thanks for the link. I see what you mean.

[johnnycache]

MMA is a rules-set. MMA "vs" TMA is something made up by defensive TMAer's answering the question "Why don't you enter MMA?"

the answers:

1) We just don't care/are philosophically opposed to "sport fighting"

Well, you still need to spar hard at all ranges to fairly charge for the task of fight training.

2) We're not just about the fighting - we're also about the culture

Well, you still need to train good fighting along with your culture.

3) MMA guys are just big dumb jocks

First off, if you get to claim that, then those MMA people who say kung fu people are a bunch of silly sinophiles get their say as well. Second, toplevel mma competitors are certainly fine athletes - as should any top level martial artist be, but I think the elements of "dumbness" and "aggressiveness" you choose to perceive come as much from the threat to your paradigm as from empirical evidence.

4) Look how sloppy that striking is it looks nothing like my form

Well, no plan survives contact with the enemy, and it's harder to kick pretty when the guy's allowed to tackle you.

5) What about breaking? The Lion Dance? Weapons?

Guess what? you can have all that in your school and still have a full contact fight team.

6) I think I'd get bored of MMA, kung fu has so much variety

This is an "american audience" comment of the same ilk as "boo stop going to the ground" - the challenge of covering all ranges, especially developing a deep ground game, and applying all assimilated material in a live setting equals or exceeds that of learning many different forms and moves. And, of course, you can use all that intricate kung fu in the MMA polygon, any time you want.

7)What about the various TCMA tournaments? Aren't they just as good?

Some of them are, some of them aren't. There are certainly hard CMA comps out there - if they are failing in popularity next to MMA, boxing, or another sport that is probably an issue of venue and advertising. In other words, I'd love to watch Saturday Sanda on Spike - get it on the air.

Again, MMA is simply an open rules-set. Open to all. MMA trained, ground trained, standup trained, traditional trained, western-trained, whatever. It's a laboratory for testing martial arts and individual fighters with as few restrictions as possible. That should excite, not threaten, a true martial artist.

So why is there all the defensiveness and rationalization? Why are so many people deeply threatened and displeased by the opportunity to safely and publicly use, test, and promote the arts they've spend years training in? And has it occurred to any of you that part of the reason for the formation of a distinct MMA culture might be the rejection of MMA by the old guard in Asian martial arts? The "MMA culture" is a democratic one - anyone can join by starting a fight team or signing up to fight, so if your level of input is minimized and your cultural input is minimized, consider the degree to which that stems from you minimizing your participation and voicing your disdain and excuses.