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Thread: Jeet Kune Do and Religion

  1. #1
    illusionfist Guest

    Jeet Kune Do and Religion

    Do any of you apply your jeet kune do philosophy to your religion? Like refusing to be bound by one set of religious tenets, using many philosphies from different religions to suit your own philosphies?

    I have found that i do this when it comes to me and my religious philosophy. I believe that for us to evolve as a people, we have to understand each other socially and spiritually.

    What do y'all think?

    Peace [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  2. #2
    HuangKaiVun Guest
    Very good, Illusionfist!

    By picking and choosing from here and there, you'll likely eventually end up with something that's closer to the original than you had originally intended.

  3. #3
    xingyiman Guest
    I think martial arts and religion are two totally different things. Martial arts(in my opinion) are based on science for the most part(the science of fighting) The science of martial arts is(or most people think, should) be largely utilitarian based-what works and what doesn't. I think that faith and a priori(before experience) knowlegde plays a large role as the basis of the creed of a lot of religions. I think we have unfortunately fallen into a kind nihilistic relativism concerning religion of sorts in our modern society. I guess to really answer your question, one would really have to define relgion. Is religion just really the psychological opium of the masses, in which case on religion is as good as another, or is it something more than that, a search for truth directed toward the intended end of human beings(heaven, nirvana, etc.) I am not going to tell you how to define religion but my opinion is that the pick-and-choose cafeteria style regarding religion and the notion that all religions are essentially the same has led to a general religious indifference and agnosticism, which can lead to spiritual bankruptcy. To me the concept of religious doctrines is not limiting but progressive. To get beyond the extremely vague concept of a mysterious "Tao" toward the concept of a monotheistic personal God who has a clear purpose for us is very progressive. So to me talking about martial arts and religion is the same as talking about Science and religion, although I don't think those two are necessarily opposed. Don't get me wrong, I think that there is a lot of truth and goodness in Non-Christian religions and I'm glad religious leaders like the Pope are having ecumenical talks with leaders of non-Christian(like the Pope meeting with the Dalai Lama). Just pray for discernment in your religious path.

    Oh, by the way Xingyiquan(Hsing-I Chuan) and Roman Catholicism are COOL!! He He He!

  4. #4
    illusionfist Guest
    When i thought of this post, i wasn't coming from the martial arts and religion perspective, i was thinking more along the lines of using the philosophy that just happens to be in JKD and applying it to religious life. Unlike you, i don't find the concept of the tao particularly vague, but i don't think of taoism as a religion. I believe that's the problem with many people today, they look at eastern philosophies and they automatically dub them as relgious doctrine. It is still possible to be a buddhist and a christian at the same time.

    Extend what Dan Inosanto said about JKD. Some people might wear a size 32 coat, but does that mean it fits you. JKD tailors the art to you. Now use that for religion. Just because you might think Catholicism (which i truely believe IS a polytheistic denomination of Christianity)is great, doesn't mean that it's going to be good for me. Many eastern philosophies don't deal with the "afterlife", they are concerned about the here and now.

    I actually take Huang's point to heart.

    Xingyiman, have you read Emile Durkheim's "The Elementary Forms of Religious Life"? How about "The Lost Gospel of Q"? This is where i am coming from, and it extends the JKD philosophy to religious life, even though Durkheim was around long before Bruce.

    I am not trying to make this a religious debate by any means, so please let's not get into an argument about religions or philosphies. I just wanted to know if people who practiced JKD extended the philosophy to other areas of their life, a large one being religion or their personal spirituality.

    Enough of my rambling

    Peace out [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  5. #5
    HuangKaiVun Guest
    Personally, I don't see the difference between Christianity and Buddhism - especially when I read the Holy Bible on my own.

    Similarly, I don't see the difference between JKD and other "traditional" martial arts - especially when I question the arts on my own.

  6. #6
    illusionfist Guest
    Essentially seeing the totality and not consciously trying to separate oneself from the unit in order to feed the ego.

    At the root level, all of the aforementioned belife systems have the same basic values and beliefs, but i believe that one must have to find their personal beliefs (and spirituality for that matter).

    Peace [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  7. #7
    Braden Guest
    Didn't we have this discussion on the internal board a month ago? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  8. #8
    Sihing73 Guest
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by HuangKaiVun:
    [B]Personally, I don't see the difference between Christianity and Buddhism - especially when I read the Holy Bible on my own.

    Well, the big difference between Christianity and Buddhism would have to be that Christ claimed to be the Son of God while Buddha did not claim any special supernatural dispensation. I think that when you read the Bible you will find many of the "commandments" make perfect sense. However, the crux of the Bible is the foretelling of the Messiah and the culmination of this event with the birth of Christ. Thus the birth of "Christianity".

    So the big difference between the two is that one claims to be based on the acceptance of the Son of God and the other is no more than a collection of "middle road" philosophy. We could also go into the fact that of all the major "religions" only one claims to have an empty tomb for the founder. I don't know but I see quite a few differences between Christianity and Buddhism but then again maybe it's just me [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]



  9. #9
    HuangKaiVun Guest
    Well said!

    External differences mean very little to me, especially because I read the Holy Bible METAPHORICALLY and not LITERALLY.

    The same goes for martial arts as far as I'm concerned.

    Same but different, different but same.

  10. #10
    qilady Guest
    After being raised as a catholic, but always feeling like I understood religion differently than the nuns at school were teaching it, it was refreshing to hear the Eastern perspective through my martial arts training in college. (Not that my training involved the religious aspect - just more books and related materials that I encountered.) And yes, I would have to say that from that exposure, I have delved into more types of viewpoints, resulting in a view that I am comfortable with and is "eclectic" - in the same vein as Bruce Lee's approach to martial arts. I try to expose my kids to differing ideas - they get the Eastern perspective from me, the Native American view from my husband, and I also occasionally take them to a Christian church (with a minister who I feel has a very positive approach and gives credence to other religions), so that they may form that an internal religion that is their own and can carry and evolve with them as they grow up.

  11. #11
    illusionfist Guest
    Thank you qilady for the reply. I too believe in that mode of conveying religion and i believe it is quite progressive. Giving a child an open mind is probably one of the best gifts that you can ever give them.

    Peace [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  12. #12
    Monkey Guest

    Here's something from '101 Zen Stories'

    -Not Far from Buddha-

    A university student while visiting Gasan asked him: "Have you ever read the Christian Bible?"

    "No, read it to me," said Gasan.

    The student opened the bible and read from St. Matthew: "And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lillies of the field, how they grow. They toil not, neither do they spin, and yet I say unto you that even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. ... Take therefore no thought for the morrow, for the morrow shall take thought for things of itself."

    Gasan said: "Whoever uttered those words I consider an enlightened man."

    The student continued reading: "Ask and it shall be given to you, seek and ye shall find, knock and it shall be opened unto you. For everyone that asketh receiveth, and he that seeketh findeth, and to him that knocketh, it shall be opened."

    Gasan remarked: "That is excellent. Whoever said that is not far from Buddhahood."

  13. #13
    illusionfist Guest
    **** monkey, that was good. I appreciate that.

    Peace out [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

  14. #14
    Ian Brewster Guest
    Religion and martial arts are both rooted in the same ground...

    Religion and martial arts were both created initially with clear goals and purpose, martial arts for the purposes of dense and later enlightenment and religion for spirtual freedom and knowledge and ultimately enlightenment...

    Both have become closed minded (in general). Both say one thing on the surface and it's practitioners do something different. Both refuse to see anything but their points of view as correct and both are living breathing contradictions....

    This is not to say i have no religious beliefs or do not enjoy the arts...but it seems that those who truly understand religion or martial arts go beyond style or religion or any one given system.

    All of our greatest leaders eventually went beyond the systems that spawned them. Jesus went beyond traditional Jewish dogma, Bruce Lee beyond the classical martial arts mess, Ghandi trancended both his religion and political beliefs, Galelieo went beyond the traditional European view of the universe, Martin Luther King went beyond being just a Black civil rights activists but being a human rights activist...

    In the end religion and martial arts though different on the surface are both the same...they once freed people from self imposed prisons they are now prisons themselves, dead patterns and limited viewpoints...(in general)

    My opinion only...

    Ian Brewster

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