Emei Crane

[Shaolin Wookie]

Are you referring to The Shaolin Grandmasters Text(start bashing...now)?

I do know that they state that those from Emei are masters of Crane and Mantis. Is that what you are referring to?

If it is then I am not too sure that you are going to be able to find much info about it.

If not then I am sure that Emei has some type of Crane considering the fact that they are famous for their animal styles. I don't know if this would help but try You tube. Everyone knows that only true masters post on youtube(sarcasm.)

Nope. Not that text, not those guys. Youtube....LOL......I love the sarcasm....

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Are you referring to The Shaolin Grandmasters Text(start bashing...now)?

I do know that they state that those from Emei are masters of Crane and Mantis. Is that what you are referring to?

If it is then I am not too sure that you are going to be able to find much info about it.

If not then I am sure that Emei has some type of Crane considering the fact that they are famous for their animal styles. I don't know if this would help but try You tube. Everyone knows that only true masters post on youtube(sarcasm.)

I will seriously venture a guess in saying that any crane techniques that you do see from Omei styles, are not going to look like the crane you see in Southern styles of KF, i.e., the Crane hand (beak). I think you'll probably see something that's more similiar to the Fukien style.

Are your Shaolin Do Omei Crane forms posted on youtube?

[MasterKiller]

Nope. Not that text, not those guys. Youtube....LOL......I love the sarcasm....

Why not list your sources?

[SouthernTiger]

Are you referring to The Shaolin Grandmasters Text(start bashing...now)?

I do know that they state that those from Emei are masters of Crane and Mantis. Is that what you are referring to?

If it is then I am not too sure that you are going to be able to find much info about it.

If not then I am sure that Emei has some type of Crane considering the fact that they are famous for their animal styles. I don't know if this would help but try You tube. Everyone knows that only true masters post on youtube(sarcasm.)

Although I really dont care what your take is on the book ("The Shaolin Grandmasters' Text") as it is usually the ignorant are the quickest to judge, I would like to clarify a bit.

According to the oral history that I received ( so take this for whatever it is worth to you) there was more of a preponderance of Crane and Mantis masters at Omei. This does not necessarily mean that there was a Mantis and Crane style unique to Omei.

Shaolin Wookie, If you would like, you could post a video of of the 3 crane forms that you learned and I could comment on similarity/difference based on the limited Crane material that I know. However, Tiger is my style of emphasis so my Crane material is quite limited.

-Blake

[Shaolin Wookie]

Why not list your sources?

They're at home buried under the countless piles of grad school research notes I've accumulated this year. Sifting through them to appease your curiosity is not very high on my list of things to do. It's right there above "Lick clean the litter boxes, to prove to yourself that you're truly a man." It'll be a while before I get there. Ironically, it's right below "Kiss a man, to prove to yourself that you're a heterosexual, and then kill the person you kiss so he doesn't tell anyone, and bury him somewhere where nobody will find him--maybe in the litter boxes" on that same list.

I just don't have the time right now.

[Shaolin Wookie]

Although I really dont care what your take is on the book ("The Shaolin Grandmasters' Text") as it is usually the ignorant are the quickest to judge, I would like to clarify a bit.

According to the oral history that I received ( so take this for whatever it is worth to you) there was more of a preponderance of Crane and Mantis masters at Omei. This does not necessarily mean that there was a Mantis and Crane style unique to Omei.

Shaolin Wookie, If you would like, you could post a video of of the 3 crane forms that you learned and I could comment on similarity/difference based on the limited Crane material that I know. However, Tiger is my style of emphasis so my Crane material is quite limited.

-Blake

I don't have the technology...I have a tape-based camcorder, and no video card on my computer. I tried that once upon a time, but gave up because it wasn't worth the effort or the money.

[MasterKiller]

Although I really dont care what your take is on the book ("The Shaolin Grandmasters' Text") as it is usually the ignorant are the quickest to judge, I would like to clarify a bit.-Blake

Shaolin Grandmasters Text is from the quacks at Shaolin.com. Here is Gene Ching's review...

I hope Mr. Henning didn't read the whole book for his own good. Pretty early on, any Shaolin researcher can see how poor the work is - citing Star Wars - come on, really. That could have worked, and may work on the uneducated, but its such a simplistic model and a fantasy at that. I did read the whole work. I'm happy to criticize it point by point, but it would be such a laborious task since there are so many incorrect points. I think Henning just got overwhelmed with the ridiculousness of it, as did I. But I did finish it so if you really want to go, point by point, we can do that. That would be unwise on your part. I would much prefer going point by point with the still anonymous and cowardly OSC.

Hopefully Wookie isn't relying on their website for his research.

[SouthernTiger]

Shaolin Grandmasters Text is from the quacks at Shaolin.com. Here is Gene Ching's review...




Hopefully Wookie isn't relying on their website for his research.

Actually, Shaolin.com is operated independently from the Order of Shaolin Chan. The webmaster used notes that led to the book's inception but the site isn't to be considered "official" (and I use this term loosely).

Thanks for reposting Mr. Ching's "review". I was quite disappointed in his view on the book but everyone is entitled to their opinion. However, I would caution people against taking his word as gospel truth. Better that a person be convinced in his own mind, not simply relying on another's PoV.

Regardless, I have no quarrel with anyone who chooses to believe that the Shaolin Grandmasters' Text is not genuine, but I would sincerely hope that they do their own research and avoid the "Sheep-eople" syndrome.

Shaolin Wookie, if you are interested I would be open to comparing notes, per se, on crane techniques. However, the caveat is that none of my crane material is labeled "Omei Crane", only Shaolin Crane.

Good luck in your research.

-Blake

[MasterKiller]

I didn't even post the good part.

I finally slogged through this piece of crap what a horrid waste of time that was. I must concur with Henning's review in JAMA. What can you expect from 'vanity' publishing?

This book sucks. It is packed with misinformation. It attempts to appear well researched by citing previous publications, but even the most cursory review of the bibliography reveals that it focuses only on recent titles and only in English. In fact, there are some obvious gaffs in here that clearly indicate that the researchers lack even the most fundamental understanding of Chinese language, much less Chinese culture. It's more of a manifesto - some one obviously put a lot of work into this solely to perpetuate their agenda within their strange belt system school. I get sent a lot of manifestos - this has to be the best presentation so far, but it still lacked content.

There's two kickers to this - two outstanding things the just sent sent it over the top. One is that it comes with this little apology blow-in card. What kind of book does that? It's out of fear. Second, and this is why I call them 'cowards,' is that they refuse to identify themselves. They give all sorts of excuses for anonymity, but it's it's really ridiculous when you think about it. After all, this is the martial arts. If you can't lay your name and reputation down on the line with something that you publish, you have no right to stand amongst other martial artists that do.

I feel bad for any newbies who begin their Shaolin journey with this book. They will be so deluded. I can only hope that they can find the truth, in the end.

You can read for yourself where the community tore the book a new one when it came out:
http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...ad.php?t=32279


Wookie, do yourself a favor and steer clear of these guys...

[GeneChing]

I almost never give reviews that are that negative anymore. There's so much negativity in the martial arts already (present thread included) that I generally try to remain positive. However, that book was such a disappointment. It was a set back to Shaolin research in the west.

But back OT, Emei has a lot of different styles because many masters have taken refuge there over the centuries. Like Shaolin, it absorbed a lot; there are many non-indigenous lineages that are very strong in Emei today - xingyi is a classic example. For animal styles, Emei is most renowned for eagle, dragon, snake and monkey. There may be crane and mantis there too, but it's not one of their specialties, to my knowledge. A good resource on Emei would be our 2000 September issue, the Emei Special.

[SouthernTiger]

I almost never give reviews that are that negative anymore. There's so much negativity in the martial arts already (present thread included) that I generally try to remain positive. However, that book was such a disappointment. It was a set back to Shaolin research in the west.

But back OT, Emei has a lot of different styles because many masters have taken refuge there over the centuries. Like Shaolin, it absorbed a lot; there are many non-indigenous lineages that are very strong in Emei today - xingyi is a classic example. For animal styles, Emei is most renowned for eagle, dragon, snake and monkey. There may be crane and mantis there too, but it's not one of their specialties, to my knowledge. A good resource on Emei would be our 2000 September issue, the Emei Special.

Hello Mr. Ching,

I must say that your "review" was a disappointment. Your main issues were directed not at the content but at the fact that there was not an author listed, only an organization. You seemed to throw a tantram at this fact and couldnt look past it.

I would love to actually get some constructive criticism from you (feel free to email me or pm me) but I doubt you really care. I wonder if the reason you were so scathing in your "review" was the fact that the book states that there is no authentic Shaolin at the Shaolin temple. Are you not a disciple of a "Shaolin" monk?

Unfortunetly, most people seem to forget than you are in the business of selling magazines. I wonder how many magazines you would sell if people realized that the "Shaolin temple" is only significant as a tourism destination with fancy wushu, not significant from a martial standpoint.

Regardless, I apolagize to Shaolin Wookie for somewhat hijacking this thread. I wish you luck in your research.

-Blake

[lkfmdc]

Gene, sounds like you need to re-review the book, piece by piece

[cjurakpt]

the only Er Mei White Crane I have ever recalled seening was back at NYU in the late '80's, when there was some tall blond Northern European-looking guy named Olaf or Sven or something (Dave, memory assist here?) teaching a qigong system by that name - no martial usage per se, but the system was eveidently fairly widespread - maybe that is where the SD forms were derived from?

[ittokaos]

I am not here to bash anyone. Much less the OSC. I was simply referring to the bashing that the OSC gets on this forum. I have said it once and I'll say it again(maybe not on this forum) . Just because someone can't prove their lineage doesn't mean they aren't for real. That is a lesson that I have been taught by several Sifus and as I understand more I find it to be true.

My only real problems with the book (in my opinion, which was based on my limited knowledge)were the "GI" that was worn and the fact that the Bak Mei in that book was horribly represented(Chu Gar/Chuka too). It seems as though it was taken directly from HB Un's book(CHu GAr/Chuka was taken from Draeger's)(which was very stingy in it's sharing of Bak Mei knowledge in my opinion). Other than that it was really more about the OSC itself which isn't bad but I think a more indepth representation of the styles would be better.

Also, when one reads the bibliography it really makes it seem as though someone read through all these books and then pieced together their understanding of what Shaolin is/was and then wrote a book about it. That alone would lead to bashing.

I don't know what Gene's reasons for bashing were but anyone with an ok knowledge of Shaolin would be left with mixed feelings. But you are right that Gene is basically a modern Shaolin (and KFTC) ***** but it is really about his skill and not about the politics of his pimps(jk...kinda).

Anyway, I don't really know what your(southern Tiger) relationship is with the OSC but if you could, I would appreciate an actual picture of the brands (dragon/tiger mantis/crane for omei). I am fascinated by them.

Thanks,

WF

[golden arhat]

Hello Mr. Ching,

I must say that your "review" was a disappointment. Your main issues were directed not at the content but at the fact that there was not an author listed, only an organization. You seemed to throw a tantram at this fact and couldnt look past it.

I would love to actually get some constructive criticism from you (feel free to email me or pm me) but I doubt you really care. I wonder if the reason you were so scathing in your "review" was the fact that the book states that there is no authentic Shaolin at the Shaolin temple. Are you not a disciple of a "Shaolin" monk?

Unfortunetly, most people seem to forget than you are in the business of selling magazines. I wonder how many magazines you would sell if people realized that the "Shaolin temple" is only significant as a tourism destination with fancy wushu, not significant from a martial standpoint.

Regardless, I apolagize to Shaolin Wookie for somewhat hijacking this thread. I wish you luck in your research.

-Blake

oh yes because shaolin do is worth so much more martially