Biu Sau

[r4cy]

Hi: I've been thinking about what kind of exercises I could do to strenghten my fingers in order to make my Biu Sau stronger. It's easy to strike the throat and similar "soft" places, but what if I wanted to strike harder places of the body? Any recommendatons. Please limit yourselves to "exercise examples". Thanks

[forever young]

far be it from me to critisize but seriously WTF!!!!!!!! what the hell is wrong with using fists like everyone else ???? how the hell are you going to toughen your fingers up enough to do any significant damage to any hard areas of the body, hell even if you subscribe to 't3h d34d1y eye poke' method of fighting you will appreciate that if you miss your fingers are likely to be broken on the skull, i personally would recommend that any training time you might think of devoting to 'finger conditioning' would be better spent doing some bag work or improving your timing/distancing/body unity-core exersizes or pad work, infact hell i will go as far as to say practice your ability to pee in a straight line before you devote any serious time to that crap/waste of time

of course this is (obviously) just my opinion and if you would care to point me in the direction of any hard evidence as to both the effectiveness of this method of striking and a sensible/safe way to train it and i might be convinced.... oh and before you even say it yes i agree a f*king good poke to the eye is a debilitating attack but it is such a low percentage move i personally wouldnt bother wasting training time when i could be training something both more effective and higher percentage (like a bloody good right hander ) oh yeah also go google/youtube yugi nakai and see for yourself how after suffering a terrible eye injury he still went on to win the fight

[k gledhill]

Id practice accuracy not toughness...if your throwng it ..imo..its to be done super fast and right to the point not ooops my iron finger strike missed

like a pole fight all to a point and back to do it again if need be

hang a sheet of papper in a doorway and try to poke/tear a hole in an X on the paper or 2 x' as eyes
with SPEED ..or put a candle flame out with same finger strike...try with unlit candle until you get the idea or you burn house down

[Sihing73]

Hello r4cy,

I would say be careful because there are said to be meridians in the fingers which when damaged can affect other parts of the body, for example the eyes and vision.

However, having said that, my Sifu trains by peircing his fingers into a bucket of loose sand. I guess you could progress into gravel etc, but I am not sure that it is needed in todays society. I would tend to agree with k gledhill and focus more on accuracy.

FWIW I did see people in Germany in WT who were able to place their fingers against a board sometimes a 4X4, and break the board by extending their arms. Not sure what training they did to achieve this but it was impressive. Of course, a lot of breaking is impressive but not always practical.

[chusauli]

Biu Sao is using the bridge, not necessarily the fingertips to attack. You would strike with the bridge at extremely close range.

The fingerjab is just one application of Biu Sao, but not the only. As for fingerstrikes, holding your hand properly at the point of impact is what counts.

Hope this helps.

[Sihing73]

Biu Sao is using the bridge, not necessarily the fingertips to attack. You would strike with the bridge at extremely close range.

The fingerjab is just one application of Biu Sao, but not the only. As for fingerstrikes, holding your hand properly at the point of impact is what counts.

Hope this helps.

Hello Robert,

So by this explanation a Fak Sau is an example of using Bui Sau? When referring to the "bridge" is there a specific part of the arm brought into play? Seems like you could use the forearm and the wrist and each would involve a different type of both contact and energy so I would be curious as to what differs or if the tem Biu Sau refers to both? What is the difference between striking with the forearm, wrist or hand/fingers/palm and which would be considered Biu Sau and why?

Not trying to be insulting but seems like you are indicating that Biu Sau is more of a concept relying on bridge contact rather than a specific technique. Kind of like the three familes of Taun/Fook/Bong which each gives rise to various techniques under each "families or seeds" concept. If this is the case then perhaps we can identify the shapes or techniques specific to a Biu Sau.

[r4cy]

Well, I've seen dudes from a system called Pangai Noon Kung Fu ( AKA Uechi Ryu Karate) this is a southern style of kung fu and this people can really strike with the tips of their fingers. Not only the ones from the hand but with the feet as well.Here is a clip showing it. The thing is that I'd like to know if there is a progressive way to achieve this. Iron palm training has similar progressive methods, I'm looking to do so with the fingers .

[Phil Redmond]

Hello Robert,

So by this explanation a Fak Sau is an example of using Bui Sau? When referring to the "bridge" is there a specific part of the arm brought into play? Seems like you could use the forearm and the wrist and each would involve a different type of both contact and energy so I would be curious as to what differs or if the tem Biu Sau refers to both? What is the difference between striking with the forearm, wrist or hand/fingers/palm and which would be considered Biu Sau and why?

Not trying to be insulting but seems like you are indicating that Biu Sau is more of a concept relying on bridge contact rather than a specific technique. Kind of like the three familes of Taun/Fook/Bong which each gives rise to various techniques under each "families or seeds" concept. If this is the case then perhaps we can identify the shapes or techniques specific to a Biu Sau.

Hey Dave, I agree with Robert. It's a concept where your arm "darts" out. I used to say thrust until I had a professor of Chinese tell me that "darting" better explains biu than thrust. He gave the analogy of the way a Dragonfly darts through the air.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Hi: I've been thinking about what kind of exercises I could do to strenghten my fingers in order to make my Biu Sau stronger. It's easy to strike the throat and similar "soft" places, but what if I wanted to strike harder places of the body? Any recommendatons. Please limit yourselves to "exercise examples". Thanks

Considering that the only people I have seen use finger strikes effectively in real fights and full contact sparring, had "deformed" fingers, perhaps you would be wise to NOT use them, I don't think the pros outweight the cons in this type of "forging".

[Phil Redmond]

Hi: I've been thinking about what kind of exercises I could do to strenghten my fingers in order to make my Biu Sau stronger. It's easy to strike the throat and similar "soft" places, but what if I wanted to strike harder places of the body? Any recommendatons. Please limit yourselves to "exercise examples". Thanks

You don't need strong fingers to apply biu sau. Now biu jee is another matter.

[Ultimatewingchun]

In all fairness to Phil - I highly suspect that indeed he's never seen the 2 diagonal bil jee strikes until recently (ie.- since he became the 2nd "closed door" student within the last year or so)...so he believes he's being honest when he says they're secret.

Because I can also vouch for the fact that William Cheung has never openly taught the 2 as part of TWC.

I learned them from Moy Yat - as I indicated.

Phil only spent just a few months in Moy Yat's school...I'm gonna say it was probably around 1976/1977 (I remember seeing him in the class a few times) - as I started in May, 1975 and stayed until May, 1983...so I can tell you quite unequivocally that Phil never learned the Bil Jee form from Moy Yat.

[sihing]

In all fairness to Phil - I highly suspect that indeed he's never seen the 2 diagonal bil jee strikes until recently (ie.- since he became the 2nd "closed door" student within the last year or so)...so he believes he's being honest when he says they're secret.

Because I can also vouch for the fact that William Cheung has never openly taught the 2 as part of TWC.

I learned them from Moy Yat - as I indicated.

Phil only spent just a few months in Moy Yat's school...I'm gonna say it was probably around 1976/1977 (I remember seeing him in the class a few times) - as I started in May, 1975 and stayed until May, 1983...so I can tell you quite unequivocally that Phil never learned the Bil Jee form from Moy Yat.

The fact that he brings it up here like it is a secret or unique (like it really makes a big difference in someone's ability to fight or use the finger strikes that way by adding two diagonal strikes), tells me lots. Secrets are for marketing masters trying to sell tickets or memberships, and WC has had too much of that for the last decades.

The way I understand the wrists/fingers opening movements in Bui Jee now, it has nothing to do with finger strikes or pressure point hitting, but that doesn't mean I throw away the idea that they can be used for that. There's a time and place for everything.

James

[anerlich]

Nice talking to you, James, as always.

[sihing]

Nice talking to you, James, as always.

The feeling is mutual

[Phil Redmond]

In all fairness to Phil - I highly suspect that indeed he's never seen the 2 diagonal bil jee strikes until recently (ie.- since he became the 2nd "closed door" student within the last year or so)...so he believes he's being honest when he says they're secret.

Because I can also vouch for the fact that William Cheung has never openly taught the 2 as part of TWC.

I learned them from Moy Yat - as I indicated.

Phil only spent just a few months in Moy Yat's school...I'm gonna say it was probably around 1976/1977 (I remember seeing him in the class a few times) - as I started in May, 1975 and stayed until May, 1983...so I can tell you quite unequivocally that Phil never learned the Bil Jee form from Moy Yat.

I met Huey Moy, Moy Yat's nephew, when he was in high school. He brought me to Moy Yat. The school was called Ding Leg back then. It was before I met Duncan Leung. There was also a White Crane Sifu teaching in his apartment. Therefore I was with Moy Yat two different times. I went back to Moy Yat after Alan Lamb left for California. I even had a Moy number which I don't remenber. What year was the school called Ding Leg? That way I'll know when I was there the first time. Victor, the diagonal biu jee was shown years ago. I was joking about "secret". I was just playing on the fact that you probably forgot the other two strikes .
I know you had to have seen them before. I even have a seminar where it is shown. This is getting to be a very funny thread . . . . lol