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Thread: Honest HFY Question-

  1. #16
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    I don't think John meant anything bad and I understand how you might feel. HFY and TWC are controversial versions of WC. You should expect queries based on that fact.
    People always ask why is your tan sao so high, why do you train to fight on the blindside, YM taught everyone the same, your forms look funny? I could go on. I don't react negatively though. The only way to prove the effectiveness of a fighting art is to fight. Get my point? We fight and what we use works. You're going to get questions so what people say doesn't really matter. I deal with questions from a techniacal standpoint. I don't take it personal. After all NONE of us can claim to know everything about WC history or origins.
    Sifu Phillip Redmond
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  2. #17
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    Honest HFY Question-
    no tricks or bait and switch-black and white-yes or no please...
    No one who starts off with a phrase like that is ever taken seriously. It's equivalent to saying "I'm not a racist but..." John, you're on such good terms with Benny why not just ask him your questions.

    Phil
    It's a two way street if you don't want your question to be taken personal might I suggest that a person not take the answer personal either. Phil you of all people should understand how the insincerity of this particular question was perceived by HFY members. We have local and international students and family members who viewed the question based upon John's relationship to Robert which could never be mistaken as sincere given his history and willingness to instigate ill will and distrust. We contrast with the likes of your own family member Sifu Flood who traveled more than 2,000 miles to a HFY Seminar in Dayton to have his questions answered in person. Sifu Flood as you will remember stated he saw things on the surface that he thought were similar to his previous training only to have the details presented to him in person and find out that things can look similar but provided with the details they can actually be quite different that is the route to finding real answers.

    People of questionable character or associates of those with questionable character or a known bias towards the HFY family should expect their questions to be received with some animosity or a watchful eye at the very least. There are many reasons to doubt the sincerity of John's question not the least of which is that he gives no detail for why he raised the question in his original post and later he suggest that for someone who doesn't post very often it makes sense that this inaccurate question was a good reason to post.

    So on the contrary if John is trying to insight the whole of the HFY family both local and internationally by posting questions such as this he only risk further widening the distrust created by Robert Chu and angering our members to the point that they do answer him more harshly than I or Matt have already. You get what you put out Sifu Flood has won the admiration of many of our members simply because he was willing to do things in a manner which show sincerity with action over words. So at this point John appears to be more about games and more distrust than he is about positive and sincere action and interaction involved in positive learning and sharing of ideas. Other HFY members have read the post and chose not to answer him but should they meet in person they might be a little more willing to express themselves to him. That is something to take into account as well when phrasing these questions on an international web site.
    Last edited by canglong; 01-22-2008 at 02:15 AM.
    Tony Jacobs

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  3. #18
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    Its all in how you ask

    John,
    re-
    Why create a problem that isn't here due to knee jerk reaction?

    I asked a black and white question-period.
    If you look at your original question-
    no tricks or bait and switch-black and white-yes or no please...
    To me that comes across like you expect a shady answer or some deception, when you ask like that expect to get a response you probably won't like.

    Matt
    People often choose the comfort of known misery
    to the discomfort of unfamiliar uncertainty -Unknown

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by osprey3883 View Post
    John,
    re-


    If you look at your original question-


    To me that comes across like you expect a shady answer or some deception, when you ask like that expect to get a response you probably won't like.

    Matt
    If you weren't so wary of shadows that are not there you could have interpreted it as: "no tricks or bait and switch on my (John C) part".

    When he is asking for a "yes or no" answer, how can you offer a shady answer? A deceptive one maybe, but that is only a 50-50 possibility.

    You're usually more open than others to questions about HFYWCK.

    HFYWCK against the world ... rah rah rah ...
    Last edited by CFT; 01-22-2008 at 09:56 AM.

  5. #20
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    Chee,

    Some people/groups are their own worst enemy, I'm starting to think that is the case here

    James

  6. #21
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    To me that comes across like you expect a shady answer or some deception, when you ask like that expect to get a response you probably won't like.
    Actually, it came across more like he really wanted a straight answer and was at great pains to try to avoid incurring the long, rambling, paranoid, accusational rants that you and Tony "five dollar man" Jacobs responded with.

    People of questionable character or associates of those with questionable character or a known bias towards the HFY family should expect their questions to be received with some animosity or a watchful eye at the very least.
    Maybe some people have a known bias towards HFY because some of you come across as paranoid lunatics with OCD, or talk smack about other lineages in a book.

    Duende ande JP at least come across as reasonable, the rest of you need to develop some outside interests. Try bonsai or life drawing.

    We have local and international students and family members who viewed the question based upon John's relationship to Robert which could never be mistaken as sincere given his history and willingness to instigate ill will and distrust.
    Sure, and he's in constant contact with Osama Bin Laden and Pol Pot's and Mussolini's ghosts as well

    Are you telling me these "local and international students and family members" are constantly scanning forums lookimg for anti-HFY undertones in posts so that they can expose the perpetrators at length?

    Jesus, get a friggin' life. You HFY guys are weird.
    Last edited by anerlich; 01-22-2008 at 02:20 PM.
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  7. #22
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    When he is asking for a "yes or no" answer, how can you offer a shady answer? A deceptive one maybe, but that is only a 50-50 possibility.
    CFT,
    There is an inherent problem in the fact that you can't give a yes or no answer to an essay question. If John is unhappy with the answer he received to the question he put out he only need look within to understand why that is.
    Tony Jacobs

    ng doh luk mun fa kin kwan

    "...Therefore the truly great man dwells on what is real
    and not what is on the surface,
    On the fruit and not the flower.
    Therefore accept the one and reject the other. "

    World Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Kung Fu Association
    Southern Shaolin Kung Fu Global Discussion Forum

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by canglong View Post
    CFT,
    There is an inherent problem in the fact that you can't give a yes or no answer to an essay question. If John is unhappy with the answer he received to the question he put out he only need look within to understand why that is.
    Frivolous though it may be (though NEVER trivial in my frivolity - b!atch ), you are wrong. The answer was, as previously stated: yes. End of thread, end of drama, end of chat.

    Bonsai can be the only way forward.
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  9. #24
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    To be pedantic, and why not, it beats animosity ...

    Matt answered that gwai ma was in HFYWCK as well as other Southern CMA. He did not confirm or deny that it was in the HFY Biu Jee form.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by canglong View Post
    CFT,
    There is an inherent problem in the fact that you can't give a yes or no answer to an essay question. If John is unhappy with the answer he received to the question he put out he only need look within to understand why that is.
    What a load of bull! I wouldn't touch HFY with a 10 foot pole! You guys come across like a bunch of lunatic cult members! John asked a simple and straight-forward question that was easily answered with "yes" or "no." He included a short disclaimer in the beginning in hopes of avoiding the kind of animostic response that he got. Matt & Tony....all you've managed to do on this thread is...once again....make the HFY family look bad. Good going! Regardless of whether John has some kind of history with HFY, it was a simple question that he asked. Anyone reading this thread that is new to WCK would wonder just what pile of crap John accidently stepped in here, and just what kind of loonies the HFY guys really are!

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by KPM View Post
    John asked a simple and straight-forward question that was easily answered with "yes" or "no."
    LOL....

    Have you tried to read the Book "Mastering Kung Fu" perhaps he should have used the terms "battle arrays" or "Gwai ma science and developement"

    If he'd read the book, he would have realised like i have, with these guys...there are no simple answers.

    Just one mans opinion.

    DREW
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  12. #27
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    Hey Guys-

    thanks-but don't waste or bother-

    I posted it that way to try and have it be simple-SINCE I DON'T POST MUCH,NOT CONNECTED TO ANYONE POLITICALLY,AND HAVE A PRETTY LEVEL HEADED REPUTATION IN MOST CIRCLES-BUT,they misread it-and read into it because I have a relationship with Robert,and I would guess don't hold to the sacred creedo that HFY is a separate animal from TWC-so that makes me guilty of plots and schemes...sorry but it just means I have an opinion that I usually keep to myself-

    I have relationships(patients) with Hookers,Strippers and Porn Stars too-what does that make me?(Lucky?)

    I wasn't even on this regularly-if you can call it that-till about a year ago when Duende used me as a reference to try and help his case about HFY vs TWC-

    I went to the first HFY seminar in Arizona years ago-why-To see for myself-and up until last year-you nor anyone else really heard a peep out of me about what I thought-

    So since I have an opinion that is not shared-I am a bad guy,and obviously on some sort of enemy list it appears--and since I am a friend of Robert's -his puppet

    None of their conclusions hold any water-it's ok-

    Tony wanted me to write an essay about why I wanted to know-

    Well I am a Wing Chun guy-a simple question,not fa kune!

    I posted my reasons already in my second post-direct and to the point-

  13. #28
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    Did you hear the one about a TWC guy, a HFY guy who walked into a bar?? So the WC guy says.......geez give it a friggin rest will you...I swear you guys were banging on with the same he said she said ****e the last time I was here to try and LEARN something interesting...
    earth & metal

  14. #29
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    To be pedantic, and why not, it beats animosity ...
    CFT,
    The difference between the question and the answer only appears that way the animosity is a matter of opinion.
    What a load of bull! I wouldn't touch HFY with a 10 foot pole!
    KPM,
    Anyone coming to that conclusion based upon conversations made on an internet forum is as irresponsible as they are narrow minded.

    There is no need to speculate on answer to a question that is specific to a particular lineage that you can't verify the answer to without more awareness of the system itself. Since everyone here seems to have an opinion based on their own interpretation of the question and their understanding of "Gwai Ma" relative to their experience instead of dwelling on what you perceive as a negative add some positive feed back and answer what you believe "Gwai Ma" is and how it is used in the martial art you practice.
    Tony Jacobs

    ng doh luk mun fa kin kwan

    "...Therefore the truly great man dwells on what is real
    and not what is on the surface,
    On the fruit and not the flower.
    Therefore accept the one and reject the other. "

    World Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Kung Fu Association
    Southern Shaolin Kung Fu Global Discussion Forum

  15. #30
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    It's true, I used John as a reference on a thread TWC/HFY thread awhile back. I assumed that if he had a difference of opinion then the actual TWC trained instructor who was present at that Seminar (Sifu William Mason), that he would of said something then. As John led us to believe by his behavior that he appreciated the HFYWC system knowledge that we focused on at the Seminar.

    Instead he chose to voice his difference of opinion here, years later on KFO...


    Call me paranoid, or what have you... but though it's not a "bait and switch-black", it certainly smells the same to me.






    Differences of opinion are always welcome in my book.

    I just don't have much respect for those who make judgements and act like an expert before they put their time in and have real understanding under their belt.

    But if you guys want to keep listening to the "Seminar Sifu's" go right ahead.




    Liddel

    if you dislike that book so much that my KF brother bought for you... show some class and pass it on to someone else.
    Last edited by duende; 01-23-2008 at 11:11 AM.

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