Page 2 of 80 FirstFirst 12341252 ... LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 1191

Thread: Martial Arts & Religion

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    1,994
    Greetings..

    Historical knowledge of religious connections to the Arts is relevant.. but, dogmatic instruction of a particular belief system during MA class is not likely to be well received.. to insist that an MA student receive religious instruction is contrary to rational thought.. If you choose to offer religious instruction as a separate class with no expectation that a student must accept "your" beliefs, that's fine.. In fact, the walls could be adorned with the Sifu's choice of religious references as long as there is no expectation that free-thinking students adhere to that belief system.. If the Sifu insists that students adhere to a particular belief system, then call it a church, not a Kwoon..

    Although i don't personally claim any single "religion", i do find Taoist Philosophy to be the most closely aligned with my understanding of "Life".. i offer tidbits of Taoist wisdoms during class, but only as it relates to a particular lesson or as it connects in a historical context.. Separate from MA class, i host a Taiji Club where i tailor the study of Taiji from the Taoist perspective, i also welcome contributions of other "philosophies".. i tend to reject formal religions as unnecessary rituals that distract us from the experience they claim to be seeking, including "Religious Taoism".. Religious Taoism is contrary to its own philosophy, but.. that's another story..

    I have found that some of the principles of Internal Arts conflict with some people's religious or philosophical or scientific beliefs.. and i respect their beliefs by counseling them to simply accept the lessons in whatever context they are comfortable with.. i have always been able to neutralize any religious conflicts.. In the Muay Thai Class where the uniform requires shorts, some religions forbid the exposure of the legs, so we let the student put shorts on over long pants.. situation neutralized..

    The choice is simple, do you want to be a preacher or a Martial Arts instructor.. if you choose to expect students to adhere to your particular belief system, it should be stated up front and the corresponding loss of revenue accepted as a consequence of that choice..

    Just my own perspective of things.. Be well..
    TaiChiBob.. "the teacher that is not also a student is neither"

  2. #17
    All excellent replies,
    The reason I asked is that one of my former students opened a school and although she is jewish she is using a buddhist temple for backing. She has a life size statue in the front window and from the outside it looks more like a place of worship than a place to train. This puzzels me and I am trying to understand her intentions and motive. So I thought I would bring this up to the many knowledgable friends I have on this forum.

    I am still under the impression she is using religion to market her school to make up for the incompleteness of her training. She had only trained with me a short time and never ranked and higher than middle road beginner, then went on to learn a little here and a little there. She weighs 112 lbs and teaches wrestling to male adults but does not get on the mat?????????????

    hhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmm
    KUNG FU USA
    www.eightstepkungfu.com
    Teaching traditional Ba Bu Tang Lang (Eight Step Praying Mantis)
    Jin Gon Tzu Li Gung (Medical) Qigong
    Wu style Taiji Chuan



    Teacher always told his students, "You need to have Wude, patient, tolerance, humble, ..." When he died, his last words to his students was, "Remember that the true meaning of TCMA is fierce, poison, and kill."

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    minneapolis, mn
    Posts
    8,864
    Do you think it's OK to make students practice or least observe Buddhism in order to study at a particular school?
    No, it's not necessary. I understand the buddhist ties most CMA have but it's not necessary to learn to fight. On the other hand, students usually have a choice of schools to go to, and if not, it suck sbut you don't have to go to a school taht's going to make you study a religion of any sort.
    _______________
    I'd tell you to go to hell, but I work there and don't want to see you everyday.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    koko
    Posts
    2,723
    Originally posted by SPJ


    If you practice Daoism (Wu Dang) and Shaolin Zen Buhhdism, you need to study MA so as to complete or help your spiritual learning.


  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Canada!
    Posts
    23,110
    no
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Austin TX
    Posts
    6,440
    Originally posted by EarthDragon
    All excellent replies,
    The reason I asked is that one of my former students opened a school and although she is jewish she is using a buddhist temple for backing. She has a life size statue in the front window and from the outside it looks more like a place of worship than a place to train. This puzzels me and I am trying to understand her intentions and motive. So I thought I would bring this up to the many knowledgable friends I have on this forum.

    I am still under the impression she is using religion to market her school to make up for the incompleteness of her training. She had only trained with me a short time and never ranked and higher than middle road beginner, then went on to learn a little here and a little there. She weighs 112 lbs and teaches wrestling to male adults but does not get on the mat?????????????

    hhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmm
    Sounds great!

    (hangs head, cries)
    All my fight strategy is based on deliberately injuring my opponents. -
    Crippled Avenger

    "It is the same in all wars; the soldiers do the fighting, the journalists do the shouting, and no true patriot ever get near a front-line trench, except on the briefest of propoganda visits...Perhaps when the next great war comes we may see that sight unprecendented in all history, a jingo with a bullet-hole in him."

    First you get good, then you get fast, then you get good and fast.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Canada!
    Posts
    23,110
    ED-

    It is called "co-opting" and this is practiced by ignorant dirtbags on a daily basis.

    If I was a buddhist, which I'm not because I refuse to subscribe to any particular group other than "human being" I would be deeply offended by your friends attempts to use imagery sacred to one groupd to make money and sell a service.

    that's just my opinion, along with the opinion that your friend is a di.ck

    cheers
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Orlando, Florida
    Posts
    1,994

    Kung Lek

    Greetings..

    I would be deeply offended by your friends attempts to use imagery sacred to one group
    is it possible that the "imagery" of...
    ignorant dirtbags
    ..might be offensive to others.. ? Perhaps, someone can be ignorant without being a "dirtbag"..

    How is it that we can complain of offensive imagery on one hand.. and use offensive language on the other?
    your friend is a di.ck
    ...

    Just an observation of the normal inconsistency in certain thought processes.. not intended to start flaming..

    Be well....
    TaiChiBob.. "the teacher that is not also a student is neither"

  9. #24
    Responding the

    You are right, religious Daoism and Buddhism do not require MA learning.

    I was refering to the old days. The Daoists on Wu Dang Shan and the monks in Shaolin temple, they studied MA. Again not every body was required. In fact, if your mindset or heart is not ready, you are forbidden to study MA. Even if you did learn and later you did something wrong, The Discipline Yuan (Jie Liu Yuan) will punish you with hard labor and staff hitting, to the point of to "destroy" your Wushu and kicking you out of the temple.

    Taichibob: good post.

    The separation of state and the church.

    However, the teacher has some responsiblity of the moral understanding of the students. although not enforcing a religion, it would be nice to have a certain code of ethics (Wu De).

    I like the idea of declaring the religion of the teacher on the walls.

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Canada!
    Posts
    23,110
    lol @ bob

    I'm me and I'm not the one putting buddha in teh window to sell buddha cookies and BS.

    For me, I can only walk the world and kick away at what bugs me with no remorse for my actions. Remorse is hindsight afterall, if you didn't mean to do it, then you wouldn't have done it in teh first place.

    Circular logic is bullsh.it, I avoid it in matters that have meaning.

    cheers
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    minneapolis, mn
    Posts
    8,864
    Circular logic is bullsh.it, I avoid it in matters that have meaning.
    you mean you avoid logic, all together KL, be honest.
    _______________
    I'd tell you to go to hell, but I work there and don't want to see you everyday.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Canada!
    Posts
    23,110
    red5, you avoid reality.

    yer @ss is starting to look like a belgian waffle dude. better get one of those feral hillbilly kids to pry you out of that hammock soon. lord knows you might squish yer two-four of twinkies if ya gotta do it yerself. hyuk yuk.

    I love how you enter any thread i'm in to fling some more of your particular brand of nonsense.

    I feel like I have a fan... who enjoys being beaten.

    I'm honoured stoopid san.

    Kung Fu is good for you.

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    minneapolis, mn
    Posts
    8,864
    actually, if you'll notice (it goes back to that whole paying attention thing again) I posted in this thread before you, so wouldn't that be you following me around?
    And just because you don't pay attention and apparently need a reminder, I have vowed to fight your special kind of stupidity, remember? My holy war against the dumb that is Kung Lek.
    _______________
    I'd tell you to go to hell, but I work there and don't want to see you everyday.

  14. #29
    Kung Lek,
    I never said "my friend" actually it is an old student who quit 8 step after just 9 months, studied some where else for 9 more , then opened thier own school.
    Also he is a she and when I heard that she was teaching 8 step without my permission I told her to not advertise 8 step because she wasnt qualified to teach, so she changed and advertised 7* without having learned 7* mind you , so NO she is not a friend but rather a throrn in my side, and becuse of her lack of knowledge, I feel she is compensating with buddhism to come across as tradtional. I even read a post from her student that quoted her as "very tradtional" which to me seems extremly far from the truth
    KUNG FU USA
    www.eightstepkungfu.com
    Teaching traditional Ba Bu Tang Lang (Eight Step Praying Mantis)
    Jin Gon Tzu Li Gung (Medical) Qigong
    Wu style Taiji Chuan



    Teacher always told his students, "You need to have Wude, patient, tolerance, humble, ..." When he died, his last words to his students was, "Remember that the true meaning of TCMA is fierce, poison, and kill."

  15. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    koko
    Posts
    2,723
    Originally posted by Kung Lek
    I refuse to subscribe to any particular group other than "human being"
    Don't flatter yourself.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •