Yip Man's Newphew

[Liddel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_-U4...eature=related same 5hit

Yep, on the same page E.

This is why i was trying to be fair, stating they didnt show great VT - but they could trade when i visited. Again sparring/fighting looked way different to thier training.

Its something ill never understand. Peeps want to be under the label of VT but dont really use it in fighting that much, if at all.

To clarify, i was just sharing my experience. My intention was not to say this is common of Lo Man Kam Kung Fu.

I think the stats show that the guys who really dedicate themselves to MT are better fighters. They are also tough as nails.

For the most part in my country sure, but there is that small percentage that are just wannabe's. A MT guy i sparred with who said he had 3 years training kicked me. I used Far querk from my CK to block and when he connected he folded over a little in pain... and im not that hard at all compared to most MT guys LOL.

DREW

[Buddha_Fist]

Heres some vids of thier style for your own analysis...
I touched hands with both asian guys (good people) in each Vid. One is the Sifu and the other is one of his head students....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85sGwakiDcQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptxaEdDTMcM

Thoughts ?

DREW

I would place each of these guys in a corner of my living room and use them for ventilation instead of my A/C...

Come on...

[Nick Forrer]

You mean there are people that suck as fighters that study MMA, Boxing and MT too You'd never know that, the way some compare the arts

Maybe, just maybe it has something to do with regards to the individuals needs and wants or motivation??? Things that make you go HMMMMM....

James

I challenge anyone to train in this environment and not get good at fighting. Compare this to the average WC school.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6PNtUPO0RGs

[Phil Redmond]

Hi Nick, you are correct, but you can train WC for full contact. When I was trained by Yoel Judah I was studying WC. I simply transposed the horizontal fist to the vertical fist. I did my best to use two arms at the same time. I tried to stay within WC principles. I won my first amatuer fight against a guy who had turned pro but entered an amatuer competition using WC principles.

We train our guys to use WC principles in full contact as well. Here's a clip of the first day of training. It eventually got more intense. The guys were doing paks sao, lop da, bong lop, front kicks, knees, entries, takedowns, etc., thousands of times daily.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=pyQH4M550M0

[sihing]

I challenge anyone to train in this environment and not get good at fighting. Compare this to the average WC school.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6PNtUPO0RGs

I totally agree Nick, you can't help but become a better fighter by training there, but why would I want to compare a gym that trains professional fighters with one that doesn't? Is that really fair when the intent behind both gyms may be different?

James

[taiwan8me]

I am learning fast about this forum, interesting place and the discussions provoke a lot of thought. As for Master Lo's training. Let me clarify a little bit about the military training in Taiwan.

Master Lo was and is directly involved in training the special forces in Taiwan as well as the SP forces in various countries such as the US and france.
He has been involved in the practical application of WC for most of his life and through trial and error has made great strides. Walking into house is just incredible, him and Master Yip Man, Navy Seals classes from the US so many accomplishments..
Master Lo never worried about making money, but about perfecting his art. I saw some of the videos posted and they don't do it justice.

As you all know, WC is only as good as the student who is applying it.

There are some students here in the school who are just incredible...

[taiwan8me]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAQzfA1gmxQ

A video says more than a 1000 words.

This video doesn't do him justice, the students in this video look like beginners and it might be a visiting group of students. I say this because we have a lot of visiting students from other country who train in the day time. The hard core local bunch, taiwanese and foreigners train at night on his roof top in 10C to 40C heat. I personally try to get in 12 hours of training per week.

Wingchun4ever lol, I love it!!!!

WC is only as good as the natural ability of the student lol

[monji112000]

This video doesn't do him justice, the students in this video look like beginners and it might be a visiting group of students. I say this because we have a lot of visiting students from other country who train in the day time. The hard core local bunch, taiwanese and foreigners train at night on his roof top in 10C to 40C heat. I personally try to get in 12 hours of training per week.

Wingchun4ever lol, I love it!!!!

WC is only as good as the natural ability of the student lol

Ofcourse it doesn't. Sifu Lo is a very good teacher and a amazing WC player. You can't judge much by clips on the internet. The only thing you use to judge personal experience and his fighting experience.

[RGVWingChun]

From what I understand, Lo Man Kam did not finish the system under Ip Man. That's what I have been told my close members of the Ip Family

[stonecrusher69]

From what I understand, Lo Man Kam did not finish the system under Ip Man. That's what I have been told my close members of the Ip Family

just my two cents but really who can say they have completed the system. What does that really mean. I've been doing WC for 25 years I'm still learning.Can you ever reach the top and know everything and do all.

[aelward]

I still stand by my call. The student of Sifu Lo's i touched hands with didnt show great VT skill, but he was a good fighter

Heres some vids of thier style for your own analysis...
I touched hands with both asian guys (good people) in each Vid. One is the Sifu and the other is one of his head students....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85sGwakiDcQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptxaEdDTMcM

Thoughts ?

DREW

That is Bruce Cheng. He is Sifu Lo's first student (well, Chien Yen in Japan says HE is the first, but we all called Bruce "Da-Shi-Xiong"). He had a background in Western boxing and judo before learning Wing Chun.

These clips demonstrate mostly speed; they are not particularly representative of what I experienced at Sifu Lo's school in the 1990s. That could come from several possibilities:

1. From what I've been told, Sifu Lo has changed the way he teaches since he started his first class in 1974.

2. There are a lot of individual differences among students in his school. There are some people who are fast, there are some people who go around defenses, some people who go through defenses.

3. Bruce might emphasize speed in his class.

Bruce would bring his NZ students to compete in Taiwan's Full-Contact San-Da tournaments. While there, they would come to Sifu's school to train, and a lot of them looked like the posted youtube clips. But Bruce was different-- he could overpower, out-pace, or out-control his chi sao partners, depending on his mood. He could effortlessly integrate joint locks and throws. From my subjective point of view (that is, the frame of reference which my Sifu taught us to look at Wing Chun, so their is obvious bias), he's one of the best Wing Chun people (both in technical finesse and practical application) I've seen out of the thousands of hands I've touched from a couple dozen Wing Chun lineages.

[aelward]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAQzfA1gmxQ

A video says more than a 1000 words.

While I'm certainly no authority on Sifu Lo Man Kam's interpretation of Wing Chun, I'd like to put my 2 cents in:

I've never seen this National Geographic segment... That's a pretty old video, I'm would hazard to guess from the mid-to-late 1980s from the age of Richard Doell (the bare-chested guy at 1:33)

From 1:02 to 1:20 are "pre-chi sao" drills-- just basic motions. It's not the way they would be executed in "free chi sao."

From 1:22 - 1:33, I would say that is pretty sloppy chi sao compared to what one would normally see class when I was training in the 1990s. But then, there were always some inner-class rivalries where one person would do anything to get a hit in.

1:33 is "guided chi sao," with Richard "feeding" the beginning student (from her level, I'd guess she's been learning it for 3-4 months) so they can practice fluid transitions in hopes that they won't look like the guys in 1:22-1:33 :P

1:49, the guys would probably have been doing it for a year or so.

At 2:29: This guy is senior. I actually never learned his name. The foreigners always called him "tea man" because he spent a lot of time in Sifu's condo beneath the school drinking tea.

[aelward]

Not taking away from Lo Man Kam's achievements but I read that Leung Sheung, Lok Yiu and Chu Shong-Tin were the first three HK students to join Si-Fu Yip Man from his time at the Ancestor's temple.

Wiki says that Chu Shong-Tin is still with us and hopefully for many many more years.

Cheers,
Chris

While I personally don't really think it matters WHO learned first or third or twenty-third, I'm pretty sure from talking to the HK elders that Sifu Lo started about the same time as Yip Bo-Ching, which would have been around 1950 and before Chu Shong-Tin.

Obviously, Sifu Chu is much more well-known, being in the supposed "top four" with Leung Sheung, Lok Yiu, and Wong Shun Leung. Since Sifu Wong didn't start until a few years later, I've always assumed the "top four" was based on skill and not start date. I say "top four" because there are so many articles out there with people saying they were Yip Man's top six-- always listing those four, but never mentioning who #5 would be :P

I don't know how true this story is (I heard it third-hand through Sifu John Divirgilo) that prior to Sifu Lo joining GM Yip Man's class, he called his style "Foshan Fist" because "Wing Chun" sounded too effeminate. But when Sifu Lo was looking for the class, he asked about it using the name "Wing Chun," since he knew of it from growing up in the Mulberry Gardens estate with GM Yip Man.

[aelward]

From what I understand, Lo Man Kam did not finish the system under Ip Man. That's what I have been told my close members of the Ip Family

Dude, this is at least the second time that you've mentioned this in a thread about Sifu Lo. Is it THAT important to you to spread hearsay?

There are rumors about most of Yip Man's students; but spreading them doesn't make us better Wing Chun practitioners, does it?

[RGVWingChun]

what I meant by "complete the system" was that they learned all the way up to the knives with Ip Man. To my understanding, Wong Ki Man, Ip Ching, Wong Shong Leung and one other fellow were the only one to have completed the system all the way to the knives with Ip Man. Many of the other "originals" and the "firsts" didn't finish