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Thread: Suen Sifu on Bak Hsing CLF

  1. #16
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    but Buk Sing has their right to claim the things they've developed. If no one else had developed it before, then they have the right to claim the first.

    The Lien Wan Chop Choy is Tam Sam's development, now i see it in Chan Family material. As long as that gets acknowledged by the Chan, and give full credit to Tam Sam, or any school that adopts the Lien Wan into their curriculum, we all need to give Tam Sam full credit.

    However, Chan Heung, and Jeung Hung Sing were equally as famous, and Jeung Yim was referred to as one of southern China's greatest fighters, and they deserve full credit for what they developed as well.

    We should give ALL 3 masters full credit for what CLF has become today.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  2. #17
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    well, opening sequence of ng lung choy uses side ways stance, and that was developed by chan heung wasnt it?

    erm... if I look at most stances in the forms, we generally use a side stance in most techniques some way or another. Is it not so?
    得 心 應 手

    蔡 李 佛 中 國 武 術 學 院 - ( 南 非 )

  3. #18
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    Yeah lean in a bit more than us, but we also lean in a bit. I think the key is knowing how and why you are doing what you're doing is important.

    Some people train just for the look of the form, while others will train for the realistice aspects of fighting, adding in what they would do...overriding the blueprint of the form so to speak to attain the maximum delivery.

    part of the key to leaning is not to uproot yourself while doing so.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  4. #19
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    eddie my:

    Cheung Kuen
    and
    Che Kuen

    Both start out in a side stance. However, these were created by Jeung Hung Sing. our Che kuen could be an intelligent extension of Ng Lun Choy, but i don't know.
    Last edited by hskwarrior; 03-10-2008 at 11:45 AM.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  5. #20

    side stance

    Thanks for the post Satori - very insightful!

    Eddie, it may be out of place for me to say, but I think what Suen Sifu was referring to may be that extra extension that is gained when striking with a side stance. I believe this is what Satori said in post #8. I used to learn a northern mantis style (it was over 20 years ago so I don't remember which specific style it was) but I do remember my Sifu at the time referring to the side stance as "closing the gates". So, as Satori mentioned, many styles probably use a side stance. Based on what I've learned watching all the Buck Sing/Bak Hsing videos I believe the emphasis is that extra extension (BSCLF people correct me if I'm wrong). Lacey Sifu (Vince) referred to it on one video (interview with Tat Wong?), and I believe on another video Kong Hing was correcting one of Lacey Sifu's (Dave) students where it appeared that the student was motioned to lean forward one or two inches with the Chop Choy.

    Anyway, that's my two cents (from a non-CLF practitioner).
    Regards,

  6. #21
    I still see a difference between Buck Sing CLF and other CLF (or other MA for that mather) The way that a Buck Sing man turns a full 90° to fight, the way that the power really comes sideways, the way that a charp choi BOOM! comes in like a spear...
    Its not just standing sideways in a form, its buck sing...
    I cant explain it in words any better, look at the Dave Lacey video's for good examples. If you watch closely you'll see it feels different. And dont just watch the form, its less appearent in forms.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sung29 View Post

    Eddie, it may be out of place for me to say, but I think what Suen Sifu was referring to may be that extra extension that is gained when striking with a side stance. I believe this is what Satori said in post #8. I used to learn a northern mantis style (it was over 20 years ago so I don't remember which specific style it was) but I do remember my Sifu at the time referring to the side stance as "closing the gates". So, as Satori mentioned, many styles probably use a side stance. Based on what I've learned watching all the Buck Sing/Bak Hsing videos I believe the emphasis is that extra extension (BSCLF people correct me if I'm wrong). Lacey Sifu (Vince) referred to it on one video (interview with Tat Wong?), and I believe on another video Kong Hing was correcting one of Lacey Sifu's (Dave) students where it appeared that the student was motioned to lean forward one or two inches with the Chop Choy.
    Exactly, well said Sung

    Perhaps listen a little closer to what my sifu says, we don't fight sideways at all (necessarily that is) we extend sideways to a full 180 degrees to strike at the moment of attack/impact to create extra reach and momentum. regardless of the direction or angle of our stance. yes we have side ways square horse chop as well, but again our is a little different. You can see exactly this in the video of Sifu Vince Lacey that Sung 29 referred to and again in the CLFBSG video 6 when Sifu Nick demonstrates his leen whan double right handed chop into a fully extended left chop, watch the way he turns to a full 180 degrees and his shoulders line up.

    Eddie,
    yo man, no worries. I am (for the most part) a very peacable dude, to be honest I even hope we get a chance to hang out some day, I love all kinds of CLF, & training with its practioners. I requested the vid, because a) with due respect I think your wrong and wanted to see what it is you meant. descriptions via the key board mean little to me &
    b) I was sorta hoping you were right, if that way of moving was a part of your repertoire I would more than happy but pleasanlty surprised
    Who knows, maybe we get to workout or compete sanda together some day. But unity and sameness are not the same thing, not sure why everyone is so fixated on trying to tell us we are exactly the same. We aren't as Sifu Nick pointed out directly on a thread several months back on behalf of his Sifu.
    Last edited by Satori Science; 03-10-2008 at 03:40 PM. Reason: edit
    Robert James
    5th Gen. Bak Hsing Kwoon
    bakhsingkwoon@gmail.com
    http://www.youtube.com/user/SatoriScience
    "Whip the pole like the dragon whips its tail. Punches are like a tiger sticking out its head!"

  8. #23
    great vid satori

    i love jin kuen

    just a quick question

    tarm sisukjo is suen sifu's sigung right?

    then who did suen sifu learn off?

    and i honestly always thought ur sifu was robert james lol
    until this morning, i noticed ur tag haha

    who is your sifu?=)

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasincharpchui View Post
    great vid satori

    i love jin kuen

    just a quick question

    tarm sisukjo is suen sifu's sigung right?

    then who did suen sifu learn off?

    and i honestly always thought ur sifu was robert james lol
    until this morning, i noticed ur tag haha

    who is your sifu?=)
    Appreciate the love, glad you liked it & much respect!

    please excuse my poor cantonese but when you say Tam Sisukjo, you are referring to Tam Fei Pang right.

    I am Suen Sifu's disciple,

    My Sifu is Disihing of GM Lueng Lap Yau's kwoon,
    he originally trained in HK until he was 18 with his first Sifu another student of Tam Sitigung, Bosco Yang who settled in San Fran (Lacey Sibak may have known him?)
    He emigrated to Canada in 1969 and started training with my Sigung Raymond Lueng who was Tam Fei Pang's Disihing (there is a picture of Lacey Sibak and my Sigung sitting together in Calgary at Lun Jee's funeral banquet on his pantherfist website & I believe they are sitting with my Sifu's brother Raymond who he refers to on the video as a student of Tam Sing )

    Hope to meet you in China or HK @ one of BSG Banquets this coming year

    One.
    Last edited by Satori Science; 03-10-2008 at 03:39 PM.
    Robert James
    5th Gen. Bak Hsing Kwoon
    bakhsingkwoon@gmail.com
    http://www.youtube.com/user/SatoriScience
    "Whip the pole like the dragon whips its tail. Punches are like a tiger sticking out its head!"

  10. #25
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    Thank Robert

    For the sharing

    Suen Sifu is very good teacher and intelligent Men....Hope to see more from him....Giving demos and explainaition about the Bak Hsing Way...I really like this interview and learn a lot......

    Bak Hsing CLF is not Hung sing CLF....same root but different method

    Thank

    Steeve

  11. #26
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    hey guys

    Im not a CLF players....but side stance everybody used it ....Joe lewis was very good to used it....in the karate tournment....with side stance you have less opening target for the opponent.....


    In fact from what I saw in video the buk sing used more the side stance and the extended arms for punch .....the side stance or side body posture is used for used the extended arms to have the reach ....hung sing used also the side stance but not for the same goal....so many forms in hung sing difficult to know how to remember all tht stuff...and be simple , effective and direct....dont misunderstood what I say here ....just my two cents

    Does the Bak hsing (sing) have just three forms ....Sup jee ,kau da and ping kuen.....i mean the original GMTam Sam style.....?

    Steeve

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steeeve View Post
    hey guys

    Im not a CLF players....but side stance everybody used it ....Joe lewis was very good to used it....in the karate tournment....with side stance you have less opening target for the opponent.....


    In fact from what I saw in video the buk sing used more the side stance and the extended arms for punch .....the side stance or side body posture is used for used the extended arms to have the reach ....hung sing used also the side stance but not for the same goal....so many forms in hung sing difficult to know how to remember all tht stuff...and be simple , effective and direct....dont misunderstood what I say here ....just my two cents

    Does the Bak hsing (sing) have just three forms ....Sup jee ,kau da and ping kuen.....i mean the original GMTam Sam style.....?

    Steeve
    Steeeve,
    I think the Buk Sing folks are trying to say that they understand that many people do sideways fighting, but that their lineage does it a certain way which makes it different and very effective as opposed to similar ways of doing this. I wouldn't say they are the only ones who fight sideways, but to accent earlier points, they are the only ones who do it the way they've explained.

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  13. #28
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    Its not like we all want to be the same, I was simply asking sonehting that Ive been wondering about for a long time. I do aggree that it seems that the BS guys lean into their strikes, but other than that, I thought the sideways thing was pretty universal. Eg, Id go to Chin lau, poon kiu and charp choy, pulling the guy into the punch.

    but i agree, maybe i should make a video and post it.

    this isnt a big deal anyways, and i wasnt trying to take ' hard work' away from anyone. it was merely a casual conversation on something i love doing.
    得 心 應 手

    蔡 李 佛 中 國 武 術 學 院 - ( 南 非 )

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Satori Science View Post
    Appreciate the love, glad you liked it & much respect!

    please excuse my poor cantonese but when you say Tam Sisukjo, you are referring to Tam Fei Pang right.

    I am Suen Sifu's disciple,

    My Sifu is Disihing of GM Lueng Lap Yau's kwoon,
    he originally trained in HK until he was 18 with his first Sifu another student of Tam Sitigung, Bosco Yang who settled in San Fran (Lacey Sibak may have known him?)
    He emigrated to Canada in 1969 and started training with my Sigung Raymond Lueng who was Tam Fei Pang's Disihing (there is a picture of Lacey Sibak and my Sigung sitting together in Calgary at Lun Jee's funeral banquet on his pantherfist website & I believe they are sitting with my Sifu's brother Raymond who he refers to on the video as a student of Tam Sing )

    Hope to meet you in China or HK @ one of BSG Banquets this coming year

    One.
    ok

    so here is what my understanding of what that all rhat was said:

    Tarm Sarm
    |
    Tarm Fei Pang
    | |
    Bosco Yang Raymond Leung
    | |
    Henry Suen
    |
    Robert James

    is that correct?

  15. #30
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    hey, robert james is also the PG guy right?
    Ive heared some good things about him from sifu Chow. If thats the one I am thinking about.
    得 心 應 手

    蔡 李 佛 中 國 武 術 學 院 - ( 南 非 )

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