Racism & MMA

[Eddie]

I hear what you are saying Bruce, but I still think its more an issue of genetics. Kenyan runners aren’t the only ones who train barefoot, I mean down here that’s the shoe of choice (barefoot).

I hate this whole rao over the words racism. While I know it’s a reality and I understand the issues, I just think its seriously over done these days.

Cosmo Kramer was recently in court for some racist jokes he made in a comedy act. His closing speech was pretty good. I’ll try find it and post it here.

As for fighters, perhaps all that just adds to the entertainment value of the sport.

[mawali]

There is no racism in MMA! No one is prevented or forbidden from competing.

You are tough enough to fight then that is the main thing. What exists are people who bring negative racist ideology and spit them to the greater audience by written and other vehicle and this comes when major networks are planning to add MMA events to their programming.

The fighter either covers the 'offensive' material or does not participate!
The choices are clear if you want to reach the heights you want to achieve.
If one's ideology is more important then don't participate and go out and preach it.
If you are tough enough, cover up, and win to show superiority, then more power and supposedly more converts! If you end up losing by a big beatdown, then all the talk is cheap. Just another blowhard empty vessel!

What kind of supremacist is surname Costa! It takes all kinds.

[BruceSteveRoy]

What kind of supremacist is surname Costa! It takes all kinds.

lol that was one of the first things i noticed but i let it slide.

so here is the crux of the issue. can he be let go as a fighter from the organization for being racist and displaying it? racism is protected by the constitution as long as the racism does not turn to discrimination. but in essence couldn't a case then be made against the employer for discrimination against the racist if they don't let him stay on? if his right to be a racist protected and he gets fired than my guess is he would never have to fight again. after he sues the company and wins a large settlement he should be pretty set financially.

[Eddie]

Doesn’t your constitution allow for free speech, freedom of religion and freedom of association?

In the same breath, they should then tell other fighters to cover up their religious tattoos cause it might be offensive to non religious people.

I don’t think so. Perhaps you guys should chill a little.

[sanjuro_ronin]

The very nature of free speech is defending the views that you couldn't disagree more with.

[BruceSteveRoy]

Doesn’t your constitution allow for free speech, freedom of religion and freedom of association?

In the same breath, they should then tell other fighters to cover up their religious tattoos cause it might be offensive to non religious people.

I don’t think so. Perhaps you guys should chill a little.

thats what i am saying. this guy is protected even if what he is expressing is reprehensible. i don't know who you are directing the chilling out to. i have no emotional response to any of this. i am just looking at it from the perspective of the legal rights of everyone involved.

but your religion argument, while somewhat pertinent, is a flawed argument. religion on some level is a choice. a person can 'choose' to be atheist or not. when you are talking about being offended by a religious tattoo it can't compare directly to being offended by a racist tattoo as no one is given a choice of race. though that is just arguing semantics and is tangential.

i think the bigger issue is what are the actual rights of the empoyer to take any action against the fighter? as far as i can see his only recourse is to intentionally stack the guy up against fighters that are "better" than him so that he walks away with a losing record and use that as a justification to no longer carry his contract. of course that could completely blow up in his face and the guy could win a lot of really important fights and become the face of the organization. or the chest in this case. That would make things much worse from a PR standpoint. but who knows.

[MightyB]

From:
WHITE IDENTITY DEVELOPMENT: A PROCESS ORIENTED MODEL FOR DESCRIBING THE RACIAL CONSCIOUSNESS OF WHITE AMERICANS
by HARDIMAN, RITA, Educat.D., University of Massachusetts Amherst, 1982, 240 pages; AAT 8210330

"The White Identity Development Model described in this study consists of five distinct stages of consciousness and four transition periods that occur between the stages. These stages are named: (1) Lack of Social Consciousness which is characterized by a lack of awareness of racial differences and racism; (2) Acceptance, marked by the acceptance of White racist beliefs and behaviors and the unconscious identification with Whiteness; (3) Resistance, characterized by the rejection of internalized racist beliefs and messages and rejection of Whiteness; (4) Redefinition, marked by the development of a new White identity that transcends racism; (5) Internalization, marked by the integration of the new White identity into all other aspects of the identity and into consciousness and behavior."

Why so many white guys tell people they are Indians.

Personally I think stories and threads like this are designed to try to make white youth be ashamed of being white- ie white guilt- and that this type of story diverts attention from a major issue and cause of racism in America - i.e. black irresponsibility.

Now let the flaming begin my apologist friends.

[bakxierboxer]

Personally I think stories and threads like this are designed to try to make white youth be ashamed of being white- ie white guilt- and that this type of story diverts attention from a major issue and cause of racism in America - i.e. black irresponsibility.

Now let the flaming begin my apologist friends.

Heh!
I think you just smacked that snail on it's head.
(lots messier than just smacking a nail....)

[SoCo KungFu]

Started looking stuff up after reading this thread. Found this...

http://law.jrank.org/pages/12639/Bra...rg-v-Ohio.html

....thought it was interesting. Usually this legal stuff just gives me headaches though.

I guess what its saying is that for speech to be barred it would have to be deemed to incite criminal action.

If that's the case it'd be hard to say that a tattoo on one man is the cause of a bunch of retards going rampage outside a MMA event.

But promoters are free to sign whoever they want to a fight. Heck...Basketball players can be suspended for wearing shoes that aren't with team uniform. If they decided that they didn't want this guy fighting in their events anymore they don't have to have him. They aren't violating his free speech by dropping him because of his tattoos. Nor would they be if they made him cover them up or tell him to have them removed or he can't fight. Its their decision to promote whatever image they choose for their company. If he is still fighting, then its because they feel that the controversy he causes will bring in more profit than what they will lose from those that care not to see it.

Granted the military has its own set of laws in addition to civilian...but if I walked in with a swastika on any visible part of my body, I could get discharged. I find it hard to believe there would be too many of employers of any line that would tolerate such a thing.

[MightyB]

Granted the military has its own set of laws in addition to civilian...but if I walked in with a swastika on any visible part of my body, I could get discharged. I find it hard to believe there would be too many of employers of any line that would tolerate such a thing.

What if he is a Buddhist or an American Indian?

Free speech is for all. I'd like to see a lawyer take on the military with this issue.

oh yeah- for the uninformed who have questions about my thread: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/art...lp_blacks.html

[Lucas]

Would this even be an issue if it was "native pride" or "black power" ?

From the standing the guy explained he is working from, its not any different than having pride in your race, regardless of what race you are calling from.

He could be lying, but didnt he basically state his standing is not different than a chinese man or a japanese man. that being pride in his nationality and not wanting to mix with other ethnicities.

Why is it only a problem for white people to be proud of their heritage and to want to keep it the way it is?

I know plenty of viet, japanese, chinese, black, hispanic that just dont want to breed outside of their ethnicity.

Are they all hating race mongers?

I myself hail from a very mixed background, so I dont care because I cant be racist or I would have to hate myself. I have too much conflicting blood in myself.

Part of the reason I never understood this kind of crap.

BUT, from the way the fighter self describes his beliefes, it doesnt sound like racial hatred, but rather racial pride. Thats not to say he isnt a big lier, he may be, but if you take what he says in his interview, its not the same thing as racial hatred.

Its not his fault if nazi's and skinheads latch onto his image. He is there to fight.

[SoCo KungFu]

What if he is a Buddhist or an American Indian?

Free speech is for all. I'd like to see a lawyer take on the military with this issue.

oh yeah- for the uninformed who have questions about my thread: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/art...lp_blacks.html

Don't matter. Its detrimental to unit cohesiveness and thus mission success. Like I said the military has its own set of laws too. I would imagine a civilian attorney would have a hard time in a military court proceeding. If that one bothers you I guess I shouldn't tell you its also a violation to attend a rally in uniform or to talk $h!t about Pres. Bush at work.

But the issue is that they (King of the Cage) can promote or reject whatever image they feel. If they were worried about the image he presents then they would have removed him already.

Though I do think a lot of people misuderstand the whole free speech thing. You are free to speak so long as that does not violate another's right to liberty or happiness.

Is he doing that via his tattoos? As much of a douche as I think he is I don't think he really is. We can always turn off the tv. Or leave an event. I'm willing to bet there's more than one fighter that would be more than happy to tear him a new ********.

Now if I knew he was billed for a fight event in my town, would I go watch? Probably not. I'm not going to give my money to a company that promotes an image I disagree with. That is the issue that KotC has to deal with really. And I guess they've decided controversy is good for profit. Oh well....I can still go watch UFC pay-per-views for free at Buffalo Wild Wings or H o o t e r s

[Eddie]

i don't know who you are directing the chilling out to. i have no emotional response to any of this.

no no, not to you, just in general. I mean people (who calls racism for everything) in general.

I dont agree that he has a right to offend anyone with his tattoos either, but I'm just saying he has the right to freedom of speech.

We can get so pitty with this. He has the right of association and free speech, but I also have the same rights for him not to impose or offend my religious views etc.... aaaarrrgghhhh... this is sounding so typical south african

point is, lets concern ourselves with his actual fighting ability instead of his personal views on things.

Costa is Greek isnt it?

[Lucas]

Costa is Greek isnt it?

Definition: Meaning "coast" or "riverbank," this surname denoted a person who lived by a river or the sea.

Surname Origin: Italian, Spanish, Portugese

Alternate Surname Spellings: DA COSTA, DI COSTA, DE COSTA

[BruceSteveRoy]

Costa is Greek isnt it?

Costas is Greek.