rare hfy clip

[Phil Redmond]

I think you are still missing the whole point. The invite was to the 'beginner' because of the misunderstanding that happened previously - to show good will. Now you turn it into you feeling left out because you didn't get your own private invite to some see HFY for yourself. What a joke.
Why do you feel, because you are a close student of anybody, that you deserve some special treatment or invite from HFY? You want to see something, get off your but and go see it! Instead you complain that you still are waiting for your own special invite Do you really believe that is how things go. Keep waiting for your invite... it's in the mail

This makes me think of a good point Savi made. " I give you a slice of cake, and you complain because you want the whole d@mn cake." Nothing seems to ever be good enough for some people. People from HFY come and share a good amount of info on this forum and others, and then people demand the whole system be explained on a forum. Phil feels he's entitled to a private invite from HFY all because he's a senior guy in a different WC and one was offered to his 'beginner' student. It seems that for some here (and elsewhere I'm sure), nothing will ever be good enough. Oh well, get over it is what I say.

IMO, Unless you are willing to do more than log into a forum from time to time, either get off your butt if you want to see more, or be happpy with what you can get off the internet and stop all the whining - HFY doesn't owe anybody anything!

It's obvious where the whining is coming from. I can say one thing for sure. Savi has you beat at diplomacy. At least he knows how grown men should discuss things.

[JPinAZ]

Phil,

I'm not Savi, nor am I competing with him. People handle things differently. I only came on here after you complained about not getting your HFY invite after your beginner did. Now it seems you want to resort to somwehat ofr a personal attack and skip the issue. Is that how 'grown men' discuss things?

You still never answered. Since it was you that brought it up, why is it that you feel you are entitled this honor from HFY regarding a personal invite? And why not take matt's advice and just go see it for yourself?

[Phil Redmond]

Phil,

I'm not Savi, nor am I competing with him. People handle things differently. I only came on here after you complained about not getting your HFY invite after your beginner did. Now it seems you want to resort to somwehat ofr a personal attack and skip the issue. Is that how 'grown men' discuss things?

You still never answered. Since it was you that brought it up, why is it that you feel you are entitled this honor from HFY regarding a personal invite? And why not take matt's advice and just go see it for yourself?

Because of the ongoing discussion about similarities between HFY and TWC.
A beginner wouldn't have the expertise to make a comparison. Also two men can disagree and still be civil. I don't say anything online that I won't say to a man's face. I don't resort to name calling, insults, or grade school rants. Now I hope you don't twist this into a personal attack.

[brazilusa]

Hello, I make it to Brazil when I can. I went to school there in college. When i go I will definitely check them out and report back. I just sent an email out to my aunt and she may find out a little more. I used to go to a 5 animal school in Brazil and honestly I haven't seen them do anything good as far as news coverage down there on martial arts unless its BJJ, luta livre or capoeira-aka Brazilian. Although I think there was a Tien Shan Pai video out there that is good. Shows many of the forms.

Anyone out there in Michigan?

[Liddel]

Phil,
it seems you want to resort to somwehat of a personal attack and skip the issue.

From where im sitting Phils not attacking anyone.... besides which,

Mate are you a Martial artist ? harden the phuck up.

Its a real shame these HFY threads go to the dogs.

When i think about the fact were all learning a fighting art it makes one realise that this forum bs is akin to having a cry when someone calls you a name LOL.

Chuck lost badly to Rampage but is he having a cry...

http://nz.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqmgJIJM98


DREW

[JPinAZ]

Because of the ongoing discussion about similarities between HFY and TWC A beginner wouldn't have the expertise to make a comparison.

hmm.. I thought whatever 'ongoing' discussion about any comparisons you think is still going on died the same time that thread did - and that was quite some time ago. The only reason it might be ongoing is because you are bringing it up again.

But, FWIW, I think neither HFY nor TWC needs anyone to come scruitinize and make comparisons. As I see it, this is out of place in kung fu cutlure. Would you think it's correct to walk into, say, a praying mantis school and expect to compare your system with thiers? They would most likely laugh.
There's a difference between coming to learn and coming to compare. And I think one approach would be met with a more open attitude over the other. I am sure you know this.

Also two men can disagree and still be civil.

Agreed

I don't say anything online that I won't say to a man's face. I don't resort to name calling, insults, or grade school rants. Now I hope you don't twist this into a personal attack.

Well, that's good to know. I wouldn't expect anything less, and feel the same way. Maybe you are trying to imply something here? probably not since you don't seem like the type that would beat around the bush and are straight up about how you feel.

[Ultimatewingchun]

"Due to popular demand .... we plan to make legitimate HFY videos direct from our HQ in SF under the guidence of our GM. But until then, don't expect to see any video's from our members." (duende - from post#17 on this thread)


***SO when can we expect to see these videos from HQ in SF up for sale?

[osprey3883]

Hello,
My understanding is that the videos will be clips of HFY. I don't think we will ever see HFY videos for sale from HQ.
Just my 2 cents,
Matt

[Ultimatewingchun]

So when will the video clips be up?

[KPM]

Hello,
My understanding is that the videos will be clips of HFY. I don't think we will ever see HFY videos for sale from HQ.
Just my 2 cents,
Matt

And why is that?

[osprey3883]

And why is that?

Keith,
Looking at your website it mentions you are a Doctor, so I know you are a smart person. Why is it then that here at KFO you come across more like a gossip or someone trying to stir the pot? Are you really asking why HFY will not be documenting and offering for sale our system after all the previous threads here at KFO? If so I would say from here you come across as having 100% book smarts but 0 street smarts.

Matt

[KPM]

Keith,
Looking at your website it mentions you are a Doctor, so I know you are a smart person. Why is it then that here at KFO you come across more like a gossip or someone trying to stir the pot? Are you really asking why HFY will not be documenting and offering for sale our system after all the previous threads here at KFO? If so I would say from here you come across as having 100% book smarts but 0 street smarts.

Matt

Thanks for checking out my website. I asked the question because I wanted to hear the justification. You are correct. After all that I have read here I would be very surprised to see HFY instructional videos hit the market. But, then again, there was the book! So who can really say? But really....why should HFY be hesitant to offer videos? Why be afraid to show your stuff? It seems odd that the HFY family seems interested in spreading on an international scale, yet they hesitate to actually show people what their system is like.

The only "pot" I stir here on KFO is the one that tries to get the HFY guys to actually open up and share something substantial.....to be willing to actually engage in an open conversation without hiding things behind technical jargon, telling us we haven't "earned" that information, or shrugging us off with "you need to visit a HFY school." I mean no ill will towards the HFY family.

If you care to go back and read prior posts of mine you will see that I had the same attitude with Hendrik Santos some time back for the same reasons. He would come here and ask about other people's Wing Chun, but when questioned about his own Cho family Wing Chun he was not willing to share any real information.

My attitude is this....if you are going to frequent a Wing Chun discussion forum, you darn well better be prepared to discuss your Wing Chun! If you aren't willing to share on equal footing with the rest of the people here, then you haven't "earned" the right to talk to us! Maybe I'm in a small minority that sees it that way. But I still have the right to express that opinion.

[Ultimatewingchun]

"My attitude is this....if you are going to frequent a Wing Chun discussion forum, you darn well better be prepared to discuss your Wing Chun! If you aren't willing to share on equal footing with the rest of the people here, then you haven't 'earned' the right to talk to us! Maybe I'm in a small minority that sees it that way. But I still have the right to express that opinion." (KPM)


***Actually, Keith...I think you're in the majority.

[Savi]

In my opinion, it comes down to one thing, and that is there is so much in the HFY system that is simply not in many other Wing Chun systems which cannot be discussed in depth without direct experience. Yes, there is a great deal of technical “jargon” that not too many people are familiar with, but much of the jargon is actually HFY hou kuit. The specific terminologies that are unique to HFY are difficult to communicate without having directly gone through the teachings. This is true for any teachings of Wing Chun. Experience is a requirement. Yet, when trying to discuss things HFY related, we generally get accused of four things:

1. “Your talk is all marketing, and it’s just repackaged Wing Chun.”

2. “Oh, we have that too. You’re just using different words to sound different. More marketing.”

3. “Now you are just being secretive, unwilling, and afraid to share.”

4. “It is the exact same thing we do. I don’t need to believe otherwise. I don’t even need to see it. I’m sure it’s the same. What? A video? When can I buy one?”

So for most of those HFY members engaged on KFO, it becomes exceedingly difficult to have a deep conversation with non-HFY folk when there is not enough common ground to begin with, simultaneously avoiding comments like the ones above. If we stay true to HFY language, we shut everyone else out. If we water it down to simple English, it sounds like what we do is the same as others (but we don’t). Trying to maintain a balance in between is a tough thing to do without getting accused of things.

Let me tell you something. There are generations of HFY members stemming as far back as 1975 here in the US. Do you think that included in those hundreds of people who have learned HFY don’t have any alternative Wing Chun backgrounds? Do you think those people say the same four things above? To say otherwise is ultimately, indirectly or directly, a shot at the integrity of the HFY family. HFY is not a modern regurgitation of other Wing Chun. It doesn’t matter how you cut it. Common sense: NO ONE appreciates being called anything that is not true.

I’ve gone through the Ip Man system. I learned it all the way through the weaponry and to a large degree, my training and teaching involved more than 40 hours a week above my normal 40 hr daytime job. I am confident enough to say that the cumulative knowledge I have in Ip Man Ving Tsun cannot be compared to Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun because they are just too different. Even though, yes, they are both Wing Chun. The deeper you go, the more different it gets. I have learned and trained more than enough of both to know that the truth is contrary to any of the four comments I’ve listed above. I’ve sat down and watched videos of TWC published on the internet, and I know enough of Hung Fa Yi to say that it is also a different system. I know enough of Ip Man and HFY (through the kung fu, culture, and history), to say what Ip Man taught, and what GM Gee teaches, are very different systems.

So, after years of online conversations, going from the educational to the confrontational, the only option to maintain educational interests is via hands-on teaching and direct experience. That’s not marketing. That is the most practical vehicle of education. The MKF book was a promotional piece to help preserve the existence of HFY, it is not an instructional book. Even with more HFY books on the horizon, and a video in the works, neither will offer instruction on “how-to-do” HFY. This should illustrate that despite public interaction and publications, we hold to the importance that HFY must be learned hands-on.

But then Keith asked, “Why engage online at all?” Because Hung Fa Yi is still Wing Chun, and despite the many uniqueness’s of it, there are still similarities to other Wing Chun that can be discussed. Not to mention, someone like me is still interested in sharing. The HFY family has independent thinkers, despite common belief. Are conversations limited? I would say only under the circumstances presented on this forum, very little can actually be discussed.

Does HFY have some very passionate members? Of course it does. We also have our own internal struggles, just as any other family would. Then again, the HFY family comes from all walks of life. The interest of the other HFY members who wanted to discuss HFY here are long gone, in my opinion. The circumstances today still aren’t conducive to educational talks, so unfortunately you are left with a small few. And we still have to deal with those four points listed above, if not more. What else can I tell you? This forum is just another website. It’s not life. We’re all free to come and go. It has nothing to do with earning the right to talk here. I talk about Wing Chun, but Keith, your opinion ignores the history of discussions here. For me, it’s the other way around. If “you” (generally speaking) want to inquire about HFY, you’d better have some respect for HFY first, if you want to get far. Am I complaining? Hell no. Do I care? No. But don’t come up to me and tell me I have to open up to you, everything I know.

Regards,
Savi.

[LoneTiger108]

Thanks for checking out my website.

My attitude is this....if you are going to frequent a Wing Chun discussion forum, you darn well better be prepared to discuss your Wing Chun! If you aren't willing to share on equal footing with the rest of the people here, then you haven't "earned" the right to talk to us! Maybe I'm in a small minority that sees it that way. But I still have the right to express that opinion.

***Actually, Keith...I think you're in the majority.

Woah! Am I in the majority here too!??

Just really popping in here as times are busy. It seems to me that everyone argues over the past, but what about the present?

While we're on the subject of sharing, how about checking out my site!?? My gardens a bl**dy mess!!

http://www.theyumyeurngacademy.co.uk...t/present.html