How do you explain internal vs external?

[SPJ]

I know this topic has been beaten to death oh so many times.

however, if a new student comes to you and ask you the Q?

what would be your answer?

[SPJ]

I usually started with the theory of Yi, Qi and Li.

Chinese medicine and Chinese MA have this theory.

1. Yi or the will or intent;

we have to practice it by stationary posture first. to clear mind of all things.

after some time of practice. we start to practice moving slowly, focus on will and use a little or no force.

2. Qi breathing exercise

breathing exercise, meditation, and self hitting Pai Da gong. etc

there are soft and hard qi gong.

3. Li force or power

Jin practice. understanding the flow of the power/jin. how to generate, transfer, deliver/express etc.

how to receive, interact, divert/redirect etc.

internal and external are inseparable.

Yi and Qi practice are considered as internal cultivation.

Li practice is considered as external.

with the limits of our anatomy, we may produce only so much power from musculoskeletan structure.

however, internal cultivations are considered "unlimited", if we cultivate them more, they will help our external aspect.

--

I just open a big can of wurms.

[MasterKiller]

I usually started with the theory of Yi, Qi and Li.

Chinese medicine and Chinese MA have this theory.

1. Yi or the will or intent;

we have to practice it by stationary posture first. to clear mind of all things.

after some time of practice. we start to practice moving slowly, focus on will and use a little or no force.

2. Qi breathing exercise

breathing exercise, meditation, and self hitting Pai Da gong. etc

there are soft and hard qi gong.

3. Li force or power

Jin practice. understanding the flow of the power/jin. how to generate, transfer, deliver/express etc.

how to receive, interact, divert/redirect etc.

internal and external are inseparable.

Yi and Qi practice are considered as internal cultivation.

Li practice is considered as external.

with the limits of our anatomy, we may produce only so much power from musculoskeletan structure.

however, internal cultivations are considered "unlimited", if we cultivate them more, they will help our external aspect.

--

I just open a big can of wurms.

Yeah, but you just expressed the "Three Treasures," which are supposed to be inherent to all CMA systems.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

External refines the work of the muscle/structure/alignment process..

Internal adds to that the refinement and understanding/cultivation/application of bio-physical energies..

If we were speaking of autos, external would work on the bigger and better parts.. Internal would be very interested in the quality of fuel..

The best benefit is a balanced approach..

Be well..

[ChukaSifu2]

I don't know if this is what your looking for, but I simply express to my students that an External hit is nothing more than a thump or thud on the surface of your opponents body. Same when you are hit with an External hit, it is only surface contact.

Internal is when you cause damage to your opponents internal organs and such, same as when you get hit, it goes inside and can cause internal injuries.

Both of these only apply if you understand the ability to choose how to hit. Internal power(Inside) damage, External power(outside)damage,surface hits.

[ChukaSifu2]

Now for angles and power generated.

External, all muscle(crude).

Internal, Chi + Don Tien + Skeletal power.

[David Jamieson]

I don't.

It's a crap theory that shouldn't exist.

As a human, you are both and cannot escape either, ergo my statement above.

[Black Jack II]

It's a crap theory that shouldn't exist

I don't know if David is getting more middle of the road or something, but I agree more and more with some of his posts.

What the hell is happening or am I high?

[Lucas]

The way I look at it:

External = Beginner. You have just began your journey in martial arts. ALL movements begin crude, and basic. With limited knowledge of the inner workings of skeletal alignment, posture, minute coordination, etc.


Internal = Advanced student. You have been practicing long enough to have reached a point of understanding of the basics, and now are in the process of dealing with the smaller intricacies of the martial arts. Breathing, structure, power development beyond basic muscle contraction, etc...



IMO, they are inseperable, but you cannot "know" the "internal" aspects of a martial art until you have put in the time to reach a point where things become "visible" to your "eye". So to speak.

It is of my opinion that ALL highly experienced martial artists utilize internal martial arts. Otherwise, you would never get past the intermediate stages of your studies.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Internal:

Power generated by the core body through an expansion/contraction in an accordian like motion combined with open and close of the Kua. This drive the limbs which add thier power to the core's. All parts of the body move in unison to each other.

External:

Power is generated mostly by the Limbs. The core body just transfers from the lower limbs to the upper limbs, with minimal power added by the torso. There is a bit of twisting, but no expansion contraction.

Or it could be said this way,

External mostly transfers power from lower limbs to upper, but does not generate much power itself. Things move in a progressive step by step order, but not in unison.

Internal, core body generates a large percent of the power which is added to the power the limbs generate. There is a unique expansion contraction (like an accordion) NOT seen in external arts. Everything moves in unison.

[sanjuro_ronin]

External: Kick to the groin

Internal: Toe strike to the prostate

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

External is like someone chopping down a tree with a large Ax, or Chain saw.

Internal is like when a lighting bolt vaporizes the tree in a millisecond.

[David Jamieson]

it quickly falls into the muck and myre of vague anaolgy doesn't it?

lol, you know why? because it's crap!

people say "internal is like wind pushing you over and external is like a hand pushing you over" and so on. But, these are obvious differences and are simply one type of force or another. Neither is internal or external, they simply are.

the more it gets "studied" the more it becomes and even bigger crapfest than it was when it was first pondered or postulated.

Like religion! lol

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

the more it gets "studied" the more it becomes and even bigger crapfest than it was when it was first pondered or postulated.

Reply]
No, the more you study it the more it becomes clear there are distinct bio mechanical differences. It also becomes clear what those differences are.

[MasterKiller]

Internal:

Power generated by the core body through an expansion/contraction in an accordian like motion combined with open and close of the Kua. This drive the limbs which add thier power to the core's. All parts of the body move in unison to each other.

External:

Power is generated mostly by the Limbs. The core body just transfers from the lower limbs to the upper limbs, with minimal power added by the torso. There is a bit of twisting, but no expansion contraction.

Or it could be said this way,

External mostly transfers power from lower limbs to upper, but does not generate much power itself. Things move in a progressive step by step order, but not in unison.

Internal, core body generates a large percent of the power which is added to the power the limbs generate. There is a unique expansion contraction (like an accordion) NOT seen in external arts. Everything moves in unison.

Since when does External create power from the limbs?

External power is generated from the waist.