Chi Gerk

[Liddel]

I've never thought about this and appreciate your insight. I'm going to play around with the energy of this when I'm tossed around and see what comes of it.
Thanks Drew,
Kenton

This is just how ive been taught. I use the front kick mainly when in contact, like Ali has mentioned its after ive controlled (in some way) the upper body of the opponent.

Either turning them- crossing thier hands- disrupting thier balance etc
This allows you 'safe timing' to launch a straight kick at such close range.

As an example or reference - if you have Ip Mans wooden dummy book anyone can start to check out the combonations of hands and kicks in play during the form.

IME you'll find more often than not that opposite hands are used when he has a straight kick out. Of course there are exceptions to the rule so a few kicking actions within the form are using opposite hands but they are in the minority and are slightly different in application and situation based on the way i was taught.

Aside from avoiding getting crossed up with the hand and kick or just loosing force in the kick....

One can also think about structure with relation to a block and a kick.
Where is the support and how effective is it ?

If you kick with the opposite leg as say a Tan you've given to block a straight punch...your supporting leg is right under your Tan and the kick is free to issue energy supported by body movement of turning towards the punch as most do with Tan and also the knee and waist etc. The force of your turing with the Tan lends itself to the direction of force you want to give in the kick on the opposite site.

However if your kicking with the same side the Tan doesnt have as much support because the supporting leg is a further distance away from where the force is on your bridge (its not directly under)
Also you want to turn your Tan with the body but the body must remain facing foward to give the kick...the forces can contradict each other in terms of direction etc. Therefore people seem to face foward with more limited body movement whilst trying to kick at the same time... and IMO no horse no kung fu...no or little body movement = weak(er) kicks.

So the block adversely affects the kicking power IME.

It kinda makes sence...and works for me. Not all the time, nothings 100% but its worth investigating as i found it very useful.

DREW

[couch]

It kinda makes sense...and works for me. Not all the time, nothings 100% but its worth investigating as i found it very useful.

DREW

Just ran through the dummy form with this new insight and you are correct. When I'm front-facing, it's always opposite arm/leg.

If I'm off-centred, it can be the same side arm/leg (the applications I'm aware of).

Very cool. Much appreciated. I love this system.

Best,
Kenton

[k gledhill]

I'm not sure if you're implying something with your response in my use of lop sao or if you're making a general observation about people's use of it. Either way, in that regard I don't think there is a way to "misuse" it. You use it, and it will either put you in a more advantageous position, or a less advantageous position. If it's the latter, you know not to use it like that again against that opponent.

For my use of lop sao, I want to turn the opponent when I kick them to hit the side of the knee/leg and to allow me to take the outside gate. I don't typically just kick straight on at close range, as that increases the risks of being dropped while on one leg (At least while fighting people that like to try and take me down...I suppose against another wing chun guy it would be different).

it is in bil gee for a reason...?

jut sao is in slt for a reason...?

one backs up the primary idea of fighting ...whats that ?

one doesnt but is used to recover the 1st idea ..confused ?

who cares ! just grab anyting and do what you want

if you care you will use one because it is superior to the other

one teaches you to grab as last resort or because you need to recover a situation that stops you from using the hand in that time you grab.

grabbing like a lop will make you move laterally across your strike line

jut will move back and forth along the line ...so if you miss the intended grab ? % again
were will your arm go ?
If you miss with a lop sao , were will your arm go ?

You can use both, but do you know why you use one before the other ?

do you train to lop from man sao in bong/mansao drills or jut ?

if I suddenly pulled my arm away from the bong you put up as you went to grab it ...?
were would your arm end up as you missed ? why would I have the advantage over you in that split second ?

?

one perpetuates the primary 'attack as defense' idea, one is used when things go wrong...to go back to the simple idea.

one follows the idea , one breaks the ideas thinking .

nothing personal, you can do what the hell you need to do. My response is to simply make you question your/everyones use.

to improve against other fighters is our goal. using lop always will not improve your fighting ability.
it will slow you down.

[SAAMAG]

Dude...they gave me a headache.

[Liddel]

Just ran through the dummy form with this new insight and you are correct. When I'm front-facing, it's always opposite arm/leg.

If I'm off-centred, it can be the same side arm/leg (the applications I'm aware of).

Very cool. Much appreciated. I love this system.

Best,
Kenton

Thats cool bro.

DREW

[bennyvt]

im a WSL lineage student and I have learned Chi gerk. More using either to attack as defence and attack and block at the same time. I think its alot like double dan chi. Taught as a drill to fix things but unless you had to teach or were bad at it then you didnt get shown, also like rolling on the outside and partner on inside, if you had bad habits you had to do tan and bong or two fuk sao's. Can also be usefull when stepping at angles so you can't predict which side he will step