The Pole

[Liddel]

If you follow a good process from the form to Chi Kwan then to increased intensity sparring with the pole you dont need much padding....

For minimal protection i recommend a baseball catchers chest guard. Thin with good movement, you have to get the right side for you though depending on which side you hold the pole, cheaper than MA protection, at least where i live.

I got more bruises from sparring with the pole as a BJD user than i did with pole to pole training....although i did have to stop pole training and took up the BJD.

Perfecting actions like Gap Do can leave you with burns and bruises and very sore wrists LOL, no pain no gain IMO

DREW

[LoneTiger108]

Inspired by a thread about the Choy Lee Fut Pole Forms, I was wondering if anyone here has uploaded any clips of the Wing Chun Pole Form commonly known as the 6.5 Point Pole?

I've just added a clip on YouTube of an old performance of Jun Mo Wing Chun, which includes a clip of me demonstrating a version of the Jun Mo Pole

SENi 2001 - Directors Cut!
http://www.youtube.com/user/yumyeurn.../0/MH_5SS2BR-Y

I'd appreciate any constructive comments, questions and additions as I find that there are very few clips of our mysterious weaponry form out there on the world wide web.

[LoneTiger108]

Does anyone even practice a Wing Chun Pole Form here?

Maybe my name rings true, and I really am a LoneTiger!

[Phil Redmond]

Does anyone even practice a Wing Chun Pole Form here?

Maybe my name rings true, and I really am a LoneTiger!

I practice and teach the WC Dragon Pole (luhk dim bun kwan).

[Phil Redmond]

Inspired by a thread about the Choy Lee Fut Pole Forms, I was wondering if anyone here has uploaded any clips of the Wing Chun Pole Form commonly known as the 6.5 Point Pole?

I've just added a clip on YouTube of an old performance of Jun Mo Wing Chun, which includes a clip of me demonstrating a version of the Jun Mo Pole

SENi 2001 - Directors Cut!
http://www.youtube.com/user/yumyeurn.../0/MH_5SS2BR-Y

I'd appreciate any constructive comments, questions and additions as I find that there are very few clips of our mysterious weaponry form out there on the world wide web.

Your PM inbox is full so I'll ask you here. What lineage of LDBK were you doing that in that clip?

[LoneTiger108]

Your PM inbox is full so I'll ask you here. What lineage of LDBK were you doing that in that clip?

It was far from the original set I learnt as more circular (flowery if you like!) movements were added for that particular performance.

As for lineage, our form is from Lee Shing. I noticed very early on in training that it is much longer than most Ip familys LDBK, which is explained by us using 7 sets; 6 points and a half pole set. It does cover more ground and is considered one of Lee Shings specialities.

From what I understand, Lee Shing was among Ip Mans 1950's students and also taught for him on HK Island for a while. When he came to the UK he was Ip Mans European representative and close friend to Ip Chun.

I practice and teach the WC Dragon Pole (luhk dim bun kwan).

What does your form look like? Any clips online?

[Phil Redmond]

It was far from the original set I learnt as more circular (flowery if you like!) movements were added for that particular performance.

As for lineage, our form is from Lee Shing. I noticed very early on in training that it is much longer than most Ip familys LDBK, which is explained by us using 7 sets; 6 points and a half pole set. It does cover more ground and is considered one of Lee Shings specialities.

From what I understand, Lee Shing was among Ip Mans 1950's students and also taught for him on HK Island for a while. When he came to the UK he was Ip Mans European representative and close friend to Ip Chun.



What does your form look like? Any clips online?

I have my of my student Sifu Ryan Kennedy from Toronto doing the form that I'm going to put on my website soon.

[k gledhill]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dATeDTE8zUc

...The pole form... The Late GM WSL




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgT_5iOIVFA

....the pole in action.... one strike is all it takes. very accurate for such a long weapon

you can 'tag' inch size 'x' on a board over 9ft away ...

[LoneTiger108]

I have my of my student Sifu Ryan Kennedy from Toronto doing the form that I'm going to put on my website soon.

That will be good to see Phil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dATeDTE8zUc

...The pole form... The Late GM WSL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgT_5iOIVFA

....the pole in action.... one strike is all it takes. very accurate for such a long weapon

you can 'tag' inch size 'x' on a board over 9ft away ...

Great clips too Kev.

Are there any more of WSL that highlight more of the 'form', or is that what you refer to as the pole form? IMHO it does seem very incomplete.

[chusauli]

That will be good to see Phil.



Great clips too Kev.

Are there any more of WSL that highlight more of the 'form', or is that what you refer to as the pole form? IMHO it does seem very incomplete.

Spencer,

WSL's footage is the complete set. It is pretty much typical of Yip Man's teaching...perhaps because Lee Shing added so much from other systems, it seems to you it is rather incomplete, but in WCK less is more. WSL Si Bok is demonstrating all the salient points of the WCK pole...

These points come from the keywords Tai, Lan, Dim, Kit, Got, Wun, Lou.

Tsui Sheung Tien's lineage shows the same points, so it is Lee Shing who changed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJJAhq4DfGc

Further extrapolated and permutated, these movements can be expanded into over 108 moves (216 if you do it on both sides). In WCK, it is not the sequence of the form that counts, it is the application and extrapolation of the skills and the correct power and timing of the movement in spontaneous application which is of primary importance. To be attached to the forms becomes meaningless.

If you ever look at Augustine Fong's set, which he created after study with Ho Kam Ming and others, you can see a lot of this extrapolation based on the main points. In Foshan WCK (of Lun Kai), it is still the same:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GLue5dZZIk

Countless forms can be made with the core essence.

IMO, many of the movements in your sets are added for flash and violate WCK's pole principles. The flowers are not good WCK, IMO.

[k gledhill]

What Robert said... many add things for , fancy empty action, impressing the audience...

thats the form....simple.

[LoneTiger108]

Spencer,

WSL's footage is the complete set. It is pretty much typical of Yip Man's teaching...perhaps because Lee Shing added so much from other systems, it seems to you it is rather incomplete, but in WCK less is more. WSL Si Bok is demonstrating all the salient points of the WCK pole...

These points come from the keywords Tai, Lan, Dim, Kit, Got, Wun, Lou.

Tsui Sheung Tien's lineage shows the same points, so it is Lee Shing who changed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJJAhq4DfGc .

I can see your stand point here Robert, but it's clear to me from the clips what WSL, CST and the Foshan guys are doing.

As far as I'm aware Lee Shing added nothing to his pole form, it isn't his creation, it was Ip Man that may have stripped it down to teach.

What I commonly see is what is clearly represented in your clips, a 'set'. Our 1st point is almost exactly the same and we call it 'Dai Yat Dim'! Concentrating on the side body use of the pole, the longest reach, all the elements you mention are there when you break the posture down and drill each one to attack with the 1st point (as in your clips). We sometimes referred to that end-posture as 'cheurng gwun'.

... IMO, many of the movements in your sets are added for flash and violate WCK's pole principles. The flowers are not good WCK, IMO

I understand this view point too, and agree. I did mention that this form was changed for the show, and yes it looks more flowery than what Lee Shing looked like. This can be explained because I was young and inexperienced!

... In WCK, it is not the sequence of the form that counts, it is the application and extrapolation of the skills and the correct power and timing of the movement in spontaneous application which is of primary importance. To be attached to the forms becomes meaningless.

I have to disagree. The sequence from 1st to 6th point is as important as learning the sets to SLT in the correct order. They all have distinct purpose.

A main difference too is our explanation of the boon gwun (1/2 pole) but if what you see is already not what you think it should be because of your influences and learning, then you must already know everything you need to know.

Whatever I say can make no difference.

[k gledhill]

Spencer go meet Desmond..actions speak louder than You-tubes...
the way you talk about the forms shows a shallow understanding....

[LoneTiger108]

Spencer go meet Desmond..actions speak louder than You-tubes...
the way you talk about the forms shows a shallow understanding....

Thanks again Kev for the recommendation! I'm sure we will meet at some point, and he's always welcome to seek me out if he really wants to. I have nothing to prove to anyone, so I find it funny that you keep pimping out Des!

Have you no other writings or advice for people wishing to practice the pole form, or better still a clip of yourself actually doing your pole form?

This thread was meant to start a discussion, so please explain why you think my post shows a shallow understanding?

[Vajramusti]

I don't know where to begin. The pole demo that I saw on the link that you provided- I can't relate to it from a martial standpoint. The way some of the demo participants were holding their poles-
the poles can be knocked out of their hands IMO.

joy chaudhuri.