Kids and MMA

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...6&q=pankration

[mysteri]

wow, that's great to see them start so young. i think it's great for kids to have a BIT of a more realistic interface to one-on-one combat than what's being taught in most of today's black-belt mills. i really feel it's extremely important that kids learn values and some realities at a younger age and that they really early on solidify their self-confidence. too many kids are bullied, my 12 y.o. cousin got beat up a few months ago(i was furious) and this poor 15 y.o. kid killed himself in a park around here the other day. i can't stress how important i feel it is in many aspects that kids so young have such a healthy outlet that can be so useful to them in the future, more than a lot of other recreational sports.

[chud]

i really feel it's extremely important that kids learn values and some realities at a younger age and that they really early on solidify their self-confidence. too many kids are bullied, my 12 y.o. cousin got beat up a few months ago(i was furious) and this poor 15 y.o. kid killed himself in a park around here the other day. i can't stress how important i feel it is in many aspects that kids so young have such a healthy outlet that can be so useful to them in the future, more than a lot of other recreational sports.

I was gonna say this, but you said it so well I thought I'd just repost your comments.

[Anthony]

"i think it's great for kids to have a BIT of a more realistic interface to one-on-one combat "

Yeah......one on one combat for children is right up there with piano lessons . I can't wait til' my kid is 5 so I can ship him off to Iraq for some real experience.

Serioulsy though, I'm not so convinced that martial arts is for children at all. I don't think they are able to posess the morality for it and I think that there are much better ways to deal with bullies or to instill hard work and values. Just my thoughts.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

"i think it's great for kids to have a BIT of a more realistic interface to one-on-one combat "

Yeah......one on one combat for children is right up there with piano lessons . I can't wait til' my kid is 5 so I can ship him off to Iraq for some real experience.

Serioulsy though, I'm not so convinced that martial arts is for children at all. I don't think they are able to posess the morality for it and I think that there are much better ways to deal with bullies or to instill hard work and values. Just my thoughts.

on the otherside of the spectrum i think all kids should be required to do at least a little sport fighting of some type by highschool at the latest. traditional full contact, boxing, wrestling, submission, whatever.

nothing builds confidence like realizing you can take an ass kicking.

[Anthony]

I agree with you. I would start it at about 12 or 13 years of age. I would also emphasize it more as a sport than "self-defense."

Competition, loosing and winning, are both parts of life that should be learned. I would say that how you loose is more important than how you win.

I feel that a 6 year old who knows how to choke out another kid might be too dangerous because at that age they are not able to discern when not to do it or worse, when to let go. It's common sense to me, like the same reason we don't let 6 year olds carry guns. No matter how much you teach them about it, they still can't be trusted alone with it.

[Oso]

enh, we've had this discussion before but I don't agree with the contact strikes to the head for kids that small...especially w/ no head protection.

I don't think the guillotine is a good idea on little kids either.

we all recognize that full contact competition takes it's toll on the body. I think that there are probably developmental issues at risk in letting pre-pubescent kids practice and compete at full contact.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

these were my comments about this vid on another board:

just hearing about little ones doing submissions would scare me more the striking, but after watching it i guess it isnt that bad.

i'm just scared of injuries. i know that younger joints can take more abuse and be no worse for the wear, but 6 still seems a little young for sumissions. maybe 8 or 9. most of them looked a lot more controlled than i thought though.

i agree he appears to be very talented, as do the rest of them, but i also think these kids are the exception. i think most 6 year olds are a little too clumsy to be doing arm bars. they are a a bit more coordinated at 8 or so.

then again maybe he is 7 or 8. maybe little man is just short like me.

[neilhytholt]

Oh, man, that is some awesome stuff. Imagine the skill levels those kids will have 10-15 years from now.

It seems like this will bring MMA to a whole new level.

[Ray Pina]

It's great to see that these kids have real skills. I was quite the karate competitor as a little kid, but I didn't have a real sense of fighting the way these kids do.

At the same time, some of the neck locks worry me. But I guess I was just as vulnerable to getting kicked in the throat, had more thna my fair share of bloody noses, etc. So, I guess it's a good things.

PS
I don't think they allowed striking to the face. I only saw body shots with the occasional shot that looked like it was deflected towards the face.

[neilhytholt]

It's great to see that these kids have real skills. I was quite the karate competitor as a little kid, but I didn't have a real sense of fighting the way these kids do.

At the same time, some of the neck locks worry me. But I guess I was just as vulnerable to getting kicked in the throat, had more thna my fair share of bloody noses, etc. So, I guess it's a good things.

PS
I don't think they allowed striking to the face. I only saw body shots with the occasional shot that looked like it was deflected towards the face.

The thing that seems it could be a problem is the throws because they are going to the mat head first. Do that one wrong and you could have a broken neck, but of course these kids don't weigh that much and are pretty limber.

But man, this is so awesome that kids these young have real skills. I wish this was around when I was a kid and mommy would have let me do this.

[PangQuan]

I don't agree with the contact strikes to the head for kids that small...especially w/ no head protection.

i didnt see any head shots, looked like all body to me.

[Oso]

perhaps not....I looked again and still think I saw some in the first match shown and a knee in another match. maybe they are not supposed to and the refs didn't think these were close enough.

there is still a wicked as guillotine at 1:16

[Hard Fists]

i dunno. As a papa, it looks scary to me. No offense to anybody, but the parents of these kids must be a little nuts. I mean, I have no intention of letting my son go full contact, or even train to go real hard, until he is like 16--and only then if he pesters me until I break. I don't think anything good can come from an 8 or 12 year old beating someone's face in, getting their face beat in, or popin someone's shoulder...that would be messed up. IMO fighting full contact needs to be an adult decision, made by the adult that is competing.

[GeneChing]

I've heard of other MMA teen leagues starting. Six seems too young to me.

Ultimate Fights Expand to Include Kids

By MARCUS KABEL – 4 hours ago

CARTHAGE, Mo. (AP) — Ultimate fighting was once the sole domain of burly men who beat each other bloody in anything-goes brawls on pay-per-view TV.

But the sport often derided as "human ****fighting" is branching out.

The bare-knuckle fights are now attracting competitors as young as 6 whose parents treat the sport as casually as wrestling, Little League or soccer.

The changes were evident on a recent evening in southwest Missouri, where a team of several young boys and one girl grappled on gym mats in a converted garage.

Two members of the group called the "Garage Boys Fight Crew" touched their thin martial-arts gloves in a flash of sportsmanship before beginning a relentless exchange of sucker punches, body blows and swift kicks.

No blood was shed. And both competitors wore protective gear. But the bout reflected the decidedly younger face of ultimate fighting. The trend alarms medical experts and sports officials who worry that young bodies can't withstand the pounding.

Tommy Bloomer, father of two of the "Garage Boys," doesn't understand the fuss.

"We're not training them for dog fighting," said Bloomer, a 34-year-old construction contractor. "As a parent, I'd much rather have my kids here learning how to defend themselves and getting positive reinforcement than out on the streets."

Bloomer said the sport has evolved since the no-holds-barred days by adding weight classes to better match opponents and banning moves such as strikes to the back of the neck and head, groin kicking and head butting.

Missouri appears to be the only state in the nation that explicitly allows the youth fights. In many states, it is a misdemeanor for children to participate. A few states have no regulations.

Supporters of the sport acknowledge that allowing fights between kids sounds brutal at first. But they insist the competitions have plenty of safety rules.

"It looks violent until you realize this teaches discipline. One of the first rules they learn is that this is not for aggressive behavior outside (the ring)," said Larry Swinehart, a Joplin police officer and father of two boys and the lone girl in the garage group.

The sport, which is also known as mixed martial arts or cage fighting, has already spread far beyond cable television. Last month, CBS became the first of the Big Four television networks to announce a deal to broadcast primetime fights. The fights have attracted such a wide audience, they are threatening to surpass boxing as the nation's most popular pugilistic sport.

Hand-to-hand combat is also popping up on the big screen. The film "Never Back Down," described as "The Karate Kid" for the YouTube generation, has taken in almost $17 million in two weeks at the box office. Another current mixed martial arts movie, "Flash Point," an import from Hong Kong, is in limited release.

Bloomer said the fights are no more dangerous or violent than youth wrestling. He watched as his sons, 11-year-old Skyler and 8-year-old Gage, locked arms and legs and wrestled to the ground with other kids in the garage in Carthage, about 135 miles south of Kansas City.

The 11 boys and one girl on the team range from 6 to 14 years old and are trained by Rudy Lindsey, a youth wrestling coach and a professional mixed martial arts heavyweight.

"The kids learn respect and how to defend themselves. It's no more dangerous than any other sport and probably less so than some," Lindsey said.

Lindsey said the children wear protective headgear, shin guards, groin protection and martial-arts gloves. They fight quick, two-minute bouts. Rules also prohibit any elbow blows and blows to the head when an opponent is on the ground.

"If they get in trouble or get bad grades, I'll hear about it and they can't come to training," he added.

In most states, mixed martial arts is overseen by boxing commissions. In Missouri, the Office of Athletics regulates the professional fights but not the amateur events, which include the youth bouts. For amateurs, the regulation is done by sanctioning bodies that have to register with the athletics office.

The rules are different in Oklahoma, where unauthorized fights are generally a misdemeanor offense. The penalty is a maximum 30 days in jail and a fine up to $1,000.

Joe Miller, administrator of the Oklahoma Professional Boxing Commission, said youth fights are banned in his state, and he wants it to stay that way.

"There's too much potential for damage to growing joints," he said.

Miller said mixed martial arts uses a lot of arm and leg twisting to force opponents into submission. Those moves, he said, pressure joints in a way not found in sanctioned sports like youth boxing or wrestling.

But Nathan Orand, a martial arts trainer from Tulsa, Okla., said kids are capable of avoiding injuries, especially with watchful referees in the rings. He thinks the sport is bound to grow.

"I can see their point because when you say 'cage fighting,' that right there just sounds like kids shouldn't be doing it," Orand said.

"But you still have all the respect that regular martial arts teach you. And it's really the only true way for youth to be able to defend themselves."

Back in the Carthage garage, Bloomer said parents shouldn't worry about kids becoming aggressive from learning mixed martial arts. He said his older son was picked on by bullies at school repeatedly last year but never fought them, instead reporting the problem to his teachers.

And fighters including his 8-year-old son get along once a bout is over, Bloomer said.

"When they get out of the cage, they go back and play video games together. It doesn't matter who won and who lost. They're still little buddies."