Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin

[1bad65]

Yep! Obama is a lying MFer!

That's what I'm trying to tell you.

[1bad65]

"Federal prosecutors moved Monday to delay indefinitely the sentencing of convicted fundraiser Antoin "Tony" Rezko, sending their strongest hint yet that he is ready to spill his political secrets.

Speculation has simmered for weeks that the key fundraiser for Gov. Rod Blagojevich and Sen. Barack Obama was whispering what he knows about corruption in Illinois government to federal prosecutors in hopes of getting a lighter sentence."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081007/...ndraiser_trial

FYI, Rezko was the guy who helped Obama purchase his house as well.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Good for you. Enjoy Canada.

HA !
You really need to get out more if you think Canada is a welfare state.
By the way, what happened in the States with their financial insitutions can never happen here, we have rules against that.
Silly Canadians with their silly high ranked quality of life.

[SimonM]

I do believe Godwin's law has just been invoked.

Excellent, perhaps this is a sign that the death of this thread is nigh.

[MasterKiller]

McCain was cleared of any wrongdoing by a Democratic Congress.

Actually, he was admonished for using poor judgement.

McCain and Keating had become personal friends following their initial contacts in 1981,[11] and McCain was the only one of the five with close social and personal ties to Keating.[35][36] Like DeConcini, McCain considered Keating a constituent as he lived in Arizona.[28] Between 1982 and 1987, McCain had received $112,000 in political contributions from Keating and his associates.[37] In addition, McCain's wife Cindy McCain and her father Jim Hensley had invested $359,100 in a Keating shopping center in April 1986, a year before McCain met with the regulators. McCain, his family, and their baby-sitter had made nine trips at Keating's expense, sometimes aboard Keating's jet. Three of the trips were made during vacations to Keating's opulent Bahamas retreat at Cat Cay. McCain did not pay Keating (in the amount of $13,433) for some of the trips until years after they were taken, when he learned that Keating was in trouble over Lincoln.[7][38] In 1989 Phoenix New Times writer Tom Fitzpatrick opined that McCain was the "most reprehensible" of the five senators.[39]

He got slapped on the wrist because he paid Keating back AFTER the scandal started brewing and he knew he would be in trouble.

[1bad65]

Actually, he was admonished for using poor judgement.

Poor judgement and criminal activity are two different things.

Would you say Obama used 'poor judgement' in following a racist pastor for 20 years? Associating with that terrorist Ayres? Having a convicted felon help him purchase his house?

[1bad65]

MK,

What about that sig bet? Or are you not confident Obama is telling the truth?

[MasterKiller]

Poor judgement and criminal activity are two different things.

Would you say Obama used 'poor judgement' in following a racist pastor for 20 years? Associating with that terrorist Ayres? Having a convicted felon help him purchase his house?

I would say Obama used poor judgement, just as I would say Palin used poor judgement standing in front of a pastor to be blessed from witchcraft.

Regardless, poor financial judgement got us into this current mess, not poor choice of which windbag to listen to on Sundays.

MK,

What about that sig bet? Or are you not confident Obama is telling the truth?

WTF is it with you and bets? Jesus f@cking christ.

[GLW]

{snicker!}
“It's gonna take one heckuva lotta "little disenfranchisements" to offset
20 EFFIN' MILLION MORE danged votes.”

It doesn’t have to be millions.

Bush’s ‘win’ over Gore in 200 was by 537 votes. Definitely within the range of the disenfranchising margin. Given that there IS evidence that somewhere on the order of 40,000 voters were disenfranchised in Florida by Choicepoint then…and there were something like 800 of those who were felons who were convicted in Texas, served their time in Texas, got their right to vote back, AND AFTER the election were told that their disenfranchisement by the state of Florida was a mistake…and “oops, sorry, you CAN vote now” Shows that small changes in key areas can make a BIG difference.

But the real issue is “Is it EVER alright to disenfranchise a legitimate voter?” While people are not dying in this country over that, they have recently in places like South Africa…and representation was a big deal in how the US was founded. So, to accept disenfranchisement as “(snicker!)” is patently UNAMERICAN – of course, that only applies if you buy into the whole concept of the grand experiment that was the US Constitution.

“The demoncrats are much more famous for fixing elections - heck even the New York Times - mouthpiece of the Demoncratic party declared Bush the winner in 2000- after launching their own investigation.”

Actually, about a year AFTER THAT article, they did another examination and stated the opposite.

“The left just can't imagine that we don't want to be their slaves.”

SLAVES – isn’t that what disenfranchisement is all about. How about we give YOU a 1/3 vote…at least we count it that way and let your owner/keeper vote for you. After all, there IS a precedent for that. (don’t make it right)

“Now if only we can retake the right and bring some liberty back to this mess...”

Liberty is neither right or left – it just IS. Labels are funny things. They hold things in, keep things out, and they magically frame your thoughts so you can’t see other options.
Such a limited frame you have.

As to ACORN :

“Under the now-removed provision, the money going to the Housing Trust Fund would have been distributed by the Department of Housing and Urban Development in the form of block grants to states, which would then award grants to qualified applicants. Money going to the Capital Magnet Fund would have been distributed by the U.S. Treasury Department through a competitive grant application process.
Salon.com's Gabriel Winant reported that ACORN's legislative director said the organization's housing advocacy affiliate, ACORN Housing, is unlikely to seek any grants, and even if it did, it would have to go through the same application process as any other group:
Thursday night, Sen. Lindsey Graham [R-SC] told Fox News' Greta Van Susteren that 20 percent of the funds for "the retired debts" in the Democratic proposal would go to the progressive organizing group ACORN.
[...]
There's not even any reason, at least at this point, to believe that any of the money allocated to the Housing Trust Fund would end up with ACORN.
Brenda Muniz, the organization's legislative director, told Salon that Graham's claim is "just ludicrous." ACORN itself claims to take no money at all from the government. ACORN Housing, an affiliated but ostensibly autonomous nonprofit that provides free housing counseling, is considering applying for funds from the Housing Trust Fund, but will probably not choose to do so. "It's unlikely that we stand to get anything," Muniz said. Because ACORN Housing's primary area of expertise is housing counseling -- which is not what the Trust Fund's grants are for -- Muniz said that it's "unlikely that they would take on something like that."
Even if local ACORN Housing affiliates did choose to apply for money from the Housing Trust Fund, they would have to go through the grant proposal process at the state and/or local level. The fund allocates money to state and local government agencies and trust funds, which in turn grant it to housing development organizations that make it through the application process.”

“McCain was cleared of any wrongdoing by a Democratic Congress.”
Not exactly true. They stated that there was not strong enough evidence of any criminal wrongdoing to go there. They also said that at the very least, he showed poor judgement.

The S&L scandal was brought on by two things, influence pedaling with poor campaign finance laws and lack of sufficient regulation and oversight of the S&L’s since they did not have to follow the same rules as the banks. Similarly, the Enron collapse was caused by – influence pedaling, greed, lack of sufficient oversight and regulation…. And now this one, greed, influence pedaling, and lack of oversight and regulation.

Mr. McCain has since talked about campaign finance reform…and it has sort of died on the vine…the new rules hardly prevented this last round. The Sarbanes-Oxley has done little for oversight of the corporate greed…. Just more funny accounting.
So what did John take away from his S&L experience… Lip service to campaign finance reform…and a continued battle charge for deregulation and a lessening of oversight in just about all areas. Poor judgement then..and it continued…..as he learned very few lessons from the experience.

[BoulderDawg]

There isn't a man or woman that walked the earth that hasn't used poor judgement...That's how we learn.

However in Obama's case his association with Bill Ayres and Rev Wright shows sound judgement in my opinion. In fact I would be proud to call Bill Ayres my brother.

In any case I'm looking forward to tonight's debate to see if McCain has the guts to call Obama a terrorist to his face. Heck, I'll just be interested to see if he just treats Barack like a man by looking him in the eye when he shakes his hand.

[1bad65]

WTF is it with you and bets? Jesus f@cking christ.

So you don't have faith the man you are voting for is telling the truth?

[1bad65]

However in Obama's case his association with Bill Ayres and Rev Wright shows sound judgement in my opinion. In fact I would be proud to call Bill Ayres my brother.

Once again showing your character. Or lack thereof.

Are you a man of your word? You promised to tape a certain encounter. Remember this?

From what I can see all they do is partrol all day in Humvees, come back to a well guarded barracks and drink beer all night.

Speaking of saying things to people's faces; How about you say that to the next soldier you see.

I'd have absolutely zero problem in doing that.

When can we expect the tape?

[1bad65]

“McCain was cleared of any wrongdoing by a Democratic Congress.”
Not exactly true. They stated that there was not strong enough evidence of any criminal wrongdoing to go there. They also said that at the very least, he showed poor judgement.

Actually it is true. Was he convicted of any wrongdoing? Censured? Fined? Did he plead guilty?

[MasterKiller]

So you don't have faith the man you are voting for is telling the truth?

Typical republican who puts more weight on public displays of faith/patriotism than on personal action.

My vote is my declaration of faith.

[MasterKiller]

And anyone who has a problem with Obama/Ayers should also have a problem with McCain's close ties to G. Gordon Liddy.

"I'm proud of you, I'm proud of your family. It's always a pleasure for me to come on your program, Gordon, and congratulations on your continued success and adherence to the principles and philosophies that keep our nation great."--John McCain

---broke into the office of the Democratic National Committee to plant bugs and photograph documents

---proposed to kidnap anti-war activists so they couldn't disrupt the 1972 Republican National Convention

---planned the murder (never carried out) of an unfriendly newspaper columnist

---In 1994, after the disastrous federal raid on the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, he gave some advice to his listeners: "Now if the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms comes to disarm you and they are bearing arms, resist them with arms. Go for a head shot; they're going to be wearing bulletproof vests. ... Kill the sons of *****es."