thanks canada!!!

[Becca]

I guess you missed the "" around the "you"...
And my question too it seems.
I will try again, who tried to "Kill the US" because of their religion?
By the way, I think you may have mistaken me for someone who is anti-US.

I answered your question. It was not the answer you were phishing for. You asked who tried to "kill me." I pointed out that I was speeking rhetoricly about why there has been a revival in religious fundamentalism in the U.S.

As to why 9/11 happened, if the attack was only because America is imperialistic, then why does Al Quida also attack powerless christians in the middle east? Israel is not the the slightest bit imerialistic, and while they are not christian they are also ont muslim. They have to be so alert to attack, they are proactive. The Trade Center was targeted because it was high profile, had a large mix of people inside, including muslims who chose to work with "infedels", and would make a better statement to the world. The fact that our money as "in god we trust" on it put us on the list of Infedels To Be Destroyed. The fact that we are a high profile nation put us at the top.

[lkfmdc]

They targeted us for supporting Israel

They also targeted us for being Christion and not "obeying the word of G'd"

They also targeted us for having troops in Saudi Arabia, their holy land

Like any fundamentalist, they are convinced they are right because they own the true words of G'd and that anything is acceptable because they are fighting those who dare disobey the word of G'd

All fundamentalists are teh same, it isn't the religion, it's the variation

[SimonM]

IIsrael is not the the slightest bit imerialistic, .

WHAT?!?!?!??!

West Bank;
Gaza Strip;
Golan Heights;
The abject subjugation of the Palestinians...

Israel is NOT innocent.
Nor is Al Quaeda or Hamas...

[sanjuro_ronin]

Lets us first remember that TRUE Muslims view Christians and Jews as their brothers, regardless of what extremists may use as an EXCUSE.
Second, lets remember the difference between the reasons behind Islamic terroists and the excuses they make.
If we don't this problem will never go away.
Its the reason it hasn't gone away yet.

They targeted us for supporting Israel

Correct, old news too as you know.

They also targeted us for being Christion and not "obeying the word of G'd"

That's only because you are the great Satan !
LOL !!

They also targeted us for having troops in Saudi Arabia, their holy land

Correct.

Like any fundamentalist, they are convinced they are right because they own the true words of G'd and that anything is acceptable because they are fighting those who dare disobey the word of G'd

All fundamentalists are teh same, it isn't the religion, it's the variation

Correct and all fundamentalist use religion as an excuse to push their true agenda, be it Imperialistic gains, personal "hatred" ( as is the case with Osama), even governmental forgein policies ( As was the case with Roberts saying the US shoudl assasinate Chaves, an elected head of state).

[David Jamieson]

They targeted us for supporting Israel

They also targeted us for being Christion and not "obeying the word of G'd"

They also targeted us for having troops in Saudi Arabia, their holy land

Like any fundamentalist, they are convinced they are right because they own the true words of G'd and that anything is acceptable because they are fighting those who dare disobey the word of G'd

All fundamentalists are teh same, it isn't the religion, it's the variation

I think your point #3 is accurate and I am not so sure about the rest.

I would ask what would america do with a standing army of a foreign nation on it's soil, say not far from washington?

Also, there are plenty of so called fundamentalist thinkers in the west here who hold to exactly the same principles and ideals, but just on the topsy turvy side of the coin.

Why do we launch an all out offensive on a backwater place that can't actually send an army at us, take over their country, take their natural resources and build our pipelines through thier territories? Why do we do that?

We are doing it for a couple of reasons.

1. Afghansitan is a lawless wasteland and has been for almost a half a century, if we don't get in and take control, we wind up with taliban doing the same, so, lets get in there.

2. For iraq, that the worlds 3rd or 5th largest oil reserves. For America it makes economic sense to destroy it's government and infrastructure and steal the rest. It took a lot of years to orchestrate the result that we have now and it was done across a few presidencies. The set up being played and dealt by teh neo-cons since as far back as the Nixon era when Rumsfeld was first starting out as was Cheney.

3. War was not declared after the bombing of the wtc the first time.

4.war was not declared when the embassy was bombed in africa.

5.war was not declared when the uss cole was attacked

6.war was not declared when american soldiers were dragged through the streets of mogadishu.

7. war was not declared when hezbollah was launching rpgs and rockets into israel.

The entire premise and storyline is severely flawed and cannot be justified under any banner except for imperialism and expansionism.
The only question is do we in the west ave the fortitude and will to carry on with our aggressions towards these other countries, conquer them and take the spoils?

I don't know if that sits well with such a society as ours. It's a bit too roman perhaps.

It's hard to soft sell necessary actions based on the desires of a nation.

Killing must be done at times and for people who have grown up and lived their entire lives in a sheltered and insulated manner, well, they have difficulty relating to the necessity of killing, conquering and making war as an aspect of the human condition.

we have spoiled ourselves by sparing the spartan demeanour we need to keep such a huge economy and wasteful take it for granted society of consumer slaves running. lol

anyway, something to mull over...

[lkfmdc]

I think your point #3 is accurate and I am not so sure about the rest.

well, YOU may not be so sure about the rest, but most informed foreign policy experts ARE!

Again, you are dealing with people who think they represent the ultimate truth and have G'd on their side. Don't expect reason to play into it

[David Jamieson]

There has to be reason.

Let's face it, Bin Laden is a highly educated person who was recruited and trained by the CIA and formed the mujahadeen in afghanistan with the blessing and support of the US in yet one more proxy war against the russians.

he's a boogey man that gets pulled out and shown around like a puppet to scare the kids.

Canada supports Israel as well, but we don't have people bombing us. Pundits on cnn are not necessarily foreign policy experts either.

there is a lot that has been written by plenty of foreign policy experts that supports my viewpoint.

I really do think that Bin Ladens original beef had to do with the stationing of a foreign army so close to mecca. The rest of the stuff came afterwards.

It's interesting to see what's going on in Saudi Arabia right now. I wonder how much of that news mainstream america is getting. I know you must be hearing some of it... yes?

[lkfmdc]

Let's face it, Bin Laden is a highly educated person who was recruited and trained by the CIA and formed the mujahadeen in afghanistan with the blessing and support of the US in yet one more proxy war against the russians.

Wow, you really aren't informed very much on the facts are you?

Bin Laden was a "johnny come lately" to the war against Russia. He showed up very late in the conflict and his most prominent contribution was money because he was/is rich. He was not trained by the CIA nor had much relations with them

Was he highly educated? Yes. He was originally very "westernized" as was much of his family. Then he CONVERTED. He became a fundamentalist. That's the whole idea of convertion to fundamentalism, it is a change in the way you think

Cat Stephens was a dope smoking music star who slept with 2 women at a time, then he converted to extreme Islam and now he wants some guy's head cut off because he wrote a book about the prophet.

IE when you convert to a fundamentalist position, logic and reason go out the door

Canada supports Israel as well, but we don't have people bombing us.

You might want to read the news more. Canadians have been kidnapped and executed. Canadians have been targets overseas. American targets are of course "high profile" but if you think you could walk through an extremist part of a middle eastern nation just because you are Canadian you are in for a bad time

[Hebrew Hammer]

West Bank;
Gaza Strip;
Golan Heights;
The abject subjugation of the Palestinians...

The spoils of victory my friend...Israel did not set out to aquire these areas via Imperialism, they were seized as a direct result of armed conflict initiated by their neighbors.

[SimonM]

Sorry but they were acts of expansionism that should not have been allowed. The only one that REALLY can be counted as protectivist expansion is Golan Heights and that only ever happened BECAUSE Israel had captured the other two palestinian territories.

The fact is that Israel is a big part of the problem in the middle east.

They aren't the whole problem.

Islamic fundamentalism and christian colonial intervention have also been insturmental in screwing up the region.

But anyone who portrays Israel as an innocent victim is a liar. Plain and simple.

[David Jamieson]

sorry but they were acts of expansionism that should not have been allowed. The only one that really can be counted as protectivist expansion is golan heights and that only ever happened because israel had captured the other two palestinian territories.

The fact is that israel is a big part of the problem in the middle east.

They aren't the whole problem.

Islamic fundamentalism and christian colonial intervention have also been insturmental in screwing up the region.

But anyone who portrays israel as an innocent victim is a liar. Plain and simple.

qft
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[SimonM]

Whatever. It's true. Israel is an equal share in that clusterfvck.

[David Jamieson]

Other nations not directly responsible for the middle eastern soil are a huge contributing factor to the strife and trouble in the Middle east in general.

the fact that there is economic and political infighting between the G7 nations doesn't help at all either.

we have France , Germany and Russia and China cutting deals over here and we have the US, Britain and Canada cutting deals over here and when the crap hits the fan, everyone beats on the guys who are the weakest. Other developed nations aren't presenting quite so many problems.

It's very poor form, but typical of todays world leaders. TO me, it looks like more proxy war between russia and UK/US. If you look at how oil is distributed and by whom in europe, the picture gets a little clearer.

ps, if you don't think it's about energy (oil and gas) and control of it, then you shouldn't even enter the argument as you are wholly unequipped. :-)

[sanjuro_ronin]

All are to blame for the mess in the ME, there is no country that is blameless for that craptascular mess.

[David Jamieson]

All are to blame for the mess in the ME, there is no country that is blameless for that craptascular mess.

I dunno, there's a lot of countries that aren't involved at all.

or do you mean the players mentioned?