Is society itself what has weakened the Martial Arts?

[Iron_Eagle_76]

It seems to be a trend in this day and age that people are generally weaker than in the past. For example, ten years ago my kung fu class was a good workout that involved hard conditioning, hard sparring, and a comradery that was like no other. But it seems like today people just aren't interested in this sort of thing. One of the main reasons I stopped teaching Kung Fu and focused on Boxing was that students coming into the class did not want what we had done before. They wanted something easy, routine, and for lack of a better term, P**ssified version of what our Kung Fu class is. Granted, there were students like this back in the day, but not in the numbers like there are now. Is this a reflection of the laziness of society, or am I just getting more senile in my older age?

[David Jamieson]

It seems to be a trend in this day and age that people are generally weaker than in the past. For example, ten years ago my kung fu class was a good workout that involved hard conditioning, hard sparring, and a comradery that was like no other. But it seems like today people just aren't interested in this sort of thing. One of the main reasons I stopped teaching Kung Fu and focused on Boxing was that students coming into the class did not want what we had done before. They wanted something easy, routine, and for lack of a better term, P**ssified version of what our Kung Fu class is. Granted, there were students like this back in the day, but not in the numbers like there are now. Is this a reflection of the laziness of society, or am I just getting more senile in my older age?

I think you are not assessing the situation correctly. There are different levels of fitness. IME, most traditional martial arts schools are loaded with hobbyists. When there is competition that is at a level of excellence you will have a greater amount of fit and able people. This doesn't really happen so much in kungfu and karate tournaments where far too much emphasis is placed on forms and not enough on martial skills as applied.

so people learn a pattern, get real used to it and then the law of dimishing returns kicks in and they do not change because of the practice because it no longer challenges them. Having a teacher adjust your wrist or something doesn't enhance much either. lol

anyway, competitive environments fosters better performance especially from fighters.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

I think you are not assessing the situation correctly. There are different levels of fitness. IME, most traditional martial arts schools are loaded with hobbyists. When there is competition that is at a level of excellence you will have a greater amount of fit and able people. This doesn't really happen so much in kungfu and karate tournaments where far too much emphasis is placed on forms and not enough on martial skills as applied.

so people learn a pattern, get real used to it and then the law of dimishing returns kicks in and they do not change because of the practice because it no longer challenges them. Having a teacher adjust your wrist or something doesn't enhance much either. lol

anyway, competitive environments fosters better performance especially from fighters.

I agree that traditional martial arts is loaded with hobbyists. But I still feel that as a society we do not hold ourselves to as high of a standard as before. Maybe it's the "Everyone is a winner" crap that we as a society have believed religiously over the last ten to fifteen years.

[MasterKiller]

uh, no. Blame the industry. Most martial arts clubs water down their curriculum to attract a wider range of students and therefore make more $. If you market it as such, don't be surprised when your core group is overweight soccer moms and Little Dragons who would rather be playing their Nintendo DS.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Real MA training isn't and never has been, for everyone.
Those wishing to fight and compete are best following Sport combat arts.
Those looking for a "hobby" are best finding it in the typical TMA.
Those looking for fitness with a twist, can find it in both of the above.
For the very small percentage looking to be MA, the path will typically start with TMA, go to Sport combat and back to TMA.
For the almost dead portion that want that "little bit more", well...there is always the Baki the Grappler anime.
That's probably as close to the "real thing" as yu are gonna get.

[Lucas]

For the almost dead portion that want that "little bit more", well...there is always the Baki the Grappler anime.
That's probably as close to the "real thing" as yu are gonna get.

I'll rip out your tendons!

[Ray Pina]

It's all related to the increasing amount of bull$hit man allows himself to willingly and knowingly digest.

I'm not going to get into it too heavily, and I know it's only the half dozen kwoons I've been to in NYC's Chinatown, and that the standards in Tenn. and Ohio are pretty higher, but you have to be smoking crack to think the way these guys are training is warrior training. Maybe they can push around some ring-ding eating, couch potato, but guys like me are training 5, 6 days a week. Multiple sessions a day. We're fighting quarterly. Competing in BJJ more regularly. You can't match that with the standing in straight lines, holding horse stance, doing golden turtles and Sil Lum Tao.

Forget technique or style. Just the sheer amount of conditioning. This is something that karate had that I find Kung Fu lacks. You need to be a better man (faster, stronger, more explosive, agile, confident, ballsy) than the other guy. You need to be a fierce warrior.

Most people want to look tough, sound tough, talk tough... they don't want to train tough. So just like people who think they'll get rich buying lottery tickets they go off to the kwoon packing their fake weapons and robes. Slip on their kung fu sandals... which are great ya know, their slipper soles help your balance

Anyone with a decent brain knows how they're training and where it leaves them in the big scheme of things. Most people are content with blowing smoke up their own a$$. They're happy enough making it look like they're trying.

[bawang]

more master than students in north america, and all the "masters" want to make money off teaching martial arts, want to make art of kiling a business, teaching to complete garbage of people, why i will never understand
i want schools to shut down and disappear, i want people to forget about kung fu and that faagoot bruce lee,i wanna start over

[Ray Pina]

Really? I trained with a bunch of highly-educated, ABCs who didn't want to get dirty. Doctors, laywers, architects. I was stoked if I got hurt, arrested or needed a home. Unfortunately I needed some bad a$$es to fight with.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

Really? I trained with a bunch of highly-educated, ABCs who didn't want to get dirty. Doctors, laywers, architects. I was stoked if I got hurt, arrested or needed a home. Unfortunately I needed some bad a$$es to fight with.

The funny thing is I always thought these types were the worst. They think because they are highly educated they can somehow think their way through martial arts training rather than training the correct way physically. Most are half-ass psuedo intellectuals who would rather theorize rather than test.

[sanjuro_ronin]

It's all related to the increasing amount of bull$hit man allows himself to willingly and knowingly digest.

I'm not going to get into it too heavily, and I know it's only the half dozen kwoons I've been to in NYC's Chinatown, and that the standards in Tenn. and Ohio are pretty higher, but you have to be smoking crack to think the way these guys are training is warrior training. Maybe they can push around some ring-ding eating, couch potato, but guys like me are training 5, 6 days a week. Multiple sessions a day. We're fighting quarterly. Competing in BJJ more regularly. You can't match that with the standing in straight lines, holding horse stance, doing golden turtles and Sil Lum Tao.

Forget technique or style. Just the sheer amount of conditioning. This is something that karate had that I find Kung Fu lacks. You need to be a better man (faster, stronger, more explosive, agile, confident, ballsy) than the other guy. You need to be a fierce warrior.

Most people want to look tough, sound tough, talk tough... they don't want to train tough. So just like people who think they'll get rich buying lottery tickets they go off to the kwoon packing their fake weapons and robes. Slip on their kung fu sandals... which are great ya know, their slipper soles help your balance

Anyone with a decent brain knows how they're training and where it leaves them in the big scheme of things. Most people are content with blowing smoke up their own a$$. They're happy enough making it look like they're trying.

AH Ray....same ol same ol eh?

[bawang]

good example is the guy posting the other thread. he wants to do hung gar/ wing chun for the "philosophy".
i tell you the philosophy dont kil prostitutes dont kil monks dont kil poor people everyone eles is fair game this is the only code of the wulin

but sanjuro, ray has a point though
ray can whoop most kung fu peoples butts and he gets whopped all the time by mma people think about that

[sanjuro_ronin]

but sanjuro, ray has a point ven thogh
ray can whoop most kung fu peoples butts and he gets whopped all the time by mma people think about that

Not sure what your point is...
Has ray fought really bad TCMA?
Has Ray had bad MMA training, since he is losing "all the time" ?

[bawang]

well u have to admit good tmca is hard as hell to find tho, not hard for average person to come up with the conclusion
i mean it not hard to understand why those peenisbutts at bullshido are so bitter

[sanjuro_ronin]

well u have to admit good tmca is hard as hell to find tho, not hard for average person to come up with the conclusion
i mean it not hard to understand why those peenisbutts at bullshido are so bitter

True, decent TCMA is harder to find than a virgin in a *****house.

LOL at peenisbutts !!