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Thread: Kung-Fu Schools & Ground fighting

  1. #16
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    Groundwork!!! We don't need no steenkin groundwork!
    "George never did wake up. And, even all that talking didn't make death any easier...at least not for us. Maybe, in the end, all you can really hope for is that your last thought is a nice one...even if it's just about the taste of a nice cold beer."

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    "Is enlightenment even possible? Or, did I drive by it like a missed exit?"

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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SanHeChuan View Post
    I believe those are the kind of techniques he was talking about that was mantis. While the other stuff was supplemental. As far as I know kung fu doesn't have a technique involving two guys laying on top of each other, I mean come on that would just be gay.

    You could learn the basics of BJJ yourself and teach those, presumably you could pick them up fast, with your background. The most you need to know as a stand up fighter is the transitions so you can work your way back to your feet. You'll also need to have enough knowledge of submissions to at least recognize when your in danger so you can escape.
    Thanks for the explanation.

    As for myself, I do have a personal trainer with an extensive background and have incorporated it, and such, very happy with what we've got.

    But, I was curious though of what a lot of Kung-Fu schools are doing in regards to it. I know that it was met with some resistance awhile back, but it seems more and more accepted...but how much?
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend Tap View Post
    My WC Sifu taught ground fighting alongside standup and takedown/sweep stuff. Don't know what the origin of it was; he never said it was from anywhere else so at the time I just assumed it was part of WC, and he never really taught the names of the groundfighting techniques, so no clues there either.
    Interesting. Hearing that, it makes me think bawang is not too far off, in that groundfighting becomes so much a part of the martial sciences that everyone incorporates it, and it gets handed down, and the origins of it may become obscured.
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  4. #19
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    Yes we do.
    Long Fist includes shiua chiao and chin na. Now granted its not as specialized as BJJ, but its ground fighting nevertheless. Its pretty much staying true to the style.
    Master of Shaolin I-Ching Bu Ti, GunGoPow and I Hung Wei Lo styles.

    I am seeking sparring partner. Any level. Looking for blondes or redhead. 5'2" to 5'9". Between 115-135 weight class. Females between 17-30 only need apply. Will extensively work on grappling.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oso View Post
    Groundwork!!! We don't need no steenkin groundwork!
    lol says the mma mod!

    by the way oso - how did you become a mod? not that you aren't deserving! just wondering what torture and tribunals gene put you through for him to deem you worthy to breathe in his direction???????
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  6. #21
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    my first teacher has a bjj program. he keeps the curriculum seperate. but he does do a class every now and then of bjj in the kung fu curriculum because its good for understanding leverage and stuff. but he keeps it seperate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Mantis View Post
    Genes too busy rocking the gang and scarfing down bags of cheetos while beating it to nacho ninjettes and laughing at the ridiculous posts on the kfforum. In a horse stance of course.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcakid View Post
    Yes we do.
    Long Fist includes shiua chiao and chin na. Now granted its not as specialized as BJJ, but its ground fighting nevertheless. Its pretty much staying true to the style.
    Most Kung-Fu's (if you will) have Seut and Lah. And it's the specialization that I'm getting at. There are much more effective ways to get the Kam Lah techs on the ground these days, and in fact, curriculums designed to methodically learn it.

    Does it get incorporated within LF schools, or is the groundfighting that the LF schools do considered "it", and if you want to learn more about it, go study BJJ?
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaolinlueb View Post
    my first teacher has a bjj program. he keeps the curriculum seperate. but he does do a class every now and then of bjj in the kung fu curriculum because its good for understanding leverage and stuff. but he keeps it seperate.
    Out of curiosity, why separate?
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  9. #24
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    When I trained in Wing Chun we would chi sau or spar often times all the way to the ground and then fight on the ground or our ways out of the ground. Granted my sifu did have some judo experience prior to his learning Wing Chun himself he would soetimes throw in an armn lock or two in the ground but these arm locks were also worked in on stand up or atleast a variation. Was this from pure kung-fu?? Who knows but it made things complete and showed us how to keep fighting from the ground which made for a solid self defense system.

    Done and Done

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by yutyeesam View Post
    Out of curiosity, why separate?
    some kung fu people don't want to do bjj. most bjj people don't want to do kung fu. so he keeps them separate. also he offers discount if they want to do both. it is also a business so.

    i used to think, oh i will use my chin na on the ground.
    doesn't work like that. well you can adapt it, but have to be very good. your leverage and positioning goes to sh*t when you are flat on your back and in a half guard/guard/side mount.

    i took a couple seminars (about 6 hours total) with my instructor and learned some basics. I respect BJJ for what it is and does, but I don't like it. I have rolled with bjj guys to. Heck I know the owners of NAGA and MMA.TV
    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Mantis View Post
    Genes too busy rocking the gang and scarfing down bags of cheetos while beating it to nacho ninjettes and laughing at the ridiculous posts on the kfforum. In a horse stance of course.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjw View Post
    When I trained in Wing Chun we would chi sau or spar often times all the way to the ground and then fight on the ground or our ways out of the ground. Granted my sifu did have some judo experience prior to his learning Wing Chun himself he would soetimes throw in an armn lock or two in the ground but these arm locks were also worked in on stand up or atleast a variation. Was this from pure kung-fu?? Who knows but it made things complete and showed us how to keep fighting from the ground which made for a solid self defense system.

    Done and Done
    Cool. Yeah, I'm not even worried about the pure Kung-Fu aspect of it. Again, Kung-Fu means skill. And it looks like you guys trained to work from the ground, ie, a skill.

    BTW, you're the second person who said "When I trained in Wing Chun..."
    Just thought that was interesting.
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaolinlueb View Post
    some kung fu people don't want to do bjj. most bjj people don't want to do kung fu. so he keeps them separate. also he offers discount if they want to do both. it is also a business so.

    i used to think, oh i will use my chin na on the ground.
    doesn't work like that. well you can adapt it, but have to be very good. your leverage and positioning goes to sh*t when you are flat on your back and in a half guard/guard/side mount.

    i took a couple seminars (about 6 hours total) with my instructor and learned some basics. I respect BJJ for what it is and does, but I don't like it. I have rolled with bjj guys to. Heck I know the owners of NAGA and MMA.TV
    Makes sense, and I agree! Why don't you like it?
    The 10 Elements of Choy Lay Fut:
    Kum, Na, Gwa, Sau, Chop, Pow, Kup, Biu, Ding, Jong

    The 13 Principles of Taijiquan:
    Ward Off, Roll Back, Press, Push, Pluck, Elbow, Shoulder, Split, Forward, Back, Left, Right, Central Equilibrium

    And it doesn't hurt to practice stuff from:
    Mounts, Guards, and Side Mounts!


    Austin Kung-Fu Academy

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by yutyeesam View Post
    BTW, you're the second person who said "When I trained in Wing Chun..."
    Just thought that was interesting.
    To be fair, I stopped because I graduated from college and moved back home, where there wasn't/isn't a WC school nearby.
    When you stop growing you start dying.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend Tap View Post
    My WC Sifu taught ground fighting alongside standup and takedown/sweep stuff. Don't know what the origin of it was; he never said it was from anywhere else so at the time I just assumed it was part of WC, and he never really taught the names of the groundfighting techniques, so no clues there either.
    Sounds like the teacher I used to train with.Things would seemingly appear out of thin air with no explanation.He taught us bjj,but it was called "groundfighting" to make it appear as if we were still doing cma.You like I assumed it was a part of what we were doing.I was wrong.

  15. #30
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    I learn CMA to learn a standup art focused on strikes and pounding people with . . . strikes.

    If I wanted to learn grappling I would go take BJJ or Sambo.

    If I want to learn MMA I would join a MMA gym.

    If I want to learn boxing I would join a boxing gym.

    I want to learn CLF so I joined a CLF gym.

    Why are all CMA guys incorporating BJJ into their curriculum?

    Are you training for an MMA competition?

    If for self defense, basic sweeps/throws, and learning how to mount/sweep from the guard is good enough to get out.

    Why drill the BJJ intensively if you're never gonna use it. That's what I'm confused about.
    It is bias to think that the art of war is just for killing people. It is not to kill people, it is to kill evil. It is a strategem to give life to many people by killing the evil of one person.
    - Yagyū Munenori

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