How to defeat a Wrestler

[Yoshiyahu]

I am 32 really

Seriously kid, how old are you?

Thank you for answering my questions. I found this quite interesting...great...what are some of the weaknesses of Ground fighting?


What are somethings in a street fight that makes ground fighting dangerous to use against certain arts? and what art?

You train in the most common ways you're going to have to defend yourself!

You get experience in how people generally punch(boxing is the most common way in the US), you get experience in how people generally kick, you get experience in how people generally throw and wrestle, how people generally use guns, how people generally use knives. And you get experience in how people fight in groups. And you improvise for the rest based on the concepts you've learned.

Did I miss anything? Cause its seriously not that ****in' hard! You don't need to train to fight killer robots for gods sake. How many unique situations do you REALLY think there are, in fighting???

[AdrianK]

Thank you for answering my questions. I found this quite interesting...great...what are some of the weaknesses of Ground fighting?

The immobility of being attached to another person, and the lack of striking. Many grappling styles have their own fair share of problems too.

What are somethings in a street fight that makes ground fighting dangerous to use against certain arts? and what art?

Someone who knows grappling, has the advantage on the ground. Whether they want to gouge out your eyes, rip your ears off, or play as nasty as you can. They have the advantage on the ground. The ground is a range or you can look at it like a game. Those that play the game, have a major advantage when playing that game. Those that don't, suffer a significant disadvantage. Likewise, If they don't know how to strike, or take a strike, they have a disadvantage on their feet, and in striking.

[Edmund]

No No you got me wrong. I am saying you don't have to cross train Ground fighting. But you need to spar ground fighters and study and adapt your WC to defeat them easily.

Good to know. Thanks for that. How about you take your own advice?
Because hugging a fat ass back in high school doesn't really count.

Find out what works and what doesn't by noticing your weakness,openings and correcting them.

Mate you haven't even done that. So why are you giving advice on what someone should and shouldn't to train?

What I am saying is pure WC is not bad. Nor is crosstraining deterimental. If your into sport fighting crosstraining may be pretty good. But also being a purist would be a breath of fresh air if you win many bouts.

If it's not detrimental, quit trying to justify not wanting to do it with stupid hypotheticals.

[Yoshiyahu]

Actually I do practice sprawling and counters with a police officer friend of mines. We practice many other techniques to work WC against them.

As for sparring and drilling i work various ranges..from long to ground to kneeling to sitting to standing.

As for detrimental it depends on the fighter really. anyway all i can say is cross training is not the end all to be all...getting ground experience doesn't gurantee you can defeat a skilled WC guy who has no ground defense...here in USA every body got some ground experience. Especially me since my friends were a WC guy who wrestled. another guy who weightlifted and wrestled. an another guy who did muay thai and some boxing!

So over all I had just a little exposure to those ranges in high school....among other things!

Good to know. Thanks for that. How about you take your own advice?
Because hugging a fat ass back in high school doesn't really count.




Mate you haven't even done that. So why are you giving advice on what someone should and shouldn't to train?



If it's not detrimental, quit trying to justify not wanting to do it with stupid hypotheticals.

Question isn't possible to use the person body to move around them while being attached. Also can you not manipulate your opponent to strike them effieiciently on the ground especially in Gaurd or in the dominant posistion?

What grappling styles incorporates striking with joint locks and submission holds?

The immobility of being attached to another person, and the lack of striking. Many grappling styles have their own fair share of problems too.




Someone who knows grappling, has the advantage on the ground. Whether they want to gouge out your eyes, rip your ears off, or play as nasty as you can. They have the advantage on the ground. The ground is a range or you can look at it like a game. Those that play the game, have a major advantage when playing that game. Those that don't, suffer a significant disadvantage. Likewise, If they don't know how to strike, or take a strike, they have a disadvantage on their feet, and in striking.

[bennyvt]

any one good would have jumped and landed on you if you just wrap around them when they picked you up. Watch hughes he does it all the time. Sorry about the bad english im an aussie and im using my phone so preemptive text stuffs it up if i dont look carefully

[AdrianK]

Question isn't possible to use the person body to move around them while being attached.

By mobility I mean, if he pulls out a knife or gun, or a bunch of his friends come up, you can't easily run away. Yes, its entirely possible to move around them on the ground.

Also can you not manipulate your opponent to strike them effieiciently on the ground especially in Gaurd or in the dominant posistion?

In theory you could do most of the same techniques on the ground that you can standing up.

In reality, theres quite a few differences. Its not that you can't apply wing chun to the ground - Its that you can't apply wing chun to the ground effectively without first learning the ground game to begin with. The most common and effective movements and concepts that have been established by accomplished people in the style. How many pure Wing Chun guys have won even the lowest level grappling tournament? Oh thats right... none. Honestly, just go to a BJJ school and try out a free class. Ask to play around with one of their senior students. Don't take my word for it. Go ahead and find out.

What grappling styles incorporates striking with joint locks and submission holds?

Many MMA gyms will do this.
The fact of the matter is, the search for the all-encompassing everything style is ridiculous. There is no style that has it all. Most styles are severely lacking in one area or another, like BJJ and striking, or Wing Chun and Grappling. Thats why you cross-train in various styles.

And then further down that road, there are no styles. Only concepts you know and understand, and your own personal expressive movements that came from the templates you learned. Everything should flow into one another.

[Kansuke]

Who thinks this Yoshiyahu is either a 13 year old kid, another screen name for hw108, or both?

[AdrianK]

Speaking of which, Yoshiyahu - Who is your Sifu? There is no one in Missouri listed on the Yuen Kay San Wing Chun website's directory. And theres only a few yip man schools there even that popup in a yellow pages search...

[anerlich]

Who thinks this Yoshiyahu is either a 13 year old kid, another screen name for hw108, or both?

Yes to the first, no to the second.

Though if they nuthug any harder they may merge.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Honestly, just go to a BJJ school and try out a free class. Ask to play around with one of their senior students. Don't take my word for it. Go ahead and find out.



.

Why do people have a hard time doing this?

You have all these "ideas" about what you THINK may work, why wouldn't you wanna find out if they DO work?
Even more so if you profess to be all about "real fighting".

[m1k3]

Honestly, just go to a BJJ school and try out a free class. Ask to play around with one of their senior students. Don't take my word for it. Go ahead and find out.

You don't even need to ask for a senior student. Pick a white belt with 3 or four stripes and find out how little you know about grappling. And remember, he's just a white belt, the bottom rung of the BJJ hierarchy.

[SimonM]

As for the old "pull a knife" chestnut...

Blade fighting is as different from punch / kick fighting as it is from wrestling. A good blade fighter will have some techniques reminiscent of both predicated upon the three cardinal rules of fighting with a sharp weapon:

1) Don't get stabbed. (This is rule 1, seriously any fighting art that incorporates blade techniques and doesn't make this priority #1 has a problem.)
2) Stab the other guy.
3) Don't lose your blade.

The length of the blade will further complicate this. Fighting with a 3 inch knife will be much more grapple-friendly than fighting with a greatsword.

Please note that "take away the other guy's blade" doesn't make the list. This is because many knife stripping techniques significantly increase the risk of getting stabbed.

If you can strip a blade without violating rule 1 it'd still be #4 after stabbing the other guy and not losing your blade.

[anerlich]

Actually I do practice sprawling and counters with a police officer friend of mines. We practice many other techniques to work WC against them.

As for sparring and drilling i work various ranges..from long to ground to kneeling to sitting to standing.

As for detrimental it depends on the fighter really. anyway all i can say is cross training is not the end all to be all...getting ground experience doesn't gurantee you can defeat a skilled WC guy who has no ground defense...here in USA every body got some ground experience. Especially me since my friends were a WC guy who wrestled. another guy who weightlifted and wrestled. an another guy who did muay thai and some boxing!

So, in the unlikely event that anyone takes your claims as gospel, you basically claim to have done exactly what you are saying we shouldn't have to do, viz practice on the ground, various scenarios, sprawling, etc. And your friends are a bunch of crosstrainers anyway - if they are not imaginary friends.

WTF are you on about?

Your stories are so full of inconsistencies, obvious howlers that anyone who had done what you claim to have done would never think, let alone type, and standard schoolboy exaggeration, that no one could possibly believe them, or that you are 32 years old.

Nothing can guarantee you a win in a fight against anybody. Too many variables. Avoidance is the best option if at all possible, especially for the clueless (go to the mirror, boy).

[Yoshiyahu]

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...4&postcount=45

check out this post to those who asked on this thread about tom wong!

[bennyvt]

the dude that held off a couple of wrestlers with his chi. R u joking. People that still write that **** need to know that most people read it and go "wanker". I wish I still had the adress of the video put on here a while ago with the old guy that said he could beat anyone with his chi stirkes and a wrestler challenged him and completly ****ed him up.
Does everyone do the bridge not using the neck. I was taught this way, have read many articles from gotch and burns on the importance of it. I do it against my mate and he is about 100kgs, Im only 55kgs. Without using your head you dont get the right arch in your back and the training helps with a good suplex (which is what my mate does if he gets me in the air.) Do you think this is because it was used with rules that stated that shoulders on ground was a pin (as was already stated) or it is the best way to do it. I know BJJ guys mostly use their shoulders, but judo also uses the head and they beat helio so it must mean something. I read alot from matt furey who I thought was only a fitness guy but had some things with carl gotch that seemed good. Then I read a thing supposedly from gotch about how furey was full of ****. Can anyone comment, mainly victor as he said he does catch. Thanks