Boxing

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Christopher M




FWIW, the only time I've ever been hit in the boys For Real (tm) all it did was made me get mad and clock the guy harder. I'm sure if the guy had trumped me in skill, he'd have been able to take advantage of the ensuing anger and haste - but then again, if he'd trumped me in skill, there wouldn't be the original problem for him to begin with. Hurt pretty bad afterwards though.

That's the same experience I've had - I didn't really feel it until afterward.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Unmatchable


there is still a sense of security that at any time you can back out and stop the fight or there is a coach watching with medical aid.

Where I train, you're not backing out. One it's started, you're stuck. As for a coach with medical aid, you will have that in the ring also.

It's also in a controlled envioerment with shin pads, gloves sometimes headpiece.

You wear those in the ring also - shin pads are optional, however. I don't wear shin pads in practice. remember, the comparison we are making is between sparring and in the ring...

And you know who you are sparring agains, you know their capabilities it isn't some guy who you never met and know what they are capable off.

depends on the level you fight on, or how big the local scene is. If you have tapes of the guy, you can study him.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Unmatchable


Tony Bauers Spear system. And use bjj against larger opponents taking them down. don't fight man to man standing with them.

1. you apparently forgot what we were discussing originally - we are giving him tips for a boxing match. Neither bjj nor flinch reflex training will help him.

2. Taking someone down isn't always the best course of action. The situation will dictate all of that.

[Kaitain(UK)]

a bigger and heavier opponent has a lot of advantages - of course he won't always win but he has natural physical advantages which affect his punching power and also his ability to receive power.

Anyway - tips on beating a bigger guy in a boxing environment from someone who has never boxed - I have traiined MT in the past though so this might help. I'm also 6'4 and 250 so I don't have much experience of fighting bigger people (thank the lord) - so take this as advice based on me having sparred with irritating smaller people who won't stand still and trade

As has been said - you've got to get inside his range which means slipping his jab and throwing your own. If you aren't picking up his jabs then you're going to have to work on movement and wait for him to get flat footed (say after he's thrown a punch, follow him back in behind it - you might get chinned of course if he's good at fighting off his back foot...). Circle away from his rear hand towards his jabbing hand - when he shifts position to adjust to your movement, move in and jab and then right hook to the body and then right hook to head. Remember to guard your head with your left whilst you're doing this or you'll eat a big one.

Overhands - with gloves it's bloody useful against a taller opponent. Some geezer in a mullet beat up that fat black sumo guy in one of the early UFC's using an overhand palm - I find it hard to defend against because it follows through and drags my guard down. It does leave you open to hooks though. I would try and throw a hook off afterwards as I'm skipping out.

Work _everything_ off of your jab - jab and cross, jab and jab, jab and hook, jab and overhand, jab and uppercut. If you're trying to get inside his range and you don't throw a jab on the way in, you're going to find it hard.

If he's significantly bigger than you then his punches are going to sap his energy quite a bit faster than your punches will drain your energy (given roughly equal cardio etc) - so you can probably increase your work rate and pressure him without tiring faster.

Likewise - if he's bigger then moving around is going to sap his energy faster, keep mobile and try and frustrate him a bit. Toe to toe is just going to result in you getting paggered.

Don't throw power punches out every single time - throwing at full power requires you to set yourself more and reduces your mobility (as well as being bloody knackering when you miss). If you don't clock him then you're going to be a lot easier to hit. Sometimes just pawing with the jab is enough to break his rhythm and work an entry. Throw power when the shot is available.

When you need to break out, try following a rule of 3 and out - jab, power shot, less powerful shot as you back away. If you try and throw more than 3 in a combination and they haven't landed, a good opponent will have picked your rhythm and angles up and will be preparing to land one right on the button. Certainly for me, if someone has thrown 3 and i've dodged/blocked those three, I am well set to strike if they push their luck.

If he's more experienced than you and you are just getting beaten up, maybe you could ask him to box southpaw. He'll improve from working switch, and you'll learn a little more (maybe). Ask him what drills you can work to improve your boxing - otherwise you're just applying your own art in an environment that means you can't use it effectively.

As for punching with gloves on - wear them a few times a week when you do bag work. Or go and buy some lighter gloves

Hope some of that helps

Paul

[Ray Pina]

(coming in late and only read first post)

Just because you have boxing gloves on doesn't mean you have to "box". Use your jamming techniques. Get in, turn him if you can.

Don't think jab, jab, skip and move .... jab, jab, skip and move ... unless that's what you're working on. Think of a guy trying to hit you and what you have trained to make that not so.

Good luck. Enjoy. Maybe buy yourself some headgear.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Kaitain(UK)
a bigger and heavier opponent has a lot of advantages - of course he won't always win but he has natural physical advantages which affect his punching power and also his ability to receive power.

Anyway - tips on beating a bigger guy in a boxing environment from someone who has never boxed - I have traiined MT in the past though so this might help. I'm also 6'4 and 250 so I don't have much experience of fighting bigger people (thank the lord) - so take this as advice based on me having sparred with irritating smaller people who won't stand still and trade

As has been said - you've got to get inside his range which means slipping his jab and throwing your own. If you aren't picking up his jabs then you're going to have to work on movement and wait for him to get flat footed (say after he's thrown a punch, follow him back in behind it - you might get chinned of course if he's good at fighting off his back foot...). Circle away from his rear hand towards his jabbing hand - when he shifts position to adjust to your movement, move in and jab and then right hook to the body and then right hook to head. Remember to guard your head with your left whilst you're doing this or you'll eat a big one.

Overhands - with gloves it's bloody useful against a taller opponent. Some geezer in a mullet beat up that fat black sumo guy in one of the early UFC's using an overhand palm - I find it hard to defend against because it follows through and drags my guard down. It does leave you open to hooks though. I would try and throw a hook off afterwards as I'm skipping out.

Work _everything_ off of your jab - jab and cross, jab and jab, jab and hook, jab and overhand, jab and uppercut. If you're trying to get inside his range and you don't throw a jab on the way in, you're going to find it hard.

If he's significantly bigger than you then his punches are going to sap his energy quite a bit faster than your punches will drain your energy (given roughly equal cardio etc) - so you can probably increase your work rate and pressure him without tiring faster.

Likewise - if he's bigger then moving around is going to sap his energy faster, keep mobile and try and frustrate him a bit. Toe to toe is just going to result in you getting paggered.

Don't throw power punches out every single time - throwing at full power requires you to set yourself more and reduces your mobility (as well as being bloody knackering when you miss). If you don't clock him then you're going to be a lot easier to hit. Sometimes just pawing with the jab is enough to break his rhythm and work an entry. Throw power when the shot is available.

When you need to break out, try following a rule of 3 and out - jab, power shot, less powerful shot as you back away. If you try and throw more than 3 in a combination and they haven't landed, a good opponent will have picked your rhythm and angles up and will be preparing to land one right on the button. Certainly for me, if someone has thrown 3 and i've dodged/blocked those three, I am well set to strike if they push their luck.

If he's more experienced than you and you are just getting beaten up, maybe you could ask him to box southpaw. He'll improve from working switch, and you'll learn a little more (maybe). Ask him what drills you can work to improve your boxing - otherwise you're just applying your own art in an environment that means you can't use it effectively.

As for punching with gloves on - wear them a few times a week when you do bag work. Or go and buy some lighter gloves

Hope some of that helps

Paul

good post.

[Knifefighter]

Originally posted by Water Dragon
my goodness is there some non sense posted on this thread.

That's for sure.

Dogder:
It sounds like you are not more skilled than your friends and are also smaller. In this case, they will probably smack you around. You can beat them over time, but not by getting advice on the internet. Join a boxing gym and learn good fundamentals. In six months or so, you will be owning them if they don't have much boxing training.

Kung Lek:
You boxed? And you think size matters in the ring, but not in the street? Give me a break. Most boxers have also fought on the street. We know that size matters for both, but that tactics, skill and conditioning can beat size in both environments also. One really has to wonder if you have ever fought either in the street or in the ring.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Enjoy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmQ3PSl6qLU

[sanjuro_ronin]

The Middleweights, past and present:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcMy0...eature=related

[AdrianK]

Anyone have any examples of kung fu being applied with the padded gloves in any amateur or professional competitions? (Alan Orr's camp excluded, we already know they're pretty **** good fighters)


That being said, I'd like to get an idea of what some of the kung fu world thinks about boxing. In one of my old schools it was looked at as simply a way to apply jab, cross, hook, uppercut, combinations, slips and weaves.

How would you, as a southern kung fu stylist, explain what boxing is?

[David Jamieson]

Anyone have any examples of kung fu being applied with the padded gloves in any amateur or professional competitions? (Alan Orr's camp excluded, we already know they're pretty **** good fighters)


That being said, I'd like to get an idea of what some of the kung fu world thinks about boxing. In one of my old schools it was looked at as simply a way to apply jab, cross, hook, uppercut, combinations, slips and weaves.

How would you, as a southern kung fu stylist, explain what boxing is?

why would a southern kungfu stylist explain what boxing is?

that would be like asking a boxer to explain what wrestling is?

southern kungfu practice is not limited to tactics in a ring.

it also in some styles contains qigongs, various device training methodologies and a variety of different ways of going about ones training from conditioning methods to actual technique development.

Having said that, I used to box and am ranked in amateur standings.

Boxing is stand up fighting, using only the fists, no striking below the belt or to the back, no kicking, no biting, no throwing, if you are clinched too long without any strikes being thrown you will be separated and you must begin again. You lose points for non aggressivness (not entering, not initiating attack). YOu can win by points or by knock out both for real and technically.

Primary strikes are jab, cross, hook and uppercut with range and level variations for each.

primary defense are covers, pats, pushes and chops and unconventional methods (whatever works for you so long as it doesn't break the rules)

boxing totally rolls into most striking martial arts including southern styles of chinese martial arts which all have jab, cross, hook and upper cut.

jab = short strike from the lead leg (yut gee choy, straight punch)
cross = strike across the body (ping choy, charp choy)
hook = hooking punch (sow choy)
uppercut = hooking punch from below (pao choy)

[AdrianK]

why would a southern kungfu stylist explain what boxing is?

Because its a worldwide sport that has similar concepts and techniques in common. And SOME southern stylists compete actively in this sport and MMA. However, since boxing has extreme limitations on what you can do, it'd be great to hear how people deal with that.

that would be like asking a boxer to explain what wrestling is?

Or to ask them what they think about wrestling in general, absolutely. It'd be interesting to see what they thought of that too.

southern kungfu practice is not limited to tactics in a ring.

But this thread is limited to that.

it also in some styles contains qigongs, various device training methodologies and a variety of different ways of going about ones training from conditioning methods to actual technique development.

We know this

Having said that, I used to box and am ranked in amateur standings.

Where are you ranked?


As for the rest of your post, thats all I wanted to hear

[David Jamieson]

[QUOTE=AdrianK;926293]Because its a worldwide sport that has similar concepts and techniques in common. And SOME southern stylists compete actively in this sport and MMA. However, since boxing has extreme limitations on what you can do, it'd be great to hear how people deal with that.[quote]

It's not limited for it's venue. It's not trained as a self defense art. It's not approached from taht vector and it's not actually suitable in a great deal of scenarios. If it's all you got, then it's all you got.

Or to ask them what they think about wrestling in general, absolutely. It'd be interesting to see what they thought of that too.

You did ask how someone would explain it to a southern stylist.

But this thread is limited to that.

Why?

We know this

Why minimize it?

Where are you ranked?

Orioles C.C, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada.

As for the rest of your post, thats all I wanted to hear

Why didn't you just ask about boxing then?

[wetwonder]

I don't know all that much about Bruce Lee, but I've seen his interviews. He took a lot from boxing. Mainly, that the main idea is to avoid 100 punches, while looking to get in one good shot. Boxers use footwork, bob and weave, and you can see Bruce Lee do some of that in his style. I always that he was kind of cool for taking a intelligent look at boxing style.

[David Jamieson]

There's also quite a lot of training that revolves around taking a strike and recovering,how to position yourself to do that and how to condition yourself to do that.

bobbing and weaving and footwork to avoid being struck is available in most martial arts.