REAL Kung Fu video?

[Lokhopkuen]

I have to say this was very entertaining. I've never seen kung fu, unscripted like this yet have that "kung fu" flavour (at least what may be perceived as how kung fu should kinda be)

I think a good boxer is good kung fu. I think a good karateka is good kung fu. I think good kung fu is a good boxer.

When the fighters are good, the lines of martial art styles begin to blur. Sure there are certain differences and underlying characteristics, but I would say that the number of similarities start to increase - styles, particular elements of successful moves/strategies, start to resemble each other...

The body can move an infinite number of ways but I think there are certain options that make for a good punch or a good place to punch or strategy to set up the attacker and so on...and that means those that win favour these particular ways of moving so in the end, winning fighters may have a tendency to start looking similar

Well said Grasshoper2.0!




(((((((secretly I always wanted to call someone grasshopper! Oww goodie))))))))

[lkfmdc]

Well, yes the "Pa Kua International" group is horrible. But why bring them up? Even if one's opinion of Alan Lee is less than stellar, there is no way his school is as bad as that...

The claim was made that "If his shyt was fake, he probably wouldn't still be there" and so I put up Pa Kua because it is clearly fake crap yet continues to exist in NY, a city with a lot of legit CMA...

or, in other words, you can be a HUGE FAKE and still run a school for years, I might, forgive me for saying this, suggest that if you are Asian it is even easier because some people automatically think if you are Asian you must be a "master"

I grew up doing Taekwondo with the most uncoordinated korean kid the world has ever known. He was the joke of the school. But, being he is Korean, he is now "Grandmaster Chong" and has a pretty large school in the suburbs

[cerebus]

The claim was made that "If his shyt was fake, he probably wouldn't still be there" and so I put up Pa Kua because it is clearly fake crap yet continues to exist in NY, a city with a lot of legit CMA...

or, in other words, you can be a HUGE FAKE and still run a school for years, I might, forgive me for saying this, suggest that if you are Asian it is even easier because some people automatically think if you are Asian you must be a "master"

I grew up doing Taekwondo with the most uncoordinated korean kid the world has ever known. He was the joke of the school. But, being he is Korean, he is now "Grandmaster Chong" and has a pretty large school in the suburbs

Ah, I see. But "Pa Kua International" has only been around in recent years. Alan Lee started in the 60s (I believe), when inter-school fights and challenges still took place. Would someone not have called Lee on it if he were fake?

I have heard quite alot about Lee and his school over the years, and seen a fair number of articles in the old 70s Kung Fu magazines about him. Everything I had heard was quite positive. Do you have some information which might've been kept out of the public for obvious reasons?

[Hardwork108]

Actually David Ross was the long time disciple of a Traditional Gung Fu teacher from a long grand lineage.

Yes I know about Dave's history with CTS.

Ross is not alone as there are other knucklehead glorified kickboxers here who have apparently studied under traditional sifus.

Unfortunately, many of them have not learnt what they have been taught (including the moral aspects) -assuming their sifus trusted them enough to teach them the authentic stuff - resulting in them "evolving" into MMA-ists, which in itself is not wrong, except for the fact that they bad mouth the traditional arts for their own agendas and marketing purposes.

Life is long though, this week it's apples and next week it's papaya...

And that fact puts Ross's credibility as a traditionalist, hence his self serving criticisms in the dust bin.

Furthermore, it seems that nowadays and as far as Ross is concerned, there is a better market ($$$$$$) for papaya then apples.

[Hardwork108]

point 1. you dont get to decide what is and isnt real or authentic or traditional etc.

I have enough training to differentiate between the real and not real. Whereas you haven't!

point 2. people that disagree with you are not by default knuckleheads or glorified kickboxers

No they are not, except for the ones who are MMA-ists who linger here in the KUNG FU forums to push their "MMA is best" agenda, be it for financial or egotistical reasons.

I believe that I am talking about you, as well as some of your prominent knucklehead friends, here in the forum.

althoguht kickboxing is awesome

It is awesome for those who practice it, hence they should go and post their wisdom in some kickboxing forum. This is a kung fu forum!

and so is being glorified so the insult doesnt really apply

You misunderstand (as usual), glorified refers to those who are nothing but kickboxers or MMA-ists who may have had some so called "kung fu" training among the other dozen or so MAs in their curriculum, who go on to criticise kung fu using their "kung fu experience" as a reference to give credibility to their idiotic comments.

also in regard to what you said to DJ if you throw a straight right cross, is that NOT kung fu? just because it happens to be in every other art ever??

It all depends on the art one is practicing.

Is a boxing uppercut Kung fu as well? How about a kung fu hook, is that boxing?LOL!

[Lokhopkuen]

Hey here is a demo I did recently.
Is it real gung fu?
I don't know but I do know I have tons of fun practicing and teaching.

For me that's what its all about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROUeRhNJdTU

Feel free to be as nasty and critical as you want

[taai gihk yahn]

http://www.pakua.org/martialarts/martialarts.htm
This group is HUGE in NYC.. and it's one of a long list of complete crap schools in NY area

the Pa Kua people are reprehensible; and international; I don't know which is worse...

I went to visit one once, and asked them about sword classes; they were very quick to tell me that one of their 'high level" black belts was in town teaching sword at that time; I asked about taking a private lesson w/him; they were very enthusiastic about this until I mentioned I had about 20 years experience in MA and w/blades of various types, and they lost interest and basically shooed me out the door;

aside from the fact that Lee's school was in midtown Manhattan, away from the Chinatown crowd, and that Lee never associated with the Chinatown people....

A lot of different opinions about Lee; he has always been widely known for having a cohort of "hardcore" African-American muslim students who basically drilled tam teui for 20+ years (make of that one you will); otherwise, my personal understanding is that he has a proclivity for the use throwing darts laced w/home-made toxic substances, in regards to his personal choice of defensive weaponry, and evidently is rather skilled in the use thereof (I may be wrong, of course, it is simply what I have been told, one may take it or leave it);

[Lokhopkuen]

the Pa Kua people are reprehensible; and international; I don't know which is worse...

I went to visit one once, and asked them about sword classes; they were very quick to tell me that one of their 'high level" black belts was in town teaching sword at that time; I asked about taking a private lesson w/him; they were very enthusiastic about this until I mentioned I had about 20 years experience in MA and w/blades of various types, and they lost interest and basically shooed me out the door;


A lot of different opinions about Lee; he has always been widely known for having a cohort of "hardcore" African-American muslim students who basically drilled tam teui for 20+ years (make of that one you will); otherwise, my personal understanding is that he has a proclivity for the use throwing darts laced w/home-made toxic substances, in regards to his personal choice of defensive weaponry, and evidently is rather skilled in the use thereof (I may be wrong, of course, it is simply what I have been told, one may take it or leave it);

Kung Fu has a rather confused reputation due to in some part to the rather colorful people who practice it. I can relate being a little crazy and very eccentric. What the world has seen in most cases is various novice and mid level practitioners drunk and confused by the power of what they have learned. The one's that get really good at it become reclusive and levitate the f*ck outta this plane of existence.
Carradine?
Absent!
Bueller, Bueller?

[lkfmdc]

I know someone who spent maybe 8 years with Alan Lee. He did nothing but basics (horse stance, some punches, some kicks, some Tan Tui roads, basicly stuff you'd get in like 3 months in most schools). You do basics for 8 years, well, you will do them well

Apparently a Chinese kid (about 14) came in and was from the same region as Lee. Lee told him to "come in early" to "clean". Supposedly after a month or so the 14 year old kid was doing stuff the long time students had never seen so maybe Lee had something real, just showed fluff to the "rice bags"

[cerebus]

I know someone who spent maybe 8 years with Alan Lee. He did nothing but basics (horse stance, some punches, some kicks, some Tan Tui roads, basicly stuff you'd get in like 3 months in most schools). You do basics for 8 years, well, you will do them well

Apparently a Chinese kid (about 14) came in and was from the same region as Lee. Lee told him to "come in early" to "clean". Supposedly after a month or so the 14 year old kid was doing stuff the long time students had never seen so maybe Lee had something real, just showed fluff to the "rice bags"

Hm. Well... I suppose there's something to be said for basics, but yeah that seems a bit excessive. But the people in the clips (the Alan Lee clips) looked like they'd done more than just Tan Tui. Tan Tui just isn't that flashy (at least not the Tan Tui I'm familiar with).

[lkfmdc]

to me the Alan Lee school demo clips are catering the lowest in popular (mis)conception about CMA... wave your hands around, do flowery movement, act cool, do some exotic looking movement, blah blah, add Asian master, repeat as necessary

[cerebus]

to me the Alan Lee school demo clips are catering the lowest in popular (mis)conception about CMA... wave your hands around, do flowery movement, act cool, do some exotic looking movement, blah blah, add Asian master, repeat as necessary

Perhaps, but isn't that how you feel about traditional Kung Fu in general? At least that was the impression I had.

[Hardwork108]

Apparently a Chinese kid (about 14) came in and was from the same region as Lee. Lee told him to "come in early" to "clean". Supposedly after a month or so the 14 year old kid was doing stuff the long time students had never seen so maybe Lee had something real, just showed fluff to the "rice bags"

Rather like CTS showed fluff to you and your fellow "rice bags"?

So at least we are leaning towards Lee being legit and that ironically, thanks to you!

[Lokhopkuen]

I know someone who spent maybe 8 years with Alan Lee. He did nothing but basics (horse stance, some punches, some kicks, some Tan Tui roads, basicly stuff you'd get in like 3 months in most schools). You do basics for 8 years, well, you will do them well

Apparently a Chinese kid (about 14) came in and was from the same region as Lee. Lee told him to "come in early" to "clean". Supposedly after a month or so the 14 year old kid was doing stuff the long time students had never seen so maybe Lee had something real, just showed fluff to the "rice bags"

This is not the first time I've heard stuff like this. Ah racism

[cerebus]

Who were Alan Lee's teachers?