Apologies to Terence Niehoff...

[YungChun]

Boxers break their hands because they hit f**** hard. They hit so fucking hard they've been known to break their hands when carefully wrapped and encased in 16 ounce padded gloves on occasion. Even thousands of hours of sports training research at the pantheon of fighting and with the help of orthopedic surgeons who specialize in athletic injuries to the hands cannot come to a conclusion as to whether a particular methodology of training can make a person less prone to break their hands. Millions of dollars are at stake here. If a style has the answer, there would be an army of fighters beating the crap out of each other trying to get through the doorway of such a methodology.

Actually there is a simple answer to this problem and it is widely recommended
among modern combative trainers as of late..

It's very simply: Don't use fists...

There are also other health issues at stake, including blood infections from impact into teeth, where the thin skin on the fist's business end is very vulnerable.

Interesting in as much as Shaolin systems seem to use more open hands than fists...

[Lee Chiang Po]

Actually there is a simple answer to this problem and it is widely recommended
among modern combative trainers as of late..

It's very simply: Don't use fists...

There are also other health issues at stake, including blood infections from impact into teeth, where the thin skin on the fist's business end is very vulnerable.

Interesting in as much as Shaolin systems seem to use more open hands than fists...

In watching video footage of fighting I have seen how the wrist is not strong enough to withstand the stress of impact when it is coming in from the side. Most boxers do not always fire their fists in a direct straight line, and in most flurries of fists they are doing roundhouse or hooks. Not only is this not an efficient use of form and energy, it can lead to break over of the wrist and possible injury. A punch does not have to be thrown with such power if it can not withstand such power. I think there are far better applictions of the fists than the traditional boxing forms.
I found this video to be very funny indeed. However, I could not equate it to T because I don't know him. I really don't know many people here. I know what I read, but I have found that this is not always a true picture of who we are talking with. There are a lot of members on this forum, but if you will take note, there are always about 20 people that do most all the posting. Of that, maybe 10 are into every thread. Many people lurk here, but do not post or take part in discussion. The major reason being that there are individuals on this forum that will quickly attack them. They are afraid to post because of this. I experienced this for the first months that I joined the forum. I still see off the wall stuff from the same people. However, I have seen some of the members of the forum, and none of them looked like what I really expected them to look like. And most do not have the skill set that they seem to speak of. In particular there are those that seem to know all about just about everything, every system, every different lineage, just about everything. Then you see a picture of a very young person. Not even old enough to have learned this much. The internet is a huge fantasy land where anyone can become anything and they don't have to be polite about it. I have always known rudeness to be one of the first signs of ignorance, and almost everyone that is guilty of it will speak up against it like they themselves are a paragon of virtue. I am no roll model myself, and I can make no claims to fame except that I am an ugly man. I have attempted to have discussions in logic but have been seldom successful at it. There are many here that are not rude or arrogant and can easily have a meaningful discussion, but they seldom attempt it because of the aggression by the MMA promoters and such. I find that the same promoters tend to plague all the forums and not just this one. I don't really understand why they have to come to this forum to preach when they would be more at home in a MMA forum. I know one thing for certain, and that is that you can not have thin skin on any internet forum because if you do, you will cry a lot. And if you constantly rag on people you had best be able to take a ragging.

LCP

[t_niehoff]

Actually there is a simple answer to this problem and it is widely recommended
among modern combative trainers as of late..

It's very simply: Don't use fists...

There are also other health issues at stake, including blood infections from impact into teeth, where the thin skin on the fist's business end is very vulnerable.

Interesting in as much as Shaolin systems seem to use more open hands than fists...

Open hand strikes don't do damage. Open hand strikes are used to hit then control.

In my view, the punch is not WCK's primary weapon -- the elbow is.

[goju]

Open hand strikes don't do damage.

wow... just wow

[sanjuro_ronin]

wow... just wow

And there I was, hoping against hope that no one would see this...
*shakes head*

[t_niehoff]

If you think open hand strikes do much damge -- show me some fights where open hand striking has done some real damage.

If these things are so useful, why don't MMA people use them? Because they are just so deadly?

[Knifefighter]

wow... just wow

Closed fist does significantly more damage than does open palm.

[goju]

Closed fist does significantly more damage than does open palm.

sure it does especially when you do not know how to palm strike

[goju]

If you think open hand strikes do much damge -- show me some fights where open hand striking has done some real damage.

If these things are so useful, why don't MMA people use them? Because they are just so deadly?

uh have you never heard of pancrase or bas rutten?

[sanjuro_ronin]

While the amount of impact force generated may be the same, a closed fist with its harder contact surface will cause more damage.
Not to say that palm heels cause no or little damage, just less because of the softer striking surface.

*crosses fingers and hopes that it is the end of this*

[goju]

*crosses fingers and hopes that it is the end of this*

lol i predict five more pages in this thread by the time i come back here later tonight

[Knifefighter]

uh have you never heard of pancrase

I fought that, as well as no glove, closed fist... closed fist does much more damage.

There are sound anatomical reasons for that, but you wouldn't be able to understand them.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Bas likes fists:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiieP...eature=related

[t_niehoff]

While the amount of impact force generated may be the same, a closed fist with its harder contact surface will cause more damage.
Not to say that palm heels cause no or little damage, just less because of the softer striking surface.

*crosses fingers and hopes that it is the end of this*

Uncross those fingers . . . the amount of generated force isn't the same since you aren't throwing punches like you do palm strikes -- or for the same reason. Palm strikes are mainly used to break an opponent's balance and maintain contact for control not to inflict much damage (why sumo has palm strikes, for example), whereas punches are used to inflict damage and don't offer control.

[t_niehoff]

lol i predict five more pages in this thread by the time i come back here later tonight

Then, please, by all means, don't come back.