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Thread: Anderson 'The Spider' Silva

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by goju View Post
    but as i said SIZE DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE STRONG

    and any time a smaller person beats a bigger person theres allways an excuse its rediculous
    speed power technique are all things that are important size does not guarantee any of this therefore it is not a needed thing


    look for example when brock was still in pro wrestling kurt angle beat him at a actual wrestling match back stage and look at the size difference between the two

    but of course its an exception to right lol
    Reading comprehension please, we have both stated that size matters where skill levels are similar, with all due respect to Brock he is not an gold medal winner at the Olympics. He was at one time the best in America, Kurt was the best in the world, there is a huge difference there in skill and ability.

  2. #32

    I can't believe that

    we can't agree that, generally, size is an advantage and that, if skills are comparable, the bigger guy generally wins. It's a fairly simple truth. Yes, Goju, sometimes small guys beat bigger guys, but that's the exception and not the rule.

    I didn't wrestle until my junior year of high school and I was in the 189 lb weight class at the time. We had state champs at 112 and 118, and conference champs at 125 and 135. While I couldn't easily pin any of those guys, they couldn't work me either and I was a first year guy. Bottom line is that, as long as both folks are fit, size is an advantage.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Noob View Post
    we can't agree that, generally, size is an advantage and that, if skills are comparable, the bigger guy generally wins. It's a fairly simple truth. Yes, Goju, sometimes small guys beat bigger guys, but that's the exception and not the rule.

    I didn't wrestle until my junior year of high school and I was in the 189 lb weight class at the time. We had state champs at 112 and 118, and conference champs at 125 and 135. While I couldn't easily pin any of those guys, they couldn't work me either and I was a first year guy. Bottom line is that, as long as both folks are fit, size is an advantage.
    i know it seems a silly thing to argue doesn't it. Size and strength really matter, its why there are weight catagories and why cutting weight is such a useful tool for a fighter if he does it right.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    its not so much the strength difference as the sheer size and weight you are being forced to try to move. and the added weight behind the punches yu are taking.


    Fedor beat guys no where near his skill level, when skills are closely matched size matters.

    Guys like lesnar are too big and too athletic. can you imagine BJ Penn fighting Rampage? that would be weight alomst the same difference as we are talking about here.
    I always hear little guys whining about this cr@p.
    I let coaches convince me for years that I had no chance unless i shred a good 50+lbs from my normal walk around weight.
    When i finally started throwing down with people who weighed even more than what I walk around at, I realized it wasn't half as bad as advertised.

    Fedor outstrikes gigantic K1 champs & makes brazillian bjj black belts look amateurish and inept; he gets a lot of flak for his opposition but I think Semi, HMC, and even Zulu would shock some folks if they competed in the UFC.

    Brock is a 4-1 hype job that's got his title shot after 2 legitimate victories. I can remember when Bob Sapp was the next big thing and we all know how that turned out...

    BJ Penn fought Machida at heavyweight, a guy who'll probably destroy Rampage.
    What would happen if a year-old baby fell from a fourth-floor window onto the head of a burly truck driver, standing on the sidewalk?
    It's practically certain that the truckman would be knocked unconscious. He might die of brain concussion or a broken neck.
    Even an innocent little baby can become a dangerous missile WHEN ITS BODY-WEIGHT IS SET INTO FAST MOTION.
    -Jack Dempsey ch1 pg1 Championship Fighting

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pork Chop View Post
    I always hear little guys whining about this cr@p.
    I let coaches convince me for years that I had no chance unless i shred a good 50+lbs from my normal walk around weight.
    When i finally started throwing down with people who weighed even more than what I walk around at, I realized it wasn't half as bad as advertised.

    Fedor outstrikes gigantic K1 champs & makes brazillian bjj black belts look amateurish and inept; he gets a lot of flak for his opposition but I think Semi, HMC, and even Zulu would shock some folks if they competed in the UFC.

    Brock is a 4-1 hype job that's got his title shot after 2 legitimate victories. I can remember when Bob Sapp was the next big thing and we all know how that turned out...

    BJ Penn fought Machida at heavyweight, a guy who'll probably destroy Rampage.
    You are talking about the exceptions to the rule my freind, not the rule.
    I competed in kyokushin when kyokushin was sans limited and when it was over 200 and under 200, both times I was in the 140-150 mark.
    I fought guys that outweighed me by 100lbs at times and take more word for it the difference between 150 and 250 and 200 and 300 is HUGE, sometimes people forget that.
    It never bugged me much because I was always smaller and trained with bigger, a few of my partners were:
    5-11 195
    6-4 240
    6-3 280
    6-1 230
    6-1 280
    5-8 210

    I won some and I lost some, KO'd one guy that was 80lbs heavier than me in less than 2 min.

    I have always trained with bigger and stronger, just because that was the way it was.

    BUT, dude ! The average shot from a bigger guy was harder to take than the most powerful shot from a smaller guy !
    It wasn't about whether I could take them out or hurt them, I have KO power in both hands and feet, just lucky that way, it was about being able to TAKE their shots !!

  6. #36
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    the hardest hitters i ever met were in the 150~160s
    they had crazy acceleration/explosiveness and could hit me faster than i could see it, so it hurt more
    one guy cracked our boxing coach (a light heavy) so hard, he fractured his face (cheekbone)
    another guy ended up cutting down to the 130s~140s for amateur tournaments, 2 time golden gloves state champ, knocked out this 6'7 heavyweight in an exhibition
    the other two guys were pro fighters who routinely whipped on heavyweights in training.

    i've worked with gues that outweigh even me by significant amount, and that doesn't really hurt.
    in boxing, one was pro, the other was an amateur champ; both were known for their power
    worked with a large number of big men in muay thai & san shou as well.
    you can see it coming & either get the heck out the way or brace for it.

    speed kills, especially when coupled with power.
    when tyson lost his speed, all of a sudden he looked extremely human - which is why they say he had such a short prime.

    the smaller man nullifying a size difference even when both have considerable skill may not be the rule, but it's not as uncommon as you guys are making it out to be; especially when you get to the 185 and above weight classes where people jump up or down on a monthly basis.

    not sure if you were saying there's a large difference between 200 and 300 or if you were saying that the difference between those two weights is smaller than the difference between 150 and 250. I can agree with the second statement. The first point is moot, because the 200 and 300lb guy are in the same weight class technically and don't really have any say, history doesn't seem to support this theory either. I'll give you 2 guesses as to which guy in this picture was known for his power, and which guy wasn't.

    When it comes to anderson silva, who walks into the ring very close to 200lbs even on fights at 185; i think it's not going to be that huge a difference between him and your average heavyweight who fights around 230 with no cut.
    Brock may be a bit large for him, but brock was running away from mir's standup, which is nowhere near the level of silva.
    Last edited by Pork Chop; 08-24-2009 at 03:31 PM.
    What would happen if a year-old baby fell from a fourth-floor window onto the head of a burly truck driver, standing on the sidewalk?
    It's practically certain that the truckman would be knocked unconscious. He might die of brain concussion or a broken neck.
    Even an innocent little baby can become a dangerous missile WHEN ITS BODY-WEIGHT IS SET INTO FAST MOTION.
    -Jack Dempsey ch1 pg1 Championship Fighting

  7. #37
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    Arrrrrrrrgh!!! Am i speaking a language people do not understand
    does power and strength matter yeeeeeeees yes yes yes!
    But as i repeat myself size does not equal power!!!!!!! Power equals power!!!!!

    :dsheeeeeeeeeeesh!!!!!!

    I am pork boy, the breakfast monkey.

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  8. #38
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    if the skills are at the same lvel different factors come together at who wins
    timing being one of them and speed etc etc
    ive never heard of some one winning anything simply because they were bigger its silly

    I am pork boy, the breakfast monkey.

    left leg: mild bruising. right leg: charley horse

    handsomerest member of KFM forum hands down

  9. #39
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    Fedor is a freak, and the K1 champs and BJJ black belts he fought were around his weight, I believe cro cop was about 10 pounds lighter and Nog only 10 pounds or so heavier. Apart from Silvia his big opponents have been no where near him skill wise (but then not many people are)

    And Sapp before he made so much money in Japan that he stopped caring was a threat simply because of his size, remember how he clubbed Hoost around the ring in K1, or when he lifted up Nog and power bombed him. His technique was laughable yet his sheer size and athleticism really hurt people

    Brock is a below average striker, with no submissions, and a very good wrestler (but there are lots of NCAA champs who have fought in the UFC before). The reason he is champ is because his size and athletic ability more than make up for the holes in his game.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by goju View Post
    if the skills are at the same lvel different factors come together at who wins
    timing being one of them and speed etc etc
    ive never heard of some one winning anything simply because they were bigger its silly
    Sapp beat the greatest living K! champion twice, was that due to superior technique and skill.. or because of his size?

    Is Brock a better striker or a much better wrestler than Randy (who was an alternate for the Olympic squad)? No but he sure as hell was bigger

    Did GSP dominate BJ just because of his ground skills, or did him being naturally bigger and stronger help?

    Was Tim Silvia a great MMA fighter who beat monson and alovski and won the UFC title because of his great technique, or because he was a freak at close to 6 foot 9 and 265 pounds

    I can go on and on but there are weight categories in fighting sports for a reason

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    Sapp beat the greatest living K! champion twice, was that due to superior technique and skill.. or because of his size?

    Is Brock a better striker or a much better wrestler than Randy (who was an alternate for the Olympic squad)? No but he sure as hell was bigger

    Did GSP dominate BJ just because of his ground skills, or did him being naturally bigger and stronger help?

    Was Tim Silvia a great MMA fighter who beat monson and alovski and won the UFC title because of his great technique, or because he was a freak at close to 6 foot 9 and 265 pounds

    I can go on and on but there are weight categories in fighting sports for a reason

    Correctumondo.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pork Chop View Post
    the hardest hitters i ever met were in the 150~160s
    they had crazy acceleration/explosiveness and could hit me faster than i could see it, so it hurt more
    one guy cracked our boxing coach (a light heavy) so hard, he fractured his face (cheekbone)
    another guy ended up cutting down to the 130s~140s for amateur tournaments, 2 time golden gloves state champ, knocked out this 6'7 heavyweight in an exhibition
    the other two guys were pro fighters who routinely whipped on heavyweights in training.

    i've worked with gues that outweigh even me by significant amount, and that doesn't really hurt.
    in boxing, one was pro, the other was an amateur champ; both were known for their power
    worked with a large number of big men in muay thai & san shou as well.
    you can see it coming & either get the heck out the way or brace for it.

    speed kills, especially when coupled with power.
    when tyson lost his speed, all of a sudden he looked extremely human - which is why they say he had such a short prime.

    the smaller man nullifying a size difference even when both have considerable skill may not be the rule, but it's not as uncommon as you guys are making it out to be; especially when you get to the 185 and above weight classes where people jump up or down on a monthly basis.

    not sure if you were saying there's a large difference between 200 and 300 or if you were saying that the difference between those two weights is smaller than the difference between 150 and 250. I can agree with the second statement. The first point is moot, because the 200 and 300lb guy are in the same weight class technically and don't really have any say, history doesn't seem to support this theory either. I'll give you 2 guesses as to which guy in this picture was known for his power, and which guy wasn't.

    When it comes to anderson silva, who walks into the ring very close to 200lbs even on fights at 185; i think it's not going to be that huge a difference between him and your average heavyweight who fights around 230 with no cut.
    Brock may be a bit large for him, but brock was running away from mir's standup, which is nowhere near the level of silva.
    Bigger people can take more punishment, this is a fact, you can even look up the stats on the SAE website ( it does crash tests studies and such).
    In regards to what you mentioned about the strongest hitters being in the 150-160 class, not sure I agree, but you may be correct, in the study I was involved in in which the force of different MA were compared, the guys in the 160-180 area consistenlt produced the higher results, though not the highest.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    Sapp beat the greatest living K! champion twice, was that due to superior technique and skill.. or because of his size?

    Is Brock a better striker or a much better wrestler than Randy (who was an alternate for the Olympic squad)? No but he sure as hell was bigger

    Did GSP dominate BJ just because of his ground skills, or did him being naturally bigger and stronger help?

    Was Tim Silvia a great MMA fighter who beat monson and alovski and won the UFC title because of his great technique, or because he was a freak at close to 6 foot 9 and 265 pounds

    I can go on and on but there are weight categories in fighting sports for a reason
    now you're just getting ret@rded

    sapp cheated in both fights, and hoost was basically washed up by then - not to mention the second fight was called as soon as sapp landed ONE punch.

    Randy was out wrestling brock and randy's always been susceptible to wild hay-makers, just look at his record. Your "superior size and athleticism" point is entirely moot considering a 45 year old dinosaur gave Brock all he could handle until landing that shot.

    Tim silvia stayed on his horse the whole time against monson and just pecked away with jabs. I'm surprised you would even mention that fight. Arlovski makes dumb mistakes when he gets excited - see fedor fight.

    GSP has better wrestling than BJ - he trains with the candian national team.

    To wit, let me counter point...
    Was Mirko bigger when he shattered Sapp's orbital bone?
    Was Mercer bigger when he practically put Sylvia in a coma?
    Was BJ bigger when he choked out matt hughes in the opening seconds of the 1st round of their 1st fight?
    See? I can go on and on about smaller fighters destroying bigger ones just as long as you can.
    What would happen if a year-old baby fell from a fourth-floor window onto the head of a burly truck driver, standing on the sidewalk?
    It's practically certain that the truckman would be knocked unconscious. He might die of brain concussion or a broken neck.
    Even an innocent little baby can become a dangerous missile WHEN ITS BODY-WEIGHT IS SET INTO FAST MOTION.
    -Jack Dempsey ch1 pg1 Championship Fighting

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Bigger people can take more punishment, this is a fact, you can even look up the stats on the SAE website ( it does crash tests studies and such).
    In regards to what you mentioned about the strongest hitters being in the 150-160 class, not sure I agree, but you may be correct, in the study I was involved in in which the force of different MA were compared, the guys in the 160-180 area consistenlt produced the higher results, though not the highest.
    They can take more punishment, more importantly they DO take more punishment as there's a limit to how mobile you can be when you weigh as much as these heavyweights weigh.
    The Dempsey-Willard fights should be required viewing for any little guy going in to fight a big guy.

    Jeff Lacey (a 160~168lb fighter) out punched all fellow olympic heavyweights back when he was on the team.
    What would happen if a year-old baby fell from a fourth-floor window onto the head of a burly truck driver, standing on the sidewalk?
    It's practically certain that the truckman would be knocked unconscious. He might die of brain concussion or a broken neck.
    Even an innocent little baby can become a dangerous missile WHEN ITS BODY-WEIGHT IS SET INTO FAST MOTION.
    -Jack Dempsey ch1 pg1 Championship Fighting

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pork Chop View Post
    now you're just getting ret@rded

    sapp cheated in both fights, and hoost was basically washed up by then - not to mention the second fight was called as soon as sapp landed ONE punch.

    Randy was out wrestling brock and randy's always been susceptible to wild hay-makers, just look at his record. Your "superior size and athleticism" point is entirely moot considering a 45 year old dinosaur gave Brock all he could handle until landing that shot.

    Tim silvia stayed on his horse the whole time against monson and just pecked away with jabs. I'm surprised you would even mention that fight. Arlovski makes dumb mistakes when he gets excited - see fedor fight.

    GSP has better wrestling than BJ - he trains with the candian national team.

    To wit, let me counter point...
    Was Mirko bigger when he shattered Sapp's orbital bone?
    Was Mercer bigger when he practically put Sylvia in a coma?
    Was BJ bigger when he choked out matt hughes in the opening seconds of the 1st round of their 1st fight?
    See? I can go on and on about smaller fighters destroying bigger ones just as long as you can.
    Yes randy was outwrestling Brock, but he couldn’t do finish him, what do you think kept Brock in the fight and let him eventually win, it was his size advantage. If he and randy had weighed the same would the fight have even been close?

    GSP has better wrestling, but BJ has fought good wrestlers before, I feel it was his superior strength and size that allowed him to put his wrestling to good use.

    I agree you can point to smaller fighters beating bigger fighters (usually but not always when there is a skill difference, cro cop v sapp for example), my point was in response to the poster who said they had never heard of a fighter winning simply due to size advantage, my point is this happens and its why Brock is champion. If he walked around at 220 pounds for his fights do you think he would have won any of them?

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